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 Da-Rock wrote:
What, if anything, changed on the Primaris Lieutenant with the Space Marine Codex from the Index?

They went up one PL. And ganed the option to swap out the MC auto-bolt rifle for a MC stalker bolt rifle.

Points remain the same.

Do you think power swords on intercessor sergeants are worth it? I'm really tight on point and would have to trim somewhere for it.
I feel like there'd be times you're really glad you have them, but not sure.

How often do your intercessors get into close combat with stuff that a power sword helps against?

With the Intercessor's great range, I don't think they'll need the sword. But if your opponent is keen on taking a lot of assault marines you might need it just for coverage.

It's probably worth more if you take the auto bolt rifles and move closer to the enemy.

Danny slag wrote:
Do you think power swords on intercessor sergeants are worth it? I'm really tight on point and would have to trim somewhere for it.
I feel like there'd be times you're really glad you have them, but not sure.

the extra attack is more valuable vs say chucking it on a normal marine sarge. but its a situation where its not really that worth it depending on how you are using them. if they get into combat alot as mentioned than its worth it. otherwise its points that are sitting on the table doing nothing.

I think the power sword on intercessors is an auto-take. I'd never leave home without it.

The cost is negligible and it makes a real difference. Intercessors are in fact a pretty decent assault unit. Having two attacks and two wounds mean they are actually able to hold their own against even some dedicated assault units. I recently had a squad of 5 and my librarian get charged by 9 of seekers of slaanesh, and it was my guys who were standing at the end. Hitting on 3s, wounding on 3s and the seekers only having a 5++ meant that I did them quite a lot of wounds.

As it happens the power sword wouldn't have helped much there. It will do much more against people in power armour.

I'm actually thinking of running my intercessors in squads of 10. It would give me the option of using them as a beatstick against puny enemies, like eldar, daemons, chaos marines and the like. I suppose I'd have to steer clear of characters, or have my contemptors squish them.

Mandragola wrote:
I think the power sword on intercessors is an auto-take. I'd never leave home without it.

The cost is negligible and it makes a real difference. Intercessors are in fact a pretty decent assault unit. Having two attacks and two wounds mean they are actually able to hold their own against even some dedicated assault units. I recently had a squad of 5 and my librarian get charged by 9 of seekers of slaanesh, and it was my guys who were standing at the end. Hitting on 3s, wounding on 3s and the seekers only having a 5++ meant that I did them quite a lot of wounds.

As it happens the power sword wouldn't have helped much there. It will do much more against people in power armour.

I'm actually thinking of running my intercessors in squads of 10. It would give me the option of using them as a beatstick against puny enemies, like eldar, daemons, chaos marines and the like. I suppose I'd have to steer clear of characters, or have my contemptors squish them.

Powerswords are worthless on intercessors, regardless of points. It does add up and it may matter when list building. If your intercessors are in CC, its cause you got charged. They should never be charging as their double tap is vastly better.

10 Mans as a beatstick is also a terrible idea, as why not just take reivers for more CC ability. They are not beatsticks. All the "puny" enemies you listed have vastly better CC options to shred marines to nothing then primaris has...



Anyways here is my list I plan to do Friday for Konor Campaign. Not sure on mission as its currently being changed/uploaded but I plan to try out some new stuff

Game is 2k points

HQ:
Primaris Chaplain - Rides in Repulsor
Primaris Libarian - Might of Heroes, Physic Fortress - Rides in Repulsior

Troop:
10 Intercessor - 2 Launchers Bolt Rifles. Deploys combat squaded
10 Intercessor - 2 Launchers Bolt Rifles. Deploys combat squaded
10 Intercessor - 2 Launchers Bolt Rifles. Deploys combat squaded

Elities:
3 Aggressors - Full dakka
Primaris ancient
8 Reivers - Combat blades - Rides in Repulsor

Heavy:
6 Hellblasters - Rapid Blasters

DT:
Repulsor - Ironhail HS, 2 Krackstorm, Twin HB, H Onslaught, Onslaught, 5 Fragstorm

LOW:
Robby G

Idea (again might vastly change based on konor mission) is to be aggressive. Intercessors hold the flank , repulsor drives up, unloads hopefully with Robby in range for rerolls. Hellblasters follow him up, unloading on any heavy armor. Second turn, jump the libby, chap, and reivers out. Cast Might of heroes on Robby, Fortress on who's nearest to the physkers.. Grenade then charge with chap and hopefully murder the unit. I fully expect them to disappoint, but figure its worth a try to get a verdict on the reivers.

 Vertrucio wrote:
How often do your intercessors get into close combat with stuff that a power sword helps against?

With the Intercessor's great range, I don't think they'll need the sword. But if your opponent is keen on taking a lot of assault marines you might need it just for coverage.

It's probably worth more if you take the auto bolt rifles and move closer to the enemy.

Normally the enemy is charging me - and intercessors are actually decent in CC with 2 attacks each. Giving the sarge a power weapon really boost their potential in CC.

str00dles1 wrote:

Mandragola wrote:
I think the power sword on intercessors is an auto-take. I'd never leave home without it.

The cost is negligible and it makes a real difference. Intercessors are in fact a pretty decent assault unit. Having two attacks and two wounds mean they are actually able to hold their own against even some dedicated assault units. I recently had a squad of 5 and my librarian get charged by 9 of seekers of slaanesh, and it was my guys who were standing at the end. Hitting on 3s, wounding on 3s and the seekers only having a 5++ meant that I did them quite a lot of wounds.

As it happens the power sword wouldn't have helped much there. It will do much more against people in power armour.

I'm actually thinking of running my intercessors in squads of 10. It would give me the option of using them as a beatstick against puny enemies, like eldar, daemons, chaos marines and the like. I suppose I'd have to steer clear of characters, or have my contemptors squish them.

Powerswords are worthless on intercessors, regardless of points. It does add up and it may matter when list building. If your intercessors are in CC, its cause you got charged. They should never be charging as their double tap is vastly better.

10 Mans as a beatstick is also a terrible idea, as why not just take reivers for more CC ability. They are not beatsticks. All the "puny" enemies you listed have vastly better CC options to shred marines to nothing then primaris has...



Anyways here is my list I plan to do Friday for Konor Campaign. Not sure on mission as its currently being changed/uploaded but I plan to try out some new stuff

Game is 2k points

HQ:
Primaris Chaplain - Rides in Repulsor
Primaris Libarian - Might of Heroes, Physic Fortress - Rides in Repulsior

Troop:
10 Intercessor - 2 Launchers Bolt Rifles. Deploys combat squaded
10 Intercessor - 2 Launchers Bolt Rifles. Deploys combat squaded
10 Intercessor - 2 Launchers Bolt Rifles. Deploys combat squaded

Elities:
3 Aggressors - Full dakka
Primaris ancient
8 Reivers - Combat blades - Rides in Repulsor

Heavy:
6 Hellblasters - Rapid Blasters

DT:
Repulsor - Ironhail HS, 2 Krackstorm, Twin HB, H Onslaught, Onslaught, 5 Fragstorm

LOW:
Robby G

Idea (again might vastly change based on konor mission) is to be aggressive. Intercessors hold the flank , repulsor drives up, unloads hopefully with Robby in range for rerolls. Hellblasters follow him up, unloading on any heavy armor. Second turn, jump the libby, chap, and reivers out. Cast Might of heroes on Robby, Fortress on who's nearest to the physkers.. Grenade then charge with chap and hopefully murder the unit. I fully expect them to disappoint, but figure its worth a try to get a verdict on the reivers.

I feel you may have trouble with heavy armour, but that's just a hunch. Where are your Aggressors during this? Just sitting back letting those power fists and that mobility go to waste? Lots of good dakka there, though.

Mandragola wrote:
I think the power sword on intercessors is an auto-take. I'd never leave home without it.

The cost is negligible and it makes a real difference. Intercessors are in fact a pretty decent assault unit. Having two attacks and two wounds mean they are actually able to hold their own against even some dedicated assault units. I recently had a squad of 5 and my librarian get charged by 9 of seekers of slaanesh, and it was my guys who were standing at the end. Hitting on 3s, wounding on 3s and the seekers only having a 5++ meant that I did them quite a lot of wounds.

As it happens the power sword wouldn't have helped much there. It will do much more against people in power armour.

I'm actually thinking of running my intercessors in squads of 10. It would give me the option of using them as a beatstick against puny enemies, like eldar, daemons, chaos marines and the like. I suppose I'd have to steer clear of characters, or have my contemptors squish them.

Reapers might do that a little bit better. Even if you give them carbines they are still cheaper - have better bolter pistols - and they have the same stat line.

Lemondish wrote:

str00dles1 wrote:

Mandragola wrote:
I think the power sword on intercessors is an auto-take. I'd never leave home without it.

The cost is negligible and it makes a real difference. Intercessors are in fact a pretty decent assault unit. Having two attacks and two wounds mean they are actually able to hold their own against even some dedicated assault units. I recently had a squad of 5 and my librarian get charged by 9 of seekers of slaanesh, and it was my guys who were standing at the end. Hitting on 3s, wounding on 3s and the seekers only having a 5++ meant that I did them quite a lot of wounds.

As it happens the power sword wouldn't have helped much there. It will do much more against people in power armour.

I'm actually thinking of running my intercessors in squads of 10. It would give me the option of using them as a beatstick against puny enemies, like eldar, daemons, chaos marines and the like. I suppose I'd have to steer clear of characters, or have my contemptors squish them.

Powerswords are worthless on intercessors, regardless of points. It does add up and it may matter when list building. If your intercessors are in CC, its cause you got charged. They should never be charging as their double tap is vastly better.

10 Mans as a beatstick is also a terrible idea, as why not just take reivers for more CC ability. They are not beatsticks. All the "puny" enemies you listed have vastly better CC options to shred marines to nothing then primaris has...



Anyways here is my list I plan to do Friday for Konor Campaign. Not sure on mission as its currently being changed/uploaded but I plan to try out some new stuff

Game is 2k points

HQ:
Primaris Chaplain - Rides in Repulsor
Primaris Libarian - Might of Heroes, Physic Fortress - Rides in Repulsior

Troop:
10 Intercessor - 2 Launchers Bolt Rifles. Deploys combat squaded
10 Intercessor - 2 Launchers Bolt Rifles. Deploys combat squaded
10 Intercessor - 2 Launchers Bolt Rifles. Deploys combat squaded

Elities:
3 Aggressors - Full dakka
Primaris ancient
8 Reivers - Combat blades - Rides in Repulsor

Heavy:
6 Hellblasters - Rapid Blasters

DT:
Repulsor - Ironhail HS, 2 Krackstorm, Twin HB, H Onslaught, Onslaught, 5 Fragstorm

LOW:
Robby G

Idea (again might vastly change based on konor mission) is to be aggressive. Intercessors hold the flank , repulsor drives up, unloads hopefully with Robby in range for rerolls. Hellblasters follow him up, unloading on any heavy armor. Second turn, jump the libby, chap, and reivers out. Cast Might of heroes on Robby, Fortress on who's nearest to the physkers.. Grenade then charge with chap and hopefully murder the unit. I fully expect them to disappoint, but figure its worth a try to get a verdict on the reivers.

I feel you may have trouble with heavy armour, but that's just a hunch. Where are your Aggressors during this? Just sitting back letting those power fists and that mobility go to waste? Lots of good dakka there, though.

They are waddling up near robby aswell, advancing when they can til they get to around the enter of the table in cover then sitting for double dakka.

Usually yea a lot of armor might be an issue. Local meta though seems to be more in the take mass infantry as its more durable then a lot of tanks for the same thing and doesent degrade. My nurgle opponent for the next mission takes a lot of heavy weapon teams so hoping the mass amount of small arms can shred through anything to dangerous

 Xenomancers wrote:

Mandragola wrote:
I think the power sword on intercessors is an auto-take. I'd never leave home without it.

The cost is negligible and it makes a real difference. Intercessors are in fact a pretty decent assault unit. Having two attacks and two wounds mean they are actually able to hold their own against even some dedicated assault units. I recently had a squad of 5 and my librarian get charged by 9 of seekers of slaanesh, and it was my guys who were standing at the end. Hitting on 3s, wounding on 3s and the seekers only having a 5++ meant that I did them quite a lot of wounds.

As it happens the power sword wouldn't have helped much there. It will do much more against people in power armour.

I'm actually thinking of running my intercessors in squads of 10. It would give me the option of using them as a beatstick against puny enemies, like eldar, daemons, chaos marines and the like. I suppose I'd have to steer clear of characters, or have my contemptors squish them.

Reapers might do that a little bit better. Even if you give them carbines they are still cheaper - have better bolter pistols - and they have the same stat line.

...but no power swords. Otherwise, that's a very good point.

I'm not sure I agree that their weapons are better actually. Bolt rifles obviously outclass heavy bolt pistols at any range, and bolt carbines at most ranges.

Reivers with bolt carbines are clearly better than intercessors with assault bolters though. 3 points cheaper and several extra abilities. Carbine reivers look to me like a pretty good unit all-round, though I do like the -1AP of bolt rifles, and the auxiliary grenade launchers.

str00dles1 wrote:
Powerswords are worthless on intercessors, regardless of points. It does add up and it may matter when list building. If your intercessors are in CC, its cause you got charged. They should never be charging as their double tap is vastly better.

10 Mans as a beatstick is also a terrible idea, as why not just take reivers for more CC ability. They are not beatsticks. All the "puny" enemies you listed have vastly better CC options to shred marines to nothing then primaris has...

Nope. If my intercessors are in combat and I charged, then it means that they charged something. Often, I'll do this to prevent them from charging me.

There's nothing at all stopping me double-tapping something with my bolt rifles and then charging it.

I deliberately listed a bunch of units that you'd expect to beat Primaris marines in combat, but which may well fail to do so. Consider bloodletters, for example. They do huge damage on the charge but have only T3, a 5++ and one wound. Do you wait and let them charge you, or do you shoot them, charge in, strike first with 21 S4 attacks and kill 6 of them before they attack? Bloodletters cost slightly under 50% of the price of primaris. If you get to rapid fire at 15" away, then again before you charge in, you'll have a decent chance of killing about two bloodletters for each primaris marine before they get to attack.

Chaos marines flat out lose to Primaris in cc, point for point, with the possible exception of berzerkers and other specialised assault units. Plague marines are a joke, costing more than intercessors. Charging rubric marines will prevent them from firing their horrible bolters (though is not advised against the ones with flamers, except from outside their range).

Often, after you fire at a unit there will only be a few guys left. But they will always tend to include the plasma gun, sergeant with combi-bolter and so on. By charging in you can finish those guys off, or at least lock them in combat so they can't shoot you in their turn.

Charging things with intercessors is not always going to be a good idea. Sometimes there will be scary things nearby that will counterattack. Sometimes you're on an objective... but sometimes the enemy are. The 10-man unit idea is just something I'm toying with. Arguably two 5-man squads would be better, not least because each would come with a sergeant with power sword. A unit of auto-bolter reivers does sound like something I ought to seriously consider taking.

If I'm reading this correctly, the Power Sword replaces the Sergeant's gun, right?

Reivers with combat knives are just brutal. I'm hoping GW gets around to creating those Warmachine style "weapon attachment" packs I suspect they'll be doing sooner than later.

 Vertrucio wrote:
If I'm reading this correctly, the Power Sword replaces the Sergeant's gun, right?

Wait, what? Ok in that case forget it. Crazy thing to do.

Intercessors are still ok in combat, but hell no.

It just says the intercessor Sergent can take a power sword

nothing on replacing.

Ok cool. That's what I thought, but I'm AFB right now. Phew.

 Xenomancers wrote:

Mandragola wrote:
I think the power sword on intercessors is an auto-take. I'd never leave home without it.

The cost is negligible and it makes a real difference. Intercessors are in fact a pretty decent assault unit. Having two attacks and two wounds mean they are actually able to hold their own against even some dedicated assault units. I recently had a squad of 5 and my librarian get charged by 9 of seekers of slaanesh, and it was my guys who were standing at the end. Hitting on 3s, wounding on 3s and the seekers only having a 5++ meant that I did them quite a lot of wounds.

As it happens the power sword wouldn't have helped much there. It will do much more against people in power armour.

I'm actually thinking of running my intercessors in squads of 10. It would give me the option of using them as a beatstick against puny enemies, like eldar, daemons, chaos marines and the like. I suppose I'd have to steer clear of characters, or have my contemptors squish them.

Reapers might do that a little bit better. Even if you give them carbines they are still cheaper - have better bolter pistols - and they have the same stat line.

My thinking on the power sword thing is mainly for facing off against the often played tau, but more broadly against any gun line match ups in a TAC list. Can't really out gun line some of them, might be better to play super aggressive at that point. Or when taking a charge to dish out a bit more damage.

This really only applies if you don't know who you're going to be up against ahead of time and just looking for a game. I haven't tried it, so wondering if it makes enough of a difference to kitbash my three half assembled intercessor squad sergeants swords.

Unfortunately in the case of the list I've been painting up those 12 points would mean having to drop a CCW/assault cannon dred to something like a plasma/missile dred. It's pleasantly surprising how tight the point values seem so far in 8th, usually different options add up to very similar points if not exactly so it's easier to make modular lists.

Good to hear both of these opinions, thanks

Danny slag wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

Mandragola wrote:
I think the power sword on intercessors is an auto-take. I'd never leave home without it.

The cost is negligible and it makes a real difference. Intercessors are in fact a pretty decent assault unit. Having two attacks and two wounds mean they are actually able to hold their own against even some dedicated assault units. I recently had a squad of 5 and my librarian get charged by 9 of seekers of slaanesh, and it was my guys who were standing at the end. Hitting on 3s, wounding on 3s and the seekers only having a 5++ meant that I did them quite a lot of wounds.

As it happens the power sword wouldn't have helped much there. It will do much more against people in power armour.

I'm actually thinking of running my intercessors in squads of 10. It would give me the option of using them as a beatstick against puny enemies, like eldar, daemons, chaos marines and the like. I suppose I'd have to steer clear of characters, or have my contemptors squish them.

Reapers might do that a little bit better. Even if you give them carbines they are still cheaper - have better bolter pistols - and they have the same stat line.

My thinking on the power sword thing is mainly for facing off against the often played tau, but more broadly against any gun line match ups in a TAC list. Can't really out gun line some of them, might be better to play super aggressive at that point. Or when taking a charge to dish out a bit more damage.

This really only applies if you don't know who you're going to be up against ahead of time and just looking for a game. I haven't tried it, so wondering if it makes enough of a difference to kitbash my three half assembled intercessor squad sergeants swords.

Unfortunately in the case of the list I've been painting up those 12 points would mean having to drop a CCW/assault cannon dred to something like a plasma/missile dred. It's pleasantly surprising how tight the point values seem so far in 8th, usually different options add up to very similar points if not exactly so it's easier to make modular lists.

Good to hear both of these opinions, thanks

First thing: I checked and the sergeant can definitely just take a power sword. It doesn't replace anything.

I play Tau as well, and honestly they are not who I was thinking of in relation to the intercessor power sword. If intercessors make contact with Tau then the Tau will be crushed, regardless of the sword. Or they'll be big suits that ignore anything less than power fists, then hop away and shoot you.

Instead, I'm talking about using Intercessors to beat up other people's infantry. My point is that intercessors' 2 S4 attacks are very like the 2 S4 attacks that an assault marine gets. By not using them, you lose out on a substantial part of the unit's value.

With or without the power sword, there will be times when it's a good idea to charge things with intercessors. My experience is that they do better than you'd think against many opponents, thanks to their durability and 2 attacks.

Finally, try and fit in a contemptor if you can instead of a normal dread. I realise neither is primaris, but contemtors are far superior to normal dreads, in my experience. That would require chopping your list around loads, so don't sweat if it's not possible.

Raven Guard are the best Chapter for Primaris. Despite their 2 wounds and sometimes T5 Primaris models still die quick. Lots of multi dmg weapons out there. Primaris marines need something to protect them and facilitate an alpha. The repulsor is super expensive and in an all Primaris list you wont be left with much else after a couple of those with a couple of full units.Raven Guard provide both.

This is the list I'm going to try out:

Battalion

Primaris Captain w/ stalker bolt rifle
Primaris Lieutenant w/ stalker bolt rifle

Redemptor Dread w/ Macro Incinerator
Redemptor Dread w/ Macro Incinerator

10 Intercessors w/ bolt rifle
10 Intercessors w/ bolt rifle

**this detachment forms the fire base and hunker down in cover while benefiting from the raven guard chapter tactic. Depending on the enemy, lieutenant may run up to give the reroll benefit to the hellblasters when they come down**

Vanguard Detachment

Shrike

Primaris Ancient w/ Banner of the Emperor Ascendent
Primaris Apothecary
Primaris Apothecary

10 Hellblasters w/ Plasma Incinerators
10 Hellblasters w/ Plasma Incinerators

**this detachment is all about the alpha. Ancient and apothecaries deploy normally and when the hellblasters are ready to come down, they run up to lend assistance**

murph87 wrote:
Raven Guard are the best Chapter for Primaris. Despite their 2 wounds and sometimes T5 Primaris models still die quick. Lots of multi dmg weapons out there. Primaris marines need something to protect them and facilitate an alpha. The repulsor is super expensive and in an all Primaris list you wont be left with much else after a couple of those with a couple of full units.Raven Guard provide both.

This is the list I'm going to try out:

Battalion

Primaris Captain w/ stalker bolt rifle
Primaris Lieutenant w/ stalker bolt rifle

Redemptor Dread w/ Macro Incinerator
Redemptor Dread w/ Macro Incinerator

10 Intercessors w/ bolt rifle
10 Intercessors w/ bolt rifle

**this detachment forms the fire base and hunker down in cover while benefiting from the raven guard chapter tactic. Depending on the enemy, lieutenant may run up to give the reroll benefit to the hellblasters when they come down**

Vanguard Detachment

Shrike

Primaris Ancient w/ Banner of the Emperor Ascendent
Primaris Apothecary
Primaris Apothecary

10 Hellblasters w/ Plasma Incinerators
10 Hellblasters w/ Plasma Incinerators

**this detachment is all about the alpha. Ancient and apothecaries deploy normally and when the hellblasters are ready to come down, they run up to lend assistance**

I think you need another troops choice to hit the Battalion requirement, right?

I also want to bring up that an IF gunline is pretty resilient as well. They get the benefit of cover when others do not while the Warlord trait means you're stuck in there even deeper for anything that isn't relatively immobile. While you're plinking those units from range as if they're out in the open, you can drop some Reivers or challenge with some Aggressors to move the carnage upfield. Stick some Intercessors and Hellblasters next to that Ancient in an Imperial Defence Line and you're benefiting from +2 LD to basically eliminate morale issues if they do try and focus you down. Overcharge away - if you do end up blowing yourself up, the Ancient will help secure another extra shot. One of the Apothecaries keeps the show going. If they're trying to focus on shifting that core, they'll need to put a heavy focus on it, which means less hate for anything else.

Very similar to RG CT in strat, but I think a bit more resilient. -1 to hit on a slow firing weapon is a big deal, but less impactful for something that's designed to munch through infantry by firing a boatload of shots. While RG helps you for both, IF helps you by hard countering the stuff your Primaris marines are much more likely to be shot with, which means you now have a much wider array of threats and you're forcing your enemy to prioritize targets with weapons that they otherwise wouldn't use.

Mandragola wrote:

Danny slag wrote:

 Xenomancers wrote:

Mandragola wrote:
I think the power sword on intercessors is an auto-take. I'd never leave home without it.

The cost is negligible and it makes a real difference. Intercessors are in fact a pretty decent assault unit. Having two attacks and two wounds mean they are actually able to hold their own against even some dedicated assault units. I recently had a squad of 5 and my librarian get charged by 9 of seekers of slaanesh, and it was my guys who were standing at the end. Hitting on 3s, wounding on 3s and the seekers only having a 5++ meant that I did them quite a lot of wounds.

As it happens the power sword wouldn't have helped much there. It will do much more against people in power armour.

I'm actually thinking of running my intercessors in squads of 10. It would give me the option of using them as a beatstick against puny enemies, like eldar, daemons, chaos marines and the like. I suppose I'd have to steer clear of characters, or have my contemptors squish them.

Reapers might do that a little bit better. Even if you give them carbines they are still cheaper - have better bolter pistols - and they have the same stat line.

My thinking on the power sword thing is mainly for facing off against the often played tau, but more broadly against any gun line match ups in a TAC list. Can't really out gun line some of them, might be better to play super aggressive at that point. Or when taking a charge to dish out a bit more damage.

This really only applies if you don't know who you're going to be up against ahead of time and just looking for a game. I haven't tried it, so wondering if it makes enough of a difference to kitbash my three half assembled intercessor squad sergeants swords.

Unfortunately in the case of the list I've been painting up those 12 points would mean having to drop a CCW/assault cannon dred to something like a plasma/missile dred. It's pleasantly surprising how tight the point values seem so far in 8th, usually different options add up to very similar points if not exactly so it's easier to make modular lists.

Good to hear both of these opinions, thanks

First thing: I checked and the sergeant can definitely just take a power sword. It doesn't replace anything.

I play Tau as well, and honestly they are not who I was thinking of in relation to the intercessor power sword. If intercessors make contact with Tau then the Tau will be crushed, regardless of the sword. Or they'll be big suits that ignore anything less than power fists, then hop away and shoot you.

Instead, I'm talking about using Intercessors to beat up other people's infantry. My point is that intercessors' 2 S4 attacks are very like the 2 S4 attacks that an assault marine gets. By not using them, you lose out on a substantial part of the unit's value.

With or without the power sword, there will be times when it's a good idea to charge things with intercessors. My experience is that they do better than you'd think against many opponents, thanks to their durability and 2 attacks.

Finally, try and fit in a contemptor if you can instead of a normal dread. I realise neither is primaris, but contemtors are far superior to normal dreads, in my experience. That would require chopping your list around loads, so don't sweat if it's not possible.

Thank you for the advice. I hadn't really looked at the contemptor yet, but it does look juicy now. I feel like dreads don't look out of place in an all primaris army so I'm all good with that. They also seem to fill a needed AT role.

murph87 wrote:
Raven Guard are the best Chapter for Primaris.

Best? No. They are good.

Ultramarines still hold that just because of Roboute. Til another primarch comes out, I don't see that changing.

On another note, I did try out my Repulsor with 8 Reivers CC with Libby and Chaplain in it.

Repulsor was smited to death pretty quickly. Got 2 turns of dakka before dead. It would have lasted a ton longer if I could make had the libby outside, casting Fortress and MoH on it. So was a learning lesson. Otherwise it did ok. Still 300 points for 24 HB shots and 5d6 bolter shots. It was near roboute so I guess that's only reason it did ok. Reivers charged, stunning a havoc squad with chaplain. 9 guys vs 5 havoc marines and didn't kill them. I get people say they are cheap objective takers with gravchutes, but id rather have intercessors for the bolt rifle, better gun and the -1 AP is really needed. Unless they somehow give reivers -1 AP on blades, I see no reason to ever bring them in a list again. After that though, the primaris chaplain kicked some butt and murdered a lot.

My take?

CT: Ravenguard, ultras don't really do much considering this is a very long range kitey army. The only other ones worth looking at are maaaaybeeee if. Also the ravenguard Strategem is the best way to use agressors.(Assumes no girlyman).

Units:

Hellblasters: mandatory
Repulsor: 1 mandatory, only use it as a transport to go first. Otherwise you're really just wasting time you could be shooting.
Redemptor: Solid, best with the ravenguard CT
Intercessors: give em stalkers and pretend they're snipers, again best with RG.
Inceptors: meh, very pricey for a one and done. Depends on the list, benefit most from IF and least from UM.
Aggressors: brutal with low drops so you can use the RG strat to deepstrike. Otherwise pack them into repulsors. Probably always want to use the 18" range guns which is a bit sad.
Reivers: Yawn.
Lietenant: Solid bit boring, burning blade if you can spare it.
Gravis captain: Slow, pricey, armor indomitus if you can spare it.
Librarian: Nullzone is awesome for the -4 plasma, good luck actually getting it off somewhere it matters.
Apoth: great, synergizes with ancient.
Ancient: Almost mandatory, take standard every time.
Chaplain: Yeah right, no thanks, pass.

If you do ravenguard Shrike is amazing for inceptors, aggressors, or even you're gunline redemptors/repulsors.

I think salamanders are underrated. Their characters and dreadnoughts in particular are excellent. It's a good ct for plasma squads too.

I don't think the ravenguard ct does all that much for redemptprs, as they will usually want to be near the enemy.

I think there's a use for all of the CTs. The ravenguard one certainly seems best straight off, but it does very little against an assault rushing army. Ultramarines are kind of the opposite - perfect for the counter-punch. Salamanders and iron hands have great dreadnoughts, especially with the IH stratagem making the plasma option on the redemptor somewhat viable. White scar aggressors become as mobile as inceptors, and they can have very mobile infantry too. Black templars are all about the deep strike alpha charges.

I actually think that CTs are pretty successful as a piece of game design. They make you want to field infantry, not just predators and storm ravens.

One interesting thing. The intercessor kit doesn't actually include power swords - or at least I can't see any on the sprues and the description doesn't mention them. This is a break from the policy so far of only giving units options that are in their actual box.

I'm lumping the Contemptor as one of those models related to, but not primaris. For Salamanders, it's the only way to get a melta weapon.

str00dles1 wrote:

murph87 wrote:
Raven Guard are the best Chapter for Primaris.

Best? No. They are good.

Ultramarines still hold that just because of Roboute. Til another primarch comes out, I don't see that changing.

On another note, I did try out my Repulsor with 8 Reivers CC with Libby and Chaplain in it.

Repulsor was smited to death pretty quickly. Got 2 turns of dakka before dead. It would have lasted a ton longer if I could make had the libby outside, casting Fortress and MoH on it. So was a learning lesson. Otherwise it did ok. Still 300 points for 24 HB shots and 5d6 bolter shots. It was near roboute so I guess that's only reason it did ok. Reivers charged, stunning a havoc squad with chaplain. 9 guys vs 5 havoc marines and didn't kill them. I get people say they are cheap objective takers with gravchutes, but id rather have intercessors for the bolt rifle, better gun and the -1 AP is really needed. Unless they somehow give reivers -1 AP on blades, I see no reason to ever bring them in a list again. After that though, the primaris chaplain kicked some butt and murdered a lot.

Did you know it's almost 200pts for 8 devestators with HBs, it takes another 9 marines to average the bolters shots it outputs, So to just duplicate the exact firepower, it takes more points to standard marines, so basically you are getting everything else the repulsor brings, for free. I think it's a very viable. It's funny, it actually only has one less wounds then all those space marines as well, but double the toughness. I'm not quite a fan of the Quad-lascannon version, but hey, to each his own.

Mandragola wrote:
I think salamanders are underrated. Their characters and dreadnoughts in particular are excellent. It's a good ct for plasma squads too.

I don't think the ravenguard ct does all that much for redemptprs, as they will usually want to be near the enemy.

I think there's a use for all of the CTs. The ravenguard one certainly seems best straight off, but it does very little against an assault rushing army. Ultramarines are kind of the opposite - perfect for the counter-punch. Salamanders and iron hands have great dreadnoughts, especially with the IH stratagem making the plasma option on the redemptor somewhat viable. White scar aggressors become as mobile as inceptors, and they can have very mobile infantry too. Black templars are all about the deep strike alpha charges.

I actually think that CTs are pretty successful as a piece of game design. They make you want to field infantry, not just predators and storm ravens.

One interesting thing. The intercessor kit doesn't actually include power swords - or at least I can't see any on the sprues and the description doesn't mention them. This is a break from the policy so far of only giving units options that are in their actual box.

Sallys are good for normal marines, where you can spam small squads with a las or melta. Since primaris don't have any of that in the form that's useful, well its not useful. The Redemptor is d6 shots so that's the only thing where it can get a minor bit of use. Everything else isn't to worth it

str00dles1 wrote:

Mandragola wrote:
I think salamanders are underrated. Their characters and dreadnoughts in particular are excellent. It's a good ct for plasma squads too.

I don't think the ravenguard ct does all that much for redemptprs, as they will usually want to be near the enemy.

I think there's a use for all of the CTs. The ravenguard one certainly seems best straight off, but it does very little against an assault rushing army. Ultramarines are kind of the opposite - perfect for the counter-punch. Salamanders and iron hands have great dreadnoughts, especially with the IH stratagem making the plasma option on the redemptor somewhat viable. White scar aggressors become as mobile as inceptors, and they can have very mobile infantry too. Black templars are all about the deep strike alpha charges.

I actually think that CTs are pretty successful as a piece of game design. They make you want to field infantry, not just predators and storm ravens.

One interesting thing. The intercessor kit doesn't actually include power swords - or at least I can't see any on the sprues and the description doesn't mention them. This is a break from the policy so far of only giving units options that are in their actual box.

Sallys are good for normal marines, where you can spam small squads with a las or melta. Since primaris don't have any of that in the form that's useful, well its not useful. The Redemptor is d6 shots so that's the only thing where it can get a minor bit of use. Everything else isn't to worth it

Sally Intercessor reroll would just end up being the nade launcher every time.

Well like I said, it's mainly good for characters and dreadnoughts. A primaris character with 4-5 attacks will probably miss with one and fail to wound with at least one.

It probably makes more sense to play librarians than captains or chaplains, as the rerolls are baked in already.

I think a repulsor full of salamander flamer aggressors would be pretty nasty. Maybe take 4 of them, a lieutenant and an apothecary or ancient.

The main thing I think of though are dreadnoughts. If running a contemptor it ought to result in roughly one more wounding hit for 3 damage every time it attacks. The same applies for a mortis dread (of either kind) with lascannon. The difference will quickly add up.

Has anyone tried Iron Hand Primaris? Their biggest bane is multi-wound weapons, like overcharged plasma, after all.

IH gives them a 1 in 3 chance of surviving an overcharged plasma shot, that's pretty tasty.

Mandragola wrote:
Well like I said, it's mainly good for characters and dreadnoughts. A primaris character with 4-5 attacks will probably miss with one and fail to wound with at least one.

It probably makes more sense to play librarians than captains or chaplains, as the rerolls are baked in already.

I think a repulsor full of salamander flamer aggressors would be pretty nasty. Maybe take 4 of them, a lieutenant and an apothecary or ancient.

The main thing I think of though are dreadnoughts. If running a contemptor it ought to result in roughly one more wounding hit for 3 damage every time it attacks. The same applies for a mortis dread (of either kind) with lascannon. The difference will quickly add up.

That's a lot of points for no much effect really. Flame agressors are bad. Better to have the range, as it will let you sit and double shoot vastly more often then flamers