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 helgrenze wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Meanwhile; we're arguing about whether GW can grab a staff players army, instead of WHY they don't have 4000 points of professionally painted models; unlike multiple other factions.

Oh wait, Orks having been around since Rogue Trader days or anything... I keep forgetting they're such a new army.

Could be that they cheaped out the entire army and is now half the value it used to be.

Probably this. I mean, how long have most of the kits been around? If they only do a few of each kit for every release for a release, and in the time since said release the models got cheapter (and Orks have gotten cheaper over the years) the army might not be close enough to 4k anymore.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 helgrenze wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Meanwhile; we're arguing about whether GW can grab a staff players army, instead of WHY they don't have 4000 points of professionally painted models; unlike multiple other factions.

Oh wait, Orks having been around since Rogue Trader days or anything... I keep forgetting they're such a new army.

Could be that they cheaped out the entire army and is now half the value it used to be.

Probably this. I mean, how long have most of the kits been around? If they only do a few of each kit for every release for a release, and in the time since said release the models got cheapter (and Orks have gotten cheaper over the years) the army might not be close enough to 4k anymore.

Except that as of 8th, almost everything is MORE expensive then it has ever been. Only a handful of units got points reductions from the index. As an example, Trukkz went form 30pts to 82pts. Warbikers went from 18pts to 27pts. The Stompa (that big pile of crap) went from 770pts to just under 1,000pts. So the idea that things got cheaper just isn't true at all hell, if you played Trukk Spam at all since 4th you should have over 500pts in just trukkz now.

SemperMortis wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 helgrenze wrote:

fe40k wrote:
Meanwhile; we're arguing about whether GW can grab a staff players army, instead of WHY they don't have 4000 points of professionally painted models; unlike multiple other factions.

Oh wait, Orks having been around since Rogue Trader days or anything... I keep forgetting they're such a new army.

Could be that they cheaped out the entire army and is now half the value it used to be.

Probably this. I mean, how long have most of the kits been around? If they only do a few of each kit for every release for a release, and in the time since said release the models got cheapter (and Orks have gotten cheaper over the years) the army might not be close enough to 4k anymore.

Except that as of 8th, almost everything is MORE expensive then it has ever been. Only a handful of units got points reductions from the index. As an example, Trukkz went form 30pts to 82pts. Warbikers went from 18pts to 27pts. The Stompa (that big pile of crap) went from 770pts to just under 1,000pts. So the idea that things got cheaper just isn't true at all hell, if you played Trukk Spam at all since 4th you should have over 500pts in just trukkz now.

And compared to when those units were introduced are they more expensive or less expensive?

And everyone's vehicles got more expensive compared to 5th through 7th due to current rules, but some of them are stil cheaper than the original rules made them.

fe40k wrote:
Meanwhile; we're arguing about whether GW can grab a staff players army, instead of WHY they don't have 4000 points of professionally painted models; unlike multiple other factions.

Oh wait, Orks having been around since Rogue Trader days or anything... I keep forgetting they're such a new army.

Doesn't help that the latest release from GW's Facebook page has a message from a Space Wolf leader, but the art shows SW vs GSC, instead of SW vs Orks...

Rogue trade era models are irrelevant. Gw keeps their studio armies with current releases so the rt models wouldn't be used. Seen much rt marines in gw showcase armies?

Also remember gw doesn't do much in form of duplicates so idea of 200 boys? Nope. Not happening. Would be surprised if they have even 100. You don't need that much for photographs which is primary function of studio armies


Automatically Appended Next Post:

SemperMortis wrote:


Except that as of 8th, almost everything is MORE expensive then it has ever been. Only a handful of units got points reductions from the index. As an example, Trukkz went form 30pts to 82pts. Warbikers went from 18pts to 27pts. The Stompa (that big pile of crap) went from 770pts to just under 1,000pts. So the idea that things got cheaper just isn't true at all hell, if you played Trukk Spam at all since 4th you should have over 500pts in just trukkz now.

Gw doesn't do spam. Even for troops. wouldn't be surprise if they have like evil sunz and goff trukks and that's it

 lolman1c wrote:
I joined a gaming club recently and aparntly I'm the first and only Ork playernin their like 50 members.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

phydaux wrote:
" GW didn't have 4000 points of Orks, which is why the army wasn't used at Adepticon;

" Story: GW is not playing Orks at Adepticon because - and I quote - "It's genuinely is because the studio Ork army is not 4,000 points! No conspiracy theory here - that's the truth! We do love Orks too... trust us!" "

GW studio could have 4000 points of Orks in an afternoon PROVIDED all you needed was a slop-n-go paint job. Spray paint, some details, base, flock, done.

But to add even 1000 points of Orks painted to studio quality, consistent with the rest of the existing studio Ork army, ready to be photographed and have the photos published in White Dwarf, that's a whole other thing.

Well theybhave had 30 yesrs to do it... 20 if you consider the most up to date Ork range.

Remember, they did have 4k of the other factions like tyranids and ultramarines.

I don't think it should suprise anyone GW has a large studio army of Ultramarines

The age of the Ork range may actually be part of the problem for the lack of a studio army. they may simply not see a need for a modern studio army that consists of such old minis.

Did some quick work in Battlescribe. I included one of each unit that is still in production, made it "middle-of-the-road" in terms of the size of the unit and upgrades, and it came out to 5,686 points.

This was not including any Forge World, any units that sort of have models (Nob Bikers, for example) or any units that were recently in production but no long appear to be (Big Gunz, for example). I also included only one of each unit that had significant variation (only one KMK for example, and none of the other types of Mek Gunz). This was on the fly and working off memory, and making a lot of judgement calls about what would be a "middle of the road" choice.

DudleyGrim wrote:
I know some of you guys are getting impatient and anxious, but the new codecies are coming, and hey, at least you folks don't need to wait until next year like Sisters do.

If GW said they were redoing our entire line I'm sure there'd be a lot more positivity and I'd be happy to wait. In fact if GW showed a singular new Ork model there'd be a lot more positivity. Instead we've seen new GSC models and massive hints that it will be them vs Space Wolves box set which further lessens our likelihood of getting new models (that are desperately needed).

Getting a codex only release at this late a stage is extremely disappointing and makes no sense.

If this forum is anything to go by, I believe ork tactic mega thread is the longest in the tactics section. Which is pretty surprising considering they've got an index with minimal good options and just a few very obvious good builds.

 DoomMouse wrote:
If this forum is anything to go by, I believe ork tactic mega thread is the longest in the tactics section. Which is pretty surprising considering they've got an index with minimal good options and just a few very obvious good builds.

Mostly sheer desperation, and the hope that there's something thay can do to not get stomped without buying+painting 200 boyz.

Shurifire wrote:

 DoomMouse wrote:
If this forum is anything to go by, I believe ork tactic mega thread is the longest in the tactics section. Which is pretty surprising considering they've got an index with minimal good options and just a few very obvious good builds.

Mostly sheer desperation, and the hope that there's something thay can do to not get stomped without buying+painting 200 boyz.

The ork tactics thread is basically this. Its just page after page of people wish listing because it took us about 3 months to figure out that the only viable build was spamming boyz or Kommandos or Stormboyz and that everyhting else is basically drastically over priced.

It also has a bunch of posts where people try to suggest something besides boyz and get shot down by simple math. Occasionally we get a new ork player who thinks he will be Mork (Or possibly gork's) gift to the ork faction and suggests ridiculous builds or tries to show us how taking 400 grots is a viable tactic or how the stompa is a viable unit. As a regular poster on their I can also tell you that interest as drastically dropped off and most of us are in a holding pattern. I've had about $150 saved to buy some new Ork stuff, but I refuse to spend it until the codex drops because I DO NOT want to get another set of Deff Koptas only to find out that they are all but unplayable.

Not yet, not ever. I like modeling/kitbashing Orks too much.

A longer wait just means a different priority on what I paint next.

Many ork players I still recognize from when I joined dakka in 5th now seem to be posting on other threads about their new army, like dark eldar, death guard, necrons.

It's also sad to see how much ork players reputation has been hurt by the constant complaining of a few posters. Our reputation used to be that ork players were the most fun to be around.

I dont really understand where the complaints about ork players complaining about a new codex come from. Most of it is in its own thread (of which there is one). If you go into a speculation/chat thread what would you expect?

this is GW right now

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RaGLtJaZjs

Aaaaand its space wolves vs genestealer cults next. So I guess orks are dead last in the year? Sigh, I hope they don't wait for the holiday window for the ork release. I just want to play my darn orks :(

It's kind of hard to work on anything when you don't even know whats good/cool/coming out. Is there going to be a new unit that I want? Am I going to want to build another unit of flash gitz or something? At their current state only 3 units are playable (weirdboy, boy, KMK gun) so its hard to say what to invest in or convert in the mean time.

Having to shelve a 6000 point army for a year sucks.

 Don Savik wrote:
Having to shelve a 6000 point army for a year sucks.

Could be worse.
Could have come out months ago and been crap. Or it could be next year 'emperor willing'. Or it could be a couple of months away from getting nerfhammered for being a popular ingredient in soup... the timing of orks will mean they are at least safe from the wrath of the big errata. [/glasshalffull]

I'm sure GK players are feeling a lot of sympathy for Orks right now, yeah.

My Orks are a painting and kit-bashing project. They never get played with - I don't have the last codex for them even (I gave it away to a club for kids to look at).

The problem is, I love conversions and my looted tank for example is a beautiful example of Orkish improvisation. My Big Gunz and Mek Gunz again are also kit-bashes. Only, these are either not 'tournament legal' because of the size of them (they're bigger and a mix of components from GW and others)… or because they no longer have rules (Looted Tanks)

The Orks lost their soul when GW ignored and actively discouraged kit-bashing and modding Orkish gubbins. So for me, they will continue to be a hobby on the side that will only see play if A) The new codex is worthwhile and B) I can find other players who haven't already quit the hobby due to a multitude of reasons such as being out-priced, lack of support, having children or playing less confusing games(clear, to the point rules)

You want to know why the Ork Community has almost vanished?

Since the beginning, the rumors were Orks and Space Wolves would be released together, potentially in a kit box - but these were just rumors.

Then GW announced Orks and Space Wolves codecii are coming next.

Then, out of NOWHERE, and WITHOUT even announcing that they were in the works - GSC steal the Ork spotlight. The new boxed set is Space Wolves VS GSC, instead of SW vs Ork.

And then it gets worse - "New models are coming out soon!"; and then they go on to showcase Space Wolf new models (which is fine), but also new GSC models.

Where the FETH are the Ork models? The Ork announcements? The Ork rumors and leaks?

Oh, right, they got shoveled into the remnants bin, like they've been since 3rd edition. Never forget that in an Index where everything is badly overpriced; GW didn't have 4000 points of Orks for Adepticon 8th edition.

Orks, the classic Space Marine rival, and one of the most iconic 40k races, who've been in the game since the beginning - Orks, don't have 4000 points.

Tell my why Orks should care about GW? Why?

to add to your rant, why the hell didn't GW pull their collective heads out of their butts and reprice the majority of the index in the FAQ or the Chapter approved which have come out since?

or do they still think a 1,000pt stompa is worth taking?

SemperMortis wrote:
to add to your rant, why the hell didn't GW pull their collective heads out of their butts and reprice the majority of the index in the FAQ or the Chapter approved which have come out since?

or do they still think a 1,000pt stompa is worth taking?

Because their playtesters keep telling them they're good. Reecius of Frontline Gaming said, and this is a direct quote, "The Stompa is worth every point".

With such advice, why would they change things up?

I can't tell if the FLG stuff about them deciding codex rules and points values is serious, or just an elaborate troll.

I have a good feeling about Warhammer Fest Europe next weekend.

I foresee a lot of pleasant surprises. My first army was orks, I would gladly jump back in with a new boyz kit and a decent dex.

They've been one of the worst treated armies in the game for like over a decade so it doesn't really surprise me if alot of people have moved on to better-supported armies.

Not everyone has the blind loyalty of Sisters fans.

 Glane wrote:

SemperMortis wrote:
to add to your rant, why the hell didn't GW pull their collective heads out of their butts and reprice the majority of the index in the FAQ or the Chapter approved which have come out since?

or do they still think a 1,000pt stompa is worth taking?

Because their playtesters keep telling them they're good. Reecius of Frontline Gaming said, and this is a direct quote, "The Stompa is worth every point".

With such advice, why would they change things up?

If he said that about the 8E Stompa, Reecius is an idiot. Yes, the Stompa...with BS 5+...figuring in even one penalty to hit in 8E..is not worth a flying f...fig. But...but...there are ways to get it re-rolls! Well, re-rolling 6's sucks ballz, and rerolling 7's IS NOT POSSIBLE. So, the Stompa is worth every point...when its shooting weapons can't hit dick? Well, surely it was compensated by being way tougher than it should be, and by being a total nightmare once it does get into close combat, right? Wrong. An equal point value of Knights, who will of course have been effectively shooting the crap out of the Stompa at BS 3+ on the way in, will carve it up. The Stompa, and anything Ork that shoots, is utter gak under 8E. No matter how much fun Orks are to play, it really isn't fun when you can't compete AT ALL.

The other reason is Orks (and Eldar and non-Marked Chaos Space Marines) have gaping holes in their model range.

That is why Ork players are somewhat AWOL at the moment.

 Don Savik wrote:
Aaaaand its space wolves vs genestealer cults next. So I guess orks are dead last in the year? Sigh, I hope they don't wait for the holiday window for the ork release. I just want to play my darn orks :(

It's kind of hard to work on anything when you don't even know whats good/cool/coming out. Is there going to be a new unit that I want? Am I going to want to build another unit of flash gitz or something? At their current state only 3 units are playable (weirdboy, boy, KMK gun) so its hard to say what to invest in or convert in the mean time.

Having to shelve a 6000 point army for a year sucks.

Based on the rumors that the delay was a result of the Orks breaking the game (apparently being able to get multiple horde units into charge range alpha strike style broke the game a bit according to playtesting) which may have lead to some changes and further playtesting to try and make Orks fun and playable but not game breaking (looking at you 7th Edition WFB Daemons).

Sure, it sucks to be waiting (my Sisters are still awaiting reinforcements while I shelved my pure Inquisition army project due to FOC datasheet restrictions and I won't touch Sisters of Silence until they have more than a single kit to field (love the models but not when that's their only choice to field), but if it's for extra care and attention instead of a slipshod job I'm all for it. I want to see more cool Ork stuff, but for now we wait.

Then again as Sisters player I've become a fething master of waiting, so take that advice with salt.

fe40k wrote:
You want to know why the Ork Community has almost vanished?

Since the beginning, the rumors were Orks and Space Wolves would be released together, potentially in a kit box - but these were just rumors.

Then GW announced Orks and Space Wolves codecii are coming next.

Then, out of NOWHERE, and WITHOUT even announcing that they were in the works - GSC steal the Ork spotlight. The new boxed set is Space Wolves VS GSC, instead of SW vs Ork.

Out of nowhere? GW SAID THAT CULT WOULD BE GETTING MODELS BEFORE THEY WOULD GET THEIR CODEX!!!!

Sheesh. Some selective reading you have if you think cult models came out of nowhere.

tneva82 wrote:

fe40k wrote:
You want to know why the Ork Community has almost vanished?

Since the beginning, the rumors were Orks and Space Wolves would be released together, potentially in a kit box - but these were just rumors.

Then GW announced Orks and Space Wolves codecii are coming next.

Then, out of NOWHERE, and WITHOUT even announcing that they were in the works - GSC steal the Ork spotlight. The new boxed set is Space Wolves VS GSC, instead of SW vs Ork.

Out of nowhere? GW SAID THAT CULT WOULD BE GETTING MODELS BEFORE THEY WOULD GET THEIR CODEX!!!!

Sheesh. Some selective reading you have if you think cult models came out of nowhere.

Wasn't the accidental reveal of GSC models before Orks and Space Wolves got announced?

tneva82 wrote:

fe40k wrote:
You want to know why the Ork Community has almost vanished?

Since the beginning, the rumors were Orks and Space Wolves would be released together, potentially in a kit box - but these were just rumors.

Then GW announced Orks and Space Wolves codecii are coming next.

Then, out of NOWHERE, and WITHOUT even announcing that they were in the works - GSC steal the Ork spotlight. The new boxed set is Space Wolves VS GSC, instead of SW vs Ork.

Out of nowhere? GW SAID THAT CULT WOULD BE GETTING MODELS BEFORE THEY WOULD GET THEIR CODEX!!!!

Sheesh. Some selective reading you have if you think cult models came out of nowhere.

I'm honestly fine with the box set and stuff. I'm disappointed, sure, and I really did imagine orks would be getting our codex before SW, and I was fine with GSC getting new models before us- they did in fact say that GSC would be getting new models soon. But what I really think has pissed off the ork community is the lack of any news at all. He have no idea what's coming. Are we getting new models? Are we getting a box set? Are we getting new characters? Are they just going to re-release the index and just slap a few token stratagems on it and call it a day? We honestly have no idea. After being told three months ago that "orks are coming soon" we've had literally no news at all, and then for them to drop this huge announcement while orks are still out in the cold is a bit of a pain.

Here's a question (since I missed like 6 months of this edition and honestly don't know): Since 8th dropped, other than telling us what is in the pipeline next, has GW announced any details about an army prior to the lead up the the codex's release?

Because as far as I know, we haven't heard anything about other armies until it was time for them to go up for pre-order, so why would it be different here?