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Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut




PA rules inside the codex.
Units can use the PA psychic powers too.
+1W to power armoured and termintor dudes

Interceptor character.

Teleport can be used by NDK models to move faster, as it seemed to be a thing in the past.

Dreadnoughts that can take two autocannons. I have 2 can't use them.

No points rises.

If you have to kill, then kill in the best manner. If you slaughter, then slaughter in the best manner. Let one of you sharpen his knife so his animal feels no pain. 
   
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In My Lab

Spoiler:
Nurglitch wrote:
I have some opinions about how the Tyranids should be redone:

Army Rules:
Endess Swarm: A <Hive Fleet> unit returns to the board on a 4+ on 1D6 as if placed in strategic reserves, -1 if a monster, -1 if a character.

Caustic Blood: Whenever a <Hive Fleet> unit takes wounds in close combat, saved or unsaved, roll 1D6 and on a 6 the attacking unit takes 1 mortal wound.

Instinctive Behaviour is right out, that's covered by terrible Tyranid morale.

The Shadow In the Warp: Non-<Hive Fleet> models suffer Perils of the Warp on all doubles rather than 2s and 12s within Synapse range.

Synapse: Confers LD to units within range and to the highest LD in the chain. Likewise, psychic powers should chain along Synapse to Synapse and terminate in non-Synapse.

Psychic Powers:
1. Dominion should re-activate immunity to morale across the caster's local Synapse web.

2. Catalyst should allow models in Synapse web to ignore wounds on 5+, without affecting Caustic Blood.

3. The Horror should be -1 to hit for enemy under the SitW.

4. Onslaught as attack first and re-roll 1D6 charge under Synapse.

5. Paroxysm should break invulnerable saves under the SitW.

6. Psychic Scream should do 1 mortal wound to enemy units under SitW.

7. Psychic Overload should be SitW ranged.

Biomorphs:
Adrenal Glands allow 1D6 of charge rolls to be re-rolled.
Toxin Sacs add +1D to all attacks in shooting and combat.

Hive Fleet Rules:
Behemoth gets +1W per model,
Kronos gets +6" Synapse,
Leviathan gets a 6+ ignore wound roll or +1 to Catalyst rolls within Synapse,
Kraken gets +2M,
Gorgon gets -1AP,
Jormungandr gets +1Sv,
Hydra gets a +1 to Endless Swarm.

Changes to Unit Special Rules:
Brood Telepathy works on <Hive Fleet> keyword.
The Will of the Hive Mind gives <Hive Fleet> +1 to hit in the shooting phase for Tyrant and Swarmlord.
Alpha Warrior is re-roll 1s to <Hive Fleet> in Synapse,
Brood Progenitor is 6+ ignore wounds stacking with Catalyst & Leviathan as +1.
Warp Siphon is 6++ or +1 invulnerable save in Synapse.
Alpha Leader is +1A within Synapse (but no Synapse on Old One Eye).

Army Rules
Endless Swarm I'd probably limit to Gaunts and Gants. Maybe make it automatic, but only happen once?

Caustic Blood feels like needless bloat.

Removing Instinctive Behavior I can get behind.

SitW change looks fine.

Synapse conferring Leadership is fine. But Psychic chaining...

Powers
Dominion making morale immunity is fine.

Catalyst giving a 5++ to basically your entire army makes it an absolute must-take. That's not good design.

The Horror is, again, too much. Blanket -1 to-hit for everything near any of your units really freaking screws melee armies, but doesn't do much to gunlines far back.

Onslaught looks fine... As a single target power. As-is, if you get Onslaught and Catalyst off, you have both the Nurgle FNP and the Slaanesh Fight First.

Why would Paroxysm break invuln saves? Because, 1, it's like Null Zone times a hundred, and 2, why would it affect force fields? Or not being part of reality at the time of the attack?

Psychic Scream might be okay-it'd discourage MSU, but 1 MW isn't too much.

Psychic Overload I do not know what it does, so...

Overall, I don't think any of these powers are inherently bad ideas, just that making the buffs apply to EVERYTHING in Synapse is insane.

Biomorphs
Adrenal Glands, I'm assuming you mean reroll a single die on the charge? Fine.
Toxin Sacs are positively insane, though. +1 Damage to everything? That's nuts.

Hive Fleets
Behemoth is supposed to be Nidzilla, right? Because that encourages Gaunt and Gant carpets, since they gain almost double durability for no cost.
Kronos looks fine.
Leviathan looks fine, assuming you can't Catalyst EVERYTHING like you suggest.
Kraken looks fine.
Gorgon looks pretty crazy. How many points would a Hormagaunt with Toxin Sacs be?
Jormugandr looks fine.
Hydra is pretty ridiculous.

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1ksons

Give them back access to the units in CSM that they lost. In fact just roll the who army back into the CSM dex.

Make the legion trait affect all units including vehicles.

Change the legion trait to be +1 to invulnerable saves (or give the unit a 6++ if it doesnt have s save) as per the old mark of tzeench rules and +6 inch to psychic powers.

Make the scarabs melee weapons be d2 relic swords. Change the soul reaper to either be 2 damage or 8 shots.

Rubrics same changes to thr soul reaper.

Stratagem

Make the shoot twice strat usable of the unit moved.

Make the fight twice strat usable on all 1k units noy just gors.

Make the mutalith actually good in cc by either more attacks or making it current attack actually scary. Give it some buffs to boost ranged attack and not just cc attacks.

Probably more but hey its a start!
   
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I'd add support for armored krumpanies to orks.
   
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shortymcnostrill wrote:
I'd add support for armored krumpanies to orks.


I really wish they'd taken the opportunity with Specialist Mobs to allow them to take particular types of mobs as troops. That would have added so much more potential to them rather than them just being less customizable more bad versions of everyone else's custom chapter traits.

Speedmob-Warbikes as troops
Dreadmob-Deff Dreads as Troops
Tineads-Manz as troops
Pyromaniacs-Burnas as troops

etc.

"I can't believe all these tryhard WAACs out there just care about winning all the time when it's supposed to be a game for fun!!!!!!! Also here's my 27 page essay on why marines are OP and Orkz should get a bunch of OP rules so I can win more games

-the_scotsman"

-ERJAK 
   
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the_scotsman wrote:
shortymcnostrill wrote:
I'd add support for armored krumpanies to orks.


I really wish they'd taken the opportunity with Specialist Mobs to allow them to take particular types of mobs as troops. That would have added so much more potential to them rather than them just being less customizable more bad versions of everyone else's custom chapter traits.

Speedmob-Warbikes as troops
Dreadmob-Deff Dreads as Troops
Tineads-Manz as troops
Pyromaniacs-Burnas as troops

etc.


There was a huge missed opportunity to explore every faction more in depth but if its not Space Marine GW has decided it doesn't want to.
   
Made in ca
Legendary Master of the Chapter





 Bosskelot wrote:

It's not just the models that haven't been updated in years, but many of the statlines too haven't changed since 3rd.


This is almost a universal problem at this time. GW's tinkering with space marines gives me hope


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The Salt Mine wrote:
the_scotsman wrote:
shortymcnostrill wrote:
I'd add support for armored krumpanies to orks.


I really wish they'd taken the opportunity with Specialist Mobs to allow them to take particular types of mobs as troops. That would have added so much more potential to them rather than them just being less customizable more bad versions of everyone else's custom chapter traits.

Speedmob-Warbikes as troops
Dreadmob-Deff Dreads as Troops
Tineads-Manz as troops
Pyromaniacs-Burnas as troops

etc.


There was a huge missed opportunity to explore every faction more in depth but if its not Space Marine GW has decided it doesn't want to.


GW seems to be avoiding the "take X as troops" in 8th and 9th edition. And I can't blame them. with 8th edition opening up the FOC it's a bit easier. want to take an all terminator army? there's a detachment for that

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/12 21:48:45


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Annandale, VA

I just want to be able to take Adaptive Physiologies on more than 2 units. I'm fine with paying a CP for each unit; just let me burn all my CP to give all my units the same ability as part of my army theme.
   
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UK

BrianDavion wrote:
 Bosskelot wrote:

It's not just the models that haven't been updated in years, but many of the statlines too haven't changed since 3rd.


This is almost a universal problem at this time. GW's tinkering with space marines gives me hope


When I say statlines I also mean general rules for the unit or wider faction.

In 8th Guardsmen got Orders, Ork Boyz got dakka dakka dakka/Ere' we go/Mob Rule, Tac Marines got Angels of Death, CSM got some of AoD. I'm ignoring any actual weapon or stat changes here.

Guardians? They got Battle Focus, which is basically there to make up for the fact they don't get fleet of foot anymore (since everyone else gets that now) and even Battle Focus itself is something other subfactions get (hello, White Scars!). Other than that they lost one of their big defining stats that was Initiative.

It's a general problem, but it's hit Eldar, specifically, particularly hard.
   
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I just want it organized so I don't have to flip around so much. I'm playing Catachan, I'd like all the Catachan specific stuff in one place.
   
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At this point, craftworlds need to be turned into the protoss to compete with Astartes. Give them personal shields that are wounds, not invulns.
   
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Auckland, NZ

 JNAProductions wrote:
Nurglitch wrote:

Hive Fleet Rules:
Gorgon gets -1AP,

Gorgon looks pretty crazy. How many points would a Hormagaunt with Toxin Sacs be?

I don't really know that hormagaunts are what I'd focus in on there.
You are aware that under the current rules it's possible to buff a hormagaunt to as much as AP-6 right? There are lots of conditions attached to that, but it's fairly trivial to get them as far as AP-3. Given that it hasn't exactly been a thing outside of gimmick lists, I don't know that -1AP is all that crazy. Unless we're talking about giving it to ranged weapons too. That might get more interesting.
   
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Fresh-Faced New User




In 8th Guardsmen got Order


Guardsmen got orders in like 5th edition I believe.
   
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In My Lab

Arson Fire wrote:
 JNAProductions wrote:
Nurglitch wrote:

Hive Fleet Rules:
Gorgon gets -1AP,

Gorgon looks pretty crazy. How many points would a Hormagaunt with Toxin Sacs be?

I don't really know that hormagaunts are what I'd focus in on there.
You are aware that under the current rules it's possible to buff a hormagaunt to as much as AP-6 right? There are lots of conditions attached to that, but it's fairly trivial to get them as far as AP-3. Given that it hasn't exactly been a thing outside of gimmick lists, I don't know that -1AP is all that crazy. Unless we're talking about giving it to ranged weapons too. That might get more interesting.
Fair. It's more the combination with that and D2 on EVERYTHING.

Clocks for the clockmaker! Cogs for the cog throne! 
   
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Drukhari

I have thought about this a lot and I honestly feel these are the best changes that are more realistic, not OP, more fluffy, and doesn't need new kits.

1) Have subfactions as a subset way to play the army over the main way and all buffs over lap with a stronger over lap to their respective type.
Example Hero: Haemonculus: All core units gain rr1's to Inured to Suffering. All Coven units also gain +1 to their toughness
Example Obsession: Poisoned Tongue: All Melee poison weapons re-roll wounds of 1. Kabal units re-roll of wound rolls of 1.
2) Beasts needs to be 1 giant mix unit again
3) Lots of units needs their unique special rules back, Reavers Hammer of Wrath hits for example
4) All mercenaries needs their own stratagem
5) Court should be set up more like shield drones and taken in units that always give the Archon LoS!
6) Transhuman for hitting (hit roles of 1, 2 or 3 fail) as a rule for some units and/or stratagem (like Hellions)
7) All Wych units gain Fleet of Foot (Runa nd charge) Red Greif goes back to fluffy and all units with fly gain bonuses (vehicles, reavers, hellions)
8) Give every unit a 6++ in the full book, no reason not to for their high price
9) Weapon upgrades: Splinter Cannons -1ap, Dark lances 3+D3, LG just heavy flamers, Shock Prows auto hit and wound on the charge, -3 for 3D vs vehicles
10) Raiders Assault planks: Let units charge out of Raiders after it moved but did not advance. PLace unit within 1" of the Raiders Hull when you declare to charge, then choose the unit they will charge.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/13 11:26:05


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Made in gb
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@Amish - is "merchants" on #4 an odd auto-correct moment?

I'm going to go for a single piece of low-hanging fruit for now.

IG Infantry Squad Sergeants - along with Platoon and Company Commanders, if relevant (I don't have the book to hand) - get the option to have a lasgun instead of a laspistol/ccw.

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 Jidmah wrote:
I guess I went a bit overboard.
Click below to find my full codex update:

Spoiler:
Weapons in general
- PK to 3 damage
- Killsaw to d3 damage, 3 vs vehicles
- Powerstabba +1S
- Choppas and Big choppas gain "An unmodified save roll of 1, 2 and 3 always fails"
- Big Shoota to AP-1
- Shoota to Assault 3, kustom shoota to Assault 6

Klans
- Bad Moons: Replace re-rolling ones with "shootas, big shootas, kustom shoota, supa shootas, mek speshul, etc get -1 AP" . Replace shoot twice stratagem with "re-roll any hits for when shooting".
- Goff: Warlord trait to "+1 attack, extra attack on 5+ instead of 6+", Da Lukky Stikk is the same as a Waaagh! banner
- Freebootas: The unit unveiling the Badskull Banner counts as having killed a unit for competitive streak for the rest of the turn, Krooza Broadside works like the new orbital bombardment
- Snakebites: Infantry gains +1 toughness, pile in 6" and advance 2d6, discard lowest
- Bloodaxes: Gain light cover if targeted from more than 12", -1 to hit if already in cover. Stratagem can infiltrate within 9" of a boards edge more than 6" away from enemies.
- Evil Suns: Replace relic with snazztrike from vigilus

Gunwagon/Battlewagon/Bonebreaker
- Big Shoota and grabbin' klaw upgrades priced into base cost
- Grabbin' klaw is an additional attack

Trukk
- Wreckin' ball is priced into base cost

Planes
- Make supa-shootas 2 damage like heavy bolters

Big Mek
- Tellyporta blasta goes to d6 damage, loses special rule
- KFF from "units wholly within 9" to "models within 6"

SAG
- back to 80 points or add SSAG back in

Deffkilla Wartrike
- S6 like other bosses
- Snagga klaw (melee) to 2 damage flat instead of d3
- Snagga klaw (shooting) should deal d3 mortal wounds on hit, remove stratagem.
- Killa jet to 12" by default

Nobz
- WS 2+
- Cybork gives 5++
- Keepin’ Order: Ignore modifiers for attrition tests

Boyz
- Split into 3 datasheets: Boyz, shoota boyz, trukk boyz
- Shoota boyz get "Moar Dakka" when above 20
- Trukk boyz get +1 attack if they disembarked from a transport this turn
- 'ardboyz to 4+ armor

Painbiyz
- Doc tools are 5++ FNP

Gretchin
- Grot shield as bespoke rule, triggering on 4+ for infantry only

Boomdakka Snazzwagon
- Mek speshul to snazzgun statline
- Grot bumper as bespoke rule
- Kustom job does not reduce strength

Ruckatrukk Squigbuggy
- Combine both squig launchers into one to speed up rolling
- Bitey squig Assault 3d3 blast S5 AP-1 2 damage
- Boom squig Assault 3 S8 AP-3 d3 damage
- If squig mine gets exploded it can lay another one
- Squig mines to d3/d6 mortal wounds

Warbikes, nob bikers
- Exhaust cloud back on the datasheet
- Add Kult of Speed stratagems from vigilus to codex

Killa Kanz
- Kan rokkits to Assault 3
- Grotzooka to Heavy 2d6 and AP-2

Lootas
- Loot it! stratagem costs 0 cp when used on them
- reduce points

Burnas
- Burnas to d6 shots and 12" range
- Melee profile to 2 damage
- Pyromaniacs provides +1 attack in addition to ignoring morale

Mini Mek
- Super-charge: During your command phase, pick a unit with an ork energy weapon within 6". Until your next command phase, that weapon gains +1S and +1D, but damages the shooter on unmodified rolls of 1 and 2

Blitza Bommer
- Boom bomb: Maximum dice reduced from twelve to six, deal d3 mortal wounds for every successful roll.

Mekboyz Workshop
- Remove requirement to hold still, you get the kustom job if you are in range during the command phase
- More rivets adds d3 to the wounds repaired with the mek or big mekaniak rule if a mek is overseeing the repairs instead of downgrading it to 3.
- For every model with the Mekaniak or Big Mekaniak rule, add 1 to the roll for getting an extra speshul



For mek guns, I really like Blackie's idea of essentially turning them into ork basilisks much more than my own idea


I agree with 99% of this, the only one I see as maybe needing a change is the Choppas idea - boys dropping all saves to 4+ is a bit too much, I feel. Would make them more expensive so worse, as they lack durability.

I would have Choppas gain a point in AP for every point the users Strength is over 4. Then I would add a ule saying that if an ork unit rolls a 10+ to charge, they gain +1S in the following fight phase.

So Boys would be as is, but if they roll well for the charge they get S5 AP-1. Warbosses (S6) would be AP-2, AP-3 on a good charge. Big choppas would start at AP-1, so Nobs (S5) with big choppas are AP-2, and AP-3 on a good charge, with +2S.A warboss, on a good charge with a big choppa and fists of gork on a good charge can swing his big choppa hard enough to get S11 (8+2) and AP-5. They may have to have a cap of "improve AP by 1 point for each point of strength of the bearer over 4, to a maximum of +3", or something.

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I just want Nids to feel closer to the lore (just like they reworked marines)

Durability
- large wound pools, above-average toughness, regeneration, the resurrection of elite models, gaunt replenishments
- limited focused FnP (they shouldn't directly compete with DG/Nurgle)
- damage reduction biomorphs. Where do Aberrants get their abilities from?

Psyker suppression - Tyranids should be the second-worst thing a psyker can meet after a high-grade psychic blank. Shadow in the Warp is one of their defining characteristics, killing weaker psykers before they even step on the planet...
- battlefield-wide -1 to cast if there is a synapse creature on the field
- -2 to cast within synapse range of a synapse beast (possibly -3 around Tyrants/Maleceptors)
- keep the stratagem for punishing failed casts (or change it to doubles)
- it should be hard and dangerous to get spells off against Nids, even for good psyker factions.

Coordination - GW tends to ignore this area of the lore, but they tried a few new things in the Blood of Baal. No other faction has such effective command & control down to the last model.
- Auspex Scan
- dodging or countering charges
- Reacting to friendly or enemy units killed.
- using gaunts in synapse as shields to reduce the incoming ranged fire.

- Ranged weapons updated in line with the imperium weapons
- Melee weapons and stats updated so a monster designed for slaughter with millions of years of actively guided evolution behind it isn't overshadowed by a space marine sergeant with a big stick or an insane convict in a torturing machine...

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2020/11/13 10:38:20


 
   
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 some bloke wrote:
I agree with 99% of this, the only one I see as maybe needing a change is the Choppas idea - boys dropping all saves to 4+ is a bit too much, I feel. Would make them more expensive so worse, as they lack durability.

I would have Choppas gain a point in AP for every point the users Strength is over 4. Then I would add a ule saying that if an ork unit rolls a 10+ to charge, they gain +1S in the following fight phase.

So Boys would be as is, but if they roll well for the charge they get S5 AP-1. Warbosses (S6) would be AP-2, AP-3 on a good charge. Big choppas would start at AP-1, so Nobs (S5) with big choppas are AP-2, and AP-3 on a good charge, with +2S.A warboss, on a good charge with a big choppa and fists of gork on a good charge can swing his big choppa hard enough to get S11 (8+2) and AP-5. They may have to have a cap of "improve AP by 1 point for each point of strength of the bearer over 4, to a maximum of +3", or something.


The whole point was to make boyz and regular nobz stronger though, their offense is far too weak for their points right now. Going back to the choppa rule of old would have the advantage of improving their power against well-armored foe while not making them overbearing against other light infantry units like guardsmen, gaunts or daemons which they already excel at killing. Essentially, it's a conditional AP-1 or 2, though it's probably too good against the new storm shields.

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 Jidmah wrote:
I guess I went a bit overboard.
- Choppas and Big choppas gain "An unmodified save roll of 1, 2 and 3 always fails"

I liked everything but this. Making boys great at countering terminators seems to go against the fluff. Why not just give an AP-1 if you want to counter 3+ armour?
What "Moar dakka" do for mobs of shoota boys?

Personally, I'd love seeing DDD giving an extra hit on 6's instead of another shot. Reduces rolling for the sake of rolling. Another change I'd make is to allow boys to leave the trukk after it moves similar to Impulsor. In fact, all assault vehicles should have this by default, but whatever. Also I'd really like seeing a WAAGH being a global ability, getting stronger with each turn instead of once per battle/aura of WB.
And I think that all orks but gretchin should have a FNP6+ to reflect their tough nature (boys should probaly lose default 6+ then though). Tankbustas, Burnas, Lootas should have a 5+ by default to reflect that they are a bit better kitted out than regular boys.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/13 11:11:17


 
   
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 JawRippa wrote:
 Jidmah wrote:
I guess I went a bit overboard.
- Choppas and Big choppas gain "An unmodified save roll of 1, 2 and 3 always fails"

I liked everything but this. Making boys great at countering terminators seems to go against the fluff. Why not just give an AP-1 if you want to counter 3+ armour?

Well, I didn't want them to get better against 4+ and 5+ armor because they already kill those units really good. But I guess someone designing marines would never have such concerns

Earth is not flat
Vaccines work
We've been to the moon
Climate change is real
Chemtrails aren't a thing
Evolution is a fact
Orks are not a melee army
Stand up for science!
 
   
Made in ru
Regular Dakkanaut





 Jidmah wrote:
 JawRippa wrote:
 Jidmah wrote:
I guess I went a bit overboard.
- Choppas and Big choppas gain "An unmodified save roll of 1, 2 and 3 always fails"

I liked everything but this. Making boys great at countering terminators seems to go against the fluff. Why not just give an AP-1 if you want to counter 3+ armour?

Well, I didn't want them to get better against 4+ and 5+ armor because they already kill those units really good. But I guess someone designing marines would never have such concerns

Choppas could get a -1AP when targeting an armour save better than 4+. Has the same effect, but does not allow boys clobbering TEQ too easily.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/13 11:16:33


 
   
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 Dysartes wrote:
@Amish - is "merchants" on #4 an odd auto-correct moment?

I'm going to go for a single piece of low-hanging fruit for now.

IG Infantry Squad Sergeants - along with Platoon and Company Commanders, if relevant (I don't have the book to hand) - get the option to have a lasgun instead of a laspistol/ccw.


thanks, must have been.

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 JawRippa wrote:
 Jidmah wrote:
 JawRippa wrote:
 Jidmah wrote:
I guess I went a bit overboard.
- Choppas and Big choppas gain "An unmodified save roll of 1, 2 and 3 always fails"

I liked everything but this. Making boys great at countering terminators seems to go against the fluff. Why not just give an AP-1 if you want to counter 3+ armour?

Well, I didn't want them to get better against 4+ and 5+ armor because they already kill those units really good. But I guess someone designing marines would never have such concerns

Choppas could get a -1AP when targeting an armour save better than 4+. Has the same effect, but does not allow boys clobbering TEQ too easily.


You could give them the Grav rule: 2W against a 3+ or better Armor Save. I'd even change that and the Grav itself to 2W against 3+ Non-Vehicle saves

My WHFB armies were Bretonians and Tomb Kings. 
   
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 JawRippa wrote:
 Jidmah wrote:
 JawRippa wrote:
 Jidmah wrote:
I guess I went a bit overboard.
- Choppas and Big choppas gain "An unmodified save roll of 1, 2 and 3 always fails"

I liked everything but this. Making boys great at countering terminators seems to go against the fluff. Why not just give an AP-1 if you want to counter 3+ armour?

Well, I didn't want them to get better against 4+ and 5+ armor because they already kill those units really good. But I guess someone designing marines would never have such concerns

Choppas could get a -1AP when targeting an armour save better than 4+. Has the same effect, but does not allow boys clobbering TEQ too easily.


That sounds much better, let's do that instead .

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Made in gb
Wrathful Warlord Titan Commander






London

Marines (this may be a long one)

Combat Doctrines: Would personally scrap.

HQ units get access to Biker and Terminator options by default.

Terminators: ignore heavy weapon penalties. Can take 2 heavy weapons at 5-man units, although still 2 for a 10-man unit.

Intercessors: Stalker Rifles either become Ap-1 or D1.

Heavy Intercessors: Reduce to Intercessor statline.

Hellblasters: Scrap the plasma variants, keep the default one.

Gladiator tanks: Scrap

Primaris speeders: Scrap

Land Raider (all variants inc. Chaos), gain Assault Vehicle; units embarked may disembark after moving, and may also charge after doing so. Would also consider a 5++ invuln.




   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut






Audustum wrote:
Custodes:

All melee weapons are flat 2 damage instead of 1D3. Trajann's weapon is changed to flat 3 damage.

Blades: +1S AP-3
Spears: +2S AP-2
Axe: +3S AP-1
(Mimics power weapon structure)

Emperor's Companion WT: Changed from 're-roll damage dice' to 're-roll charges within 6" aura'.

Warden unit reworked. Now has a 5+++ base, improved to 4+++ when armed with a spear instead of an axe. When armed with an axe instead of a spear, becomes a 3+++ but only to MW.

Sisters of Silence included in Codex for ease of reference.

Sisters aura reworked. In addition to providing scaling -1 to cast for every Sisters' unit in range, now Sisters also increase the range of their aura when together.
If a Sisters unit is alone: 18"
If two Sisters units are within 6" of each other: 24"
If a Sisters unit is within 6" of two other Sisters units: 30"
Increase all Sisters points by 2PPM.

Valerian and Aleya can now be taken separately.

Valerian's aura is changed from re-roll 1's to Hit to re-roll 1's to Wound for CORE.

Trajann is given the SUPREME COMMANDER keyword.

All re-roll auras changed to re-roll CORE. CORE is given to all Custodes infantry, Custodes Jetbikes and Sisters infantry (sorry Dreads).

Aquillon and Allarus Terminators are given an additional +1W. Trajann is given an additional +1W. Shield-Captain in Allarus Terminator armor is given an additional +1W. Increase all by 5PPM.

Shield-Host warlord traits become detachment traits (for those who don't know, Custodes don't have conventional chapter tactics but instead have warlord traits that grant an aura like a chapter tactic, this would just change those warlord trait auras into actual chapter tactics).

Vexilus changed:
Magnifica: -1 to be Hit for all Custodes CORE and Sisters CORE within 6".
Imperius: This Vexilus Praetor may DENY THE WITCH as if he were a psyker twice per battle round. These benefit from the +1 to Deny the Witch if this model is given the Impregnable Mind warlord trait and total amount of denials available to the model is 3.
Defensor: IMPERIUM INFANTRY CORE units receive a 5+++ to MW while within 9" of the Vexilus Praetor.
Points are standardized for all Vexilla.

New Stratagem: 2CP 'Unfurl the Standard' - Select a VEXILUS PRAETOR on the battlefield. Until the end of this phase, change the Vexilus he is carrying to a different one. This may not be used on a Vexilus Praetor wielding a relic Vexilus.

Eagle's Eye Relic: Grants the bearer a 3++ and, additionally, the bearer fights first in every combat unless your opponent also has a fight first ability in which case follow the Rare Rules for this scenario.

Admonimortus Relic: Strength changed to x2.

The Veiled Blade: Melee statline changed to the new Sentinel Blade.

Gatekeeper: Melee statline changed to the new Guardian Spear.

Relic Vexilus:
Wrath Angelis: The 'once per battle' ability is changed to 'once per battle round'.
Fulminaris Aggressor: Range of shooting increased to 12" and Assault 2D6. Melee changed to the new Guardian Spear.
Faith Absolute: Reworked. Bearer now provides an aura for Custodes and Sisters CORE units making enemy MELEE attacks have -1 to Wound them within 6".

Alright, that's just off the top of my head for this thread.



I like all of this, except for the shield host change, since not all of the warlord traits are auras. Instead i'd change it to be more in lines of us gaining a doctrine type ability and leave the WL traits alone. Basically we would, in our command phase, up to 3 times per game, gain an ability from our chosen shield host. Dread host would be reroll charges, shadowkeepers would be -1 strength to ranged attacks shooting 2 of our units, solar watch would be the enemies next strat cost 1 extra, aquillon shield would be pick a unit to bodyguard another unit, Emmisaries would be pick an enemy unit and we ignore all penalties to hit, wound, and save against that unit until our next command phase.

Also we know spears arent changing since we saw from the forgeworld update they arent. Making our swords and axes flat 2 will be fine though. They could also give the spears something in the codex though like on the charge gain +1dmg, or something like that.
We arent gaining any wounds either since aquillons didnt gain any.

Honestly i'd be fine if they just droped our spear guard down to 45pts, and dropped the sword guard down to 50pts.

Wardens do need some help, but i think just upping their FNP to 5+++ is gonna be fine.

Bikes need a points decrease though. Drop them down to 85 so they are the same as a destructor aquillon and they are balanced again. 95 is just too much for a 4 wound model without a FNP no matter how good they are. Like seriously, is +1sv (armor and invun) -4 wounds, and their melee worth it compared to a pallas (which i also think is overcosted by about 5 pts).


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Scarred Ultramarine Tyrannic War Veteran





 Jidmah wrote:
 JawRippa wrote:
 Jidmah wrote:
 JawRippa wrote:
 Jidmah wrote:
I guess I went a bit overboard.
- Choppas and Big choppas gain "An unmodified save roll of 1, 2 and 3 always fails"

I liked everything but this. Making boys great at countering terminators seems to go against the fluff. Why not just give an AP-1 if you want to counter 3+ armour?

Well, I didn't want them to get better against 4+ and 5+ armor because they already kill those units really good. But I guess someone designing marines would never have such concerns

Choppas could get a -1AP when targeting an armour save better than 4+. Has the same effect, but does not allow boys clobbering TEQ too easily.


That sounds much better, let's do that instead .


I also like the idea of any time they wouldn't be eligible for Shock/Hateful Assault (if they were marines) i.e. Not charging/charged/herocially intervening they get WAAGH! with a +1A and +1S

My WHFB armies were Bretonians and Tomb Kings. 
   
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Decrepit Dakkanaut






Falls Church, VA

Chaos Daemons:

I'd basically port the regular 30k Daemons list and rules into 9th edition. It's a much better reflection of the lore in the setting (they're Lovecraftian horrors from beyond reality rather than expy-Tyranids with invuln saves).

The deployment makes more sense, their army special rules make more sense, their wargear makes more sense, the missions they can play make more sense, and the army structure makes more sense.

Only problem is, they're literally infinitely flexible in terms of models (the army list only provides base size recommendations for different units). So studio-GW will never do this, because it allows the players too much freedom in having their fun.

It's also the textbook example of a "generic" list that is better at doing specific Your Dudes than a tailored list.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/11/13 13:51:09


 
   
Made in us
Slaanesh Veteran Marine with Tentacles






Tau:
No psychic options whatsoever
No melee options beyond status quo.
Give shapers the ability to add +1 to S, T, A or 2" of movement in a radius around them for all kroot units. Traits are selected after deployment. May be changed if an enemy unit is killed within 6" of the shaper. Multiple shapers do not stack.
Get rid of the Kauyon/Montka global limit of 1 per game. Kauyon stays the same, but montka is now: rapid fire weapons may move but not advance in the assault phase if they did not move in the movement phase. Assault weapons may move AND advance. Heavy weapons can only move D3(non-flying models) or D6(flying models) inches.
Cadre Fireblades get a similar ability but it only works on <Sept> infantry. (no kroot but finally does something meaningful for breachers)
Markerlights ignore hit modifiers.
+1 hit and ignore hit modifiers at 4 ML and reroll wounds of 1 on 5ML. Move and shoot heavy weapons gets bundled with seeker missiles at 2ML.
Savior protocols needs to go. Allow big units of drones to squad up with suits/infantry, but they can only tank hits for units they are attached to. Drones don't count for morale. Drones can only be attached/detached at the start of movement but you may detach and reattach to a different suit within range in the same turn. Use the non-drone model's toughness for wounding.
Commander rule is changed to follow the similar rules as relics. 1 per army is free, an additional commander costs 1 CP and additional 2 costs 3 CP. Farsight has no penalty/cost. The named Commanders do not count towards this.
S5 AP0 weapons need to be broken up so they have meaningful differences. Pulse rifles get AP-1, carbines go to Assault 3, and Burst cannons Assault 5 AP-1. blasters/pistols are probably fine, SMS and CRS are probably fine too.
Tau plasma goes to flat D2 so it is different from imperial plasma without just being worse in every way.
Tau fusion just needs the same treatment as other melta. Melta rifles make Tau fusion's "superior" range awkward though so maybe they use 2/3 instead of 1/2 range for melta range to compensate.

Ideally this would make them more mobile/synergistic and fix some of the transitional pains for 9th, but quite a few things would need point adjustments. Hopefully this makes them quality shooting vs IG's quantity shooting. Although the Commanders/Fireblades feel a bit like a single use AOE version of IG orders.
   
 
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