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Made in us
Rogue Grot Kannon Gunna





Atlanta, GA

 tauist wrote:
Intriguing.

I had a hunch we might see 2W Ork troops during 9th Edition. Makes sense to me.

I wonder how well the torsos will be kitbashable with existing arms & heads.. Plenty of folks upscaling their firstborn marine armies with interecessor torsos, you could potentially do the same with these?



They won't be. GW has no interest in making these new orks backwards compatible with the existing boyz kit, my guess is they'll be $55 for 10.

Look at the right shoulder, there's no way you're fitting arms from the current boyz kit on there without some serious muscle resculpting and cutting.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Can't wait for the "Tranzork Fizzyologee" stratagem.




I NEED this in my life.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
yukishiro1 wrote:
Doubt you're going to find anyone willing to be on the other side of that bet.


I will!

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/20 14:38:53


   
Made in us
Preacher of the Emperor





Hanford, CA, AKA The Eye of Terror

(GW Studios: One Year Ago)

Staffer: Sir! The fans are saying the Ork sculpts are getting too old and they want something new!

James Workshop: Alright then! Lets make some Feral Orks and give them a whole new sculpt with a uniquely themed army they can enjoy, collect, and spend some money on, Everyone wins!

Staffer: We'll get on it!

(GW studios today)

Staffrer: Sir! They didn't like it!

James Workshop: Why not? We made them big and orky, they have a whole new theme, they're bigger and meaner looking, Hell, they're riding damned squigs! What went wrong?

Staffer: Apparently they wanted more of the same, and they keep going on about primaris Orks.....

James Workshop: *flips table* thats it, there will terrible rules in the new Ork book, no more new sculpts, and open the primaris LT vault, I'll show them more of the same...Oh and screw up the release of Cursed City for good measure, everyone will suffer for this.

17,000 points (Valhallan, Cadian, and Vostroyan)
10,000 points
4,000 points (Order of Our Martyred Lady)
Proud Countess of House Terryn hosting 4 Knights, 2 Dominus Knights, and 5 Armigers
Stormcast Eternals: 7,000 points
"Remember, Orks are weak and cowardly, they are easily beat in close combat and their tusks, while menacing, can easily be pulled out with a sharp tug"

-Imperial Guard Uplifting Primer 
   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

That'd be funny if it weren't so disingenuous.

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in it
Gargantuan Gargant




Italy

 generalchaos34 wrote:


Staffer: Sir! The fans are saying the Ork sculpts are getting too old and they want something new!



Very few ork players actually think that. They want plastic models for metal/finecast kits and stuff their codex lacks. Not a new line of models.

Orks 7000
Space Wolves 4000
 
   
Made in de
Longtime Dakkanaut




 Eonfuzz wrote:

I'm personally upset about this. Why not just release a redesign? Why for all intents an purposes design a Slugga Boy +1.
We have Nobz for that? We have Skarboyz for that?

Argh.


Same reason they made all that "Primars"-stuff up and didn't just release those kits as updated Marine sculpts.

They don't want to invalidate existing armies after the WHF -> AoS backlash.

It's a simple enough fluff-tweak that gives people another decade or two with their "legacy"-miniatures, if they so choose.
   
Made in us
Preacher of the Emperor





Hanford, CA, AKA The Eye of Terror

 Blackie wrote:
 generalchaos34 wrote:


Staffer: Sir! The fans are saying the Ork sculpts are getting too old and they want something new!



Very few ork players actually think that. They want plastic models for metal/finecast kits and stuff their codex lacks. Not a new line of models.


I was more channeling the Hobby at large and how GW would read it even if it was the wrong read to begin with. Also it was my poor attempt at comedy and my commentary at the fact that GW can never win no matter what they do and when they get close they manage to screw it up on their own end.

17,000 points (Valhallan, Cadian, and Vostroyan)
10,000 points
4,000 points (Order of Our Martyred Lady)
Proud Countess of House Terryn hosting 4 Knights, 2 Dominus Knights, and 5 Armigers
Stormcast Eternals: 7,000 points
"Remember, Orks are weak and cowardly, they are easily beat in close combat and their tusks, while menacing, can easily be pulled out with a sharp tug"

-Imperial Guard Uplifting Primer 
   
Made in ch
Warped Arch Heretic of Chaos





 generalchaos34 wrote:
 Blackie wrote:
 generalchaos34 wrote:


Staffer: Sir! The fans are saying the Ork sculpts are getting too old and they want something new!



Very few ork players actually think that. They want plastic models for metal/finecast kits and stuff their codex lacks. Not a new line of models.


I was more channeling the Hobby at large and how GW would read it even if it was the wrong read to begin with. Also it was my poor attempt at comedy and my commentary at the fact that GW can never win no matter what they do and when they get close they manage to screw it up on their own end.


and here i thought the belakor update was regarded modelwise atleast, as pretty universally good to great?

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page
A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.

 Daedalus81 wrote:

In the 41st millennium there is only overpriced hamberders.

 
   
Made in us
Preacher of the Emperor





Hanford, CA, AKA The Eye of Terror

Not Online!!! wrote:
 generalchaos34 wrote:
 Blackie wrote:
 generalchaos34 wrote:


Staffer: Sir! The fans are saying the Ork sculpts are getting too old and they want something new!



Very few ork players actually think that. They want plastic models for metal/finecast kits and stuff their codex lacks. Not a new line of models.


I was more channeling the Hobby at large and how GW would read it even if it was the wrong read to begin with. Also it was my poor attempt at comedy and my commentary at the fact that GW can never win no matter what they do and when they get close they manage to screw it up on their own end.


and here i thought the belakor update was regarded modelwise atleast, as pretty universally good to great?


Except they already sold out....and they put in the wrong assembly instructions....and theres no 40k rules included.....so no winning

17,000 points (Valhallan, Cadian, and Vostroyan)
10,000 points
4,000 points (Order of Our Martyred Lady)
Proud Countess of House Terryn hosting 4 Knights, 2 Dominus Knights, and 5 Armigers
Stormcast Eternals: 7,000 points
"Remember, Orks are weak and cowardly, they are easily beat in close combat and their tusks, while menacing, can easily be pulled out with a sharp tug"

-Imperial Guard Uplifting Primer 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Ambitious Archon





Port Carmine

Not Online!!! wrote:


and here i thought the belakor update was regarded modelwise atleast, as pretty universally good to great?


'Boringly generic demon' gets an efficient, but uninspired update to 'larger boringly generic demon'.

Kabal of the Mon-keigh's Paw
Coven of the Screaming Statues
Cult of Veiled Malice

"Death is only a concern if you're both weak enough to be killed and dumb enough not to arrange your own resurrection." PM713
 
   
Made in us
Omnipotent Necron Overlord






 harlokin wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:


and here i thought the belakor update was regarded modelwise atleast, as pretty universally good to great?


'Boringly generic demon' gets an efficient, but uninspired update to 'larger boringly generic demon'.

How is what is essentially the first daemon prince...the most boring and generic?

If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder 
   
Made in us
Ancient Chaos Terminator




The dark hollows of Kentucky

 Xenomancers wrote:
 harlokin wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:


and here i thought the belakor update was regarded modelwise atleast, as pretty universally good to great?


'Boringly generic demon' gets an efficient, but uninspired update to 'larger boringly generic demon'.

How is what is essentially the first daemon prince...the most boring and generic?

"Subjective opinion", that's how. Everybody's got one.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





 Gadzilla666 wrote:
"Subjective opinion", that's how. Everybody's got one.


Oh, yea? Well that opinion sucks!

I'll be bringing him to beatdowns...right after I can afford a Monolith and a Son of Behemat ( I don't even play AoS right now ) and...

   
Made in us
Shadowy Grot Kommittee Memba






 Xenomancers wrote:
 harlokin wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:


and here i thought the belakor update was regarded modelwise atleast, as pretty universally good to great?


'Boringly generic demon' gets an efficient, but uninspired update to 'larger boringly generic demon'.

How is what is essentially the first daemon prince...the most boring and generic?


Probably because he's just kind of a gray demon with a sword? If you went around and asked people 'draw a demon' you'd probably get an average result pretty close to belakor.

"I can't believe all these tryhard WAACs out there just care about winning all the time when it's supposed to be a game for fun!!!!!!! Also here's my 27 page essay on why marines are OP and Orkz should get a bunch of OP rules so I can win more games

-the_scotsman"

-ERJAK 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




NE Ohio, USA

 Xenomancers wrote:
 harlokin wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:


and here i thought the belakor update was regarded modelwise atleast, as pretty universally good to great?


'Boringly generic demon' gets an efficient, but uninspired update to 'larger boringly generic demon'.

How is what is essentially the first daemon prince...the most boring and generic?


Well, I've never been inspired to spend a dime on the previous model. I just find it.... meh. The new model at least looks damned cool.
I'm 100% more likely to at least consider using models I like.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
 the_scotsman wrote:

Probably because he's just kind of a gray demon with a sword? If you went around and asked people 'draw a demon' you'd probably get an average result pretty close to belakor.


Exactly.
He's still just a gray demon with a sword, but now with a much cooler sculpt.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/20 16:21:15


 
   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





I don't really think this is a primaris parallel. this is not a complete overhaul of the Ork army replacing all units with new units that have a slightly better stat line.

its just a few more units for Orks. unless you now something

they also aren't shoe horning some new storyline in to justify the model releases.

what concerns me, seeing this, is that CSM won't go to 2W across the board but will get a new 2W veteran unit
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





mrFickle wrote:
what concerns me, seeing this, is that CSM won't go to 2W across the board but will get a new 2W veteran unit


CSM got their new models and GW already stated they would go to W2.

   
Made in au
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Versteckt in den Schatten deines Geistes.

 Daedalus81 wrote:
CSM got their new models and GW already stated they would go to W2.
I wonder more about what Chaos will lose than what they'll gain...

Industrial Insanity - My Terrain Blog
"GW really needs to understand 'Less is more' when it comes to AoS." - Wha-Mu-077

 
   
Made in us
Da Head Honcho Boss Grot




New Jersey, State of Perfection

Sunny Side Up wrote:
 Eonfuzz wrote:

I'm personally upset about this. Why not just release a redesign? Why for all intents an purposes design a Slugga Boy +1.
We have Nobz for that? We have Skarboyz for that?

Argh.


Same reason they made all that "Primars"-stuff up and didn't just release those kits as updated Marine sculpts.

They don't want to invalidate existing armies after the WHF -> AoS backlash.

It's a simple enough fluff-tweak that gives people another decade or two with their "legacy"-miniatures, if they so choose.


Nah, its part of a long term operating paradigm. If Primaris were just a new sculpt for tactical marines then GW would have to include in the kit parts for a whole bunch of special and heavy weapon options, etc. to mirror the tactical marines kit - if they didn't then they would just feed a secondary market of 3d printed and resin cast bits sellers. Instead they release it as a new kit for a new unit with new fluff and less options. Then they follow it up with a half dozen other kits for very similar units each toting their own distinct weapon system, so players have to buy another half dozen boxes to get a mix of weapon types and capabilities in their army. Then, in a few years as sales start to taper off they re-release the same kits but with an extra sprue with a powerfist for the sergeant or a close combat weapon loadout, etc. so players have to pick up a few more boxes worth in order to round out their units with options. Rinse/repeat ad nauseum every few years until these units all possess as many weapon options as a tactical marine squad which has conveniently and quietly been removed from sale some years prior and is no longer available. Then a completely recut kit of intercessors, called Tactical Intercessors, is released covering all the previous options covered by the tac. marines and intercessors kits, plus some additional new options, tactical marines are rendered obsolete but its okay because you can just field them as tactical intercessors now if you haven't already given up on firstborn and moved on to the new shinyness. Once again existing players go out to buy a few more boxes to round out their collections, etc. rinse repeat with other mainline units, etc.

GW can stand to make a lot more in sales over a decade by selling people the same kits over and over again by incrementallEvery time theres a wholesale re-issue of asn existing kit you lose a fraction of your potential sales to established player and collectors saying "no thanks, already got mine, I'm good".y upgrading those kits with some additional content every so many years for the cost of very minimal additional design and production overhead vs. just doing 1:1 replacements of existing units in one go. 1:1 replacements have their own built-in inefficiencies from a sales/profit standpoint, every time theres a wholesale re-issue of asn existing kit you lose a fraction of your potential sales to established player and collectors saying "no thanks, already got mine, I'm good". The only time that 1:1 replacement makes sense really seems to be for kits that weren't already in plastic (Drukhari Incubi, Aeldari Howling Banshees, etc.) or the existing plastic sculpts were aged and dated enough to no longer fit modern "standards" (Necron Warriors - Boyz may prove themselves in time to fall in this category after all).

In order to maximize potential return on investment in the production of new kits there needs to be an incentive to existing customers that own the obsolete product to recapitalize their collection, the best way to do that is to offer them a value proposition that basically says "Even though you already own 6 boxes worth of this unit, buying 3 more boxes will give you the ability to switch outargear your bolt rifles in each squad with promethium-throwers or plasmatic arc-rifles". If they can then get you to make that same decision a half-dozen more times as they round out the weapon options, then they have essentially sold you 27 boxes of Intercessors This is a potentially extreme example, but you get the point - how many people out there already owned 3-6 units of Intercessors and went out to buy 2+ boxes of Assault Intercessors, and are in line to buy 2+ boxes of Heavy Intercessors? If they had released all that as part of one kit (well... maybe not the Heavy Intercessors) from the get-go you would have had people buying only a few boxes of the kit and magnetizing parts so they could hot-swap between options instead of building to the loadout. (plus all the Incursors, Reivers, Infiltrators, etc.) instead of the 6 boxes of embiggened tactical marines that you might have otherwise ended up buying to modernize your existing army.

This ain't no pansy GW Armor, son - Digital Sculpting Plog, Now with Heavy Weapon Platforms!
Sympathy for the Devil, or: The Project Log from Hell

Ma55ter_fett wrote:It reads like the ramblings of a Nigerian lobotomized Shakespeare typed into a cellphone with a very aggressive autocomplete function.
 
   
Made in gb
[DCM]
Ambitious Archon





Port Carmine

 the_scotsman wrote:
 Xenomancers wrote:
 harlokin wrote:
Not Online!!! wrote:


and here i thought the belakor update was regarded modelwise atleast, as pretty universally good to great?


'Boringly generic demon' gets an efficient, but uninspired update to 'larger boringly generic demon'.

How is what is essentially the first daemon prince...the most boring and generic?


Probably because he's just kind of a gray demon with a sword? If you went around and asked people 'draw a demon' you'd probably get an average result pretty close to belakor.


Exactly this.

Compare Belakor to the amazing sculpts of Dexcessa and Synessa; Belakor is dull as ditchwater...with chains, lots of chains to make him kewl.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2021/04/20 16:57:56


Kabal of the Mon-keigh's Paw
Coven of the Screaming Statues
Cult of Veiled Malice

"Death is only a concern if you're both weak enough to be killed and dumb enough not to arrange your own resurrection." PM713
 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




NE Ohio, USA

Spoiler:
chaos0xomega wrote:
Sunny Side Up wrote:
 Eonfuzz wrote:

I'm personally upset about this. Why not just release a redesign? Why for all intents an purposes design a Slugga Boy +1.
We have Nobz for that? We have Skarboyz for that?

Argh.


Same reason they made all that "Primars"-stuff up and didn't just release those kits as updated Marine sculpts.

They don't want to invalidate existing armies after the WHF -> AoS backlash.

It's a simple enough fluff-tweak that gives people another decade or two with their "legacy"-miniatures, if they so choose.


Nah, its part of a long term operating paradigm. If Primaris were just a new sculpt for tactical marines then GW would have to include in the kit parts for a whole bunch of special and heavy weapon options, etc. to mirror the tactical marines kit - if they didn't then they would just feed a secondary market of 3d printed and resin cast bits sellers. Instead they release it as a new kit for a new unit with new fluff and less options. Then they follow it up with a half dozen other kits for very similar units each toting their own distinct weapon system, so players have to buy another half dozen boxes to get a mix of weapon types and capabilities in their army. Then, in a few years as sales start to taper off they re-release the same kits but with an extra sprue with a powerfist for the sergeant or a close combat weapon loadout, etc. so players have to pick up a few more boxes worth in order to round out their units with options. Rinse/repeat ad nauseum every few years until these units all possess as many weapon options as a tactical marine squad which has conveniently and quietly been removed from sale some years prior and is no longer available. Then a completely recut kit of intercessors, called Tactical Intercessors, is released covering all the previous options covered by the tac. marines and intercessors kits, plus some additional new options, tactical marines are rendered obsolete but its okay because you can just field them as tactical intercessors now if you haven't already given up on firstborn and moved on to the new shinyness. Once again existing players go out to buy a few more boxes to round out their collections, etc. rinse repeat with other mainline units, etc.

GW can stand to make a lot more in sales over a decade by selling people the same kits over and over again by incrementallEvery time theres a wholesale re-issue of asn existing kit you lose a fraction of your potential sales to established player and collectors saying "no thanks, already got mine, I'm good".y upgrading those kits with some additional content every so many years for the cost of very minimal additional design and production overhead vs. just doing 1:1 replacements of existing units in one go. 1:1 replacements have their own built-in inefficiencies from a sales/profit standpoint, every time theres a wholesale re-issue of asn existing kit you lose a fraction of your potential sales to established player and collectors saying "no thanks, already got mine, I'm good". The only time that 1:1 replacement makes sense really seems to be for kits that weren't already in plastic (Drukhari Incubi, Aeldari Howling Banshees, etc.) or the existing plastic sculpts were aged and dated enough to no longer fit modern "standards" (Necron Warriors - Boyz may prove themselves in time to fall in this category after all).

In order to maximize potential return on investment in the production of new kits there needs to be an incentive to existing customers that own the obsolete product to recapitalize their collection, the best way to do that is to offer them a value proposition that basically says "Even though you already own 6 boxes worth of this unit, buying 3 more boxes will give you the ability to switch outargear your bolt rifles in each squad with promethium-throwers or plasmatic arc-rifles". If they can then get you to make that same decision a half-dozen more times as they round out the weapon options, then they have essentially sold you 27 boxes of Intercessors This is a potentially extreme example, but you get the point - how many people out there already owned 3-6 units of Intercessors and went out to buy 2+ boxes of Assault Intercessors, and are in line to buy 2+ boxes of Heavy Intercessors? If they had released all that as part of one kit (well... maybe not the Heavy Intercessors) from the get-go you would have had people buying only a few boxes of the kit and magnetizing parts so they could hot-swap between options instead of building to the loadout. (plus all the Incursors, Reivers, Infiltrators, etc.) instead of the 6 boxes of embiggened tactical marines that you might have otherwise ended up buying to modernize your existing army.


Or, you know, I can just order bitz - official GW on EBay, or 3rd party, or 3d print what I need - & magnetize rather than buying entire kits.
   
Made in us
Ancient Chaos Terminator




The dark hollows of Kentucky

mrFickle wrote:I don't really think this is a primaris parallel. this is not a complete overhaul of the Ork army replacing all units with new units that have a slightly better stat line.

its just a few more units for Orks. unless you now something

they also aren't shoe horning some new storyline in to justify the model releases.

what concerns me, seeing this, is that CSM won't go to 2W across the board but will get a new 2W veteran unit

CSM already have veteran units, they're called Chosen and Cult Marines, and we already know they're going to 2W. They just need new models (yes, I know we already have new Plague Marines and Rubrics).

H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Daedalus81 wrote:
CSM got their new models and GW already stated they would go to W2.
I wonder more about what Chaos will lose than what they'll gain...

*looks at Plague Marines datasheet. Shudders *
   
Made in us
Da Head Honcho Boss Grot




New Jersey, State of Perfection

ccs wrote:
Spoiler:
chaos0xomega wrote:
Sunny Side Up wrote:
 Eonfuzz wrote:

I'm personally upset about this. Why not just release a redesign? Why for all intents an purposes design a Slugga Boy +1.
We have Nobz for that? We have Skarboyz for that?

Argh.


Same reason they made all that "Primars"-stuff up and didn't just release those kits as updated Marine sculpts.

They don't want to invalidate existing armies after the WHF -> AoS backlash.

It's a simple enough fluff-tweak that gives people another decade or two with their "legacy"-miniatures, if they so choose.


Nah, its part of a long term operating paradigm. If Primaris were just a new sculpt for tactical marines then GW would have to include in the kit parts for a whole bunch of special and heavy weapon options, etc. to mirror the tactical marines kit - if they didn't then they would just feed a secondary market of 3d printed and resin cast bits sellers. Instead they release it as a new kit for a new unit with new fluff and less options. Then they follow it up with a half dozen other kits for very similar units each toting their own distinct weapon system, so players have to buy another half dozen boxes to get a mix of weapon types and capabilities in their army. Then, in a few years as sales start to taper off they re-release the same kits but with an extra sprue with a powerfist for the sergeant or a close combat weapon loadout, etc. so players have to pick up a few more boxes worth in order to round out their units with options. Rinse/repeat ad nauseum every few years until these units all possess as many weapon options as a tactical marine squad which has conveniently and quietly been removed from sale some years prior and is no longer available. Then a completely recut kit of intercessors, called Tactical Intercessors, is released covering all the previous options covered by the tac. marines and intercessors kits, plus some additional new options, tactical marines are rendered obsolete but its okay because you can just field them as tactical intercessors now if you haven't already given up on firstborn and moved on to the new shinyness. Once again existing players go out to buy a few more boxes to round out their collections, etc. rinse repeat with other mainline units, etc.

GW can stand to make a lot more in sales over a decade by selling people the same kits over and over again by incrementallEvery time theres a wholesale re-issue of asn existing kit you lose a fraction of your potential sales to established player and collectors saying "no thanks, already got mine, I'm good".y upgrading those kits with some additional content every so many years for the cost of very minimal additional design and production overhead vs. just doing 1:1 replacements of existing units in one go. 1:1 replacements have their own built-in inefficiencies from a sales/profit standpoint, every time theres a wholesale re-issue of asn existing kit you lose a fraction of your potential sales to established player and collectors saying "no thanks, already got mine, I'm good". The only time that 1:1 replacement makes sense really seems to be for kits that weren't already in plastic (Drukhari Incubi, Aeldari Howling Banshees, etc.) or the existing plastic sculpts were aged and dated enough to no longer fit modern "standards" (Necron Warriors - Boyz may prove themselves in time to fall in this category after all).

In order to maximize potential return on investment in the production of new kits there needs to be an incentive to existing customers that own the obsolete product to recapitalize their collection, the best way to do that is to offer them a value proposition that basically says "Even though you already own 6 boxes worth of this unit, buying 3 more boxes will give you the ability to switch outargear your bolt rifles in each squad with promethium-throwers or plasmatic arc-rifles". If they can then get you to make that same decision a half-dozen more times as they round out the weapon options, then they have essentially sold you 27 boxes of Intercessors This is a potentially extreme example, but you get the point - how many people out there already owned 3-6 units of Intercessors and went out to buy 2+ boxes of Assault Intercessors, and are in line to buy 2+ boxes of Heavy Intercessors? If they had released all that as part of one kit (well... maybe not the Heavy Intercessors) from the get-go you would have had people buying only a few boxes of the kit and magnetizing parts so they could hot-swap between options instead of building to the loadout. (plus all the Incursors, Reivers, Infiltrators, etc.) instead of the 6 boxes of embiggened tactical marines that you might have otherwise ended up buying to modernize your existing army.


Or, you know, I can just order bitz - official GW on EBay, or 3rd party, or 3d print what I need - & magnetize rather than buying entire kits.


The bits industry has mostly dried up and died out, and given GWs new approach to monopose sculpts, etc. I'm guessing that you're not likely to find much of what you're looking for to enable that. Besides that, is it even possible to magnetize a kit of regular intercessors to become assault intercessors (let alone heavy intercessors)? Reivers/Incursors/Infiltrators seem to be off the table, as do Hellblasters. Hows that working out for you?

This ain't no pansy GW Armor, son - Digital Sculpting Plog, Now with Heavy Weapon Platforms!
Sympathy for the Devil, or: The Project Log from Hell

Ma55ter_fett wrote:It reads like the ramblings of a Nigerian lobotomized Shakespeare typed into a cellphone with a very aggressive autocomplete function.
 
   
Made in us
Omnipotent Necron Overlord






 Gadzilla666 wrote:
mrFickle wrote:I don't really think this is a primaris parallel. this is not a complete overhaul of the Ork army replacing all units with new units that have a slightly better stat line.

its just a few more units for Orks. unless you now something

they also aren't shoe horning some new storyline in to justify the model releases.

what concerns me, seeing this, is that CSM won't go to 2W across the board but will get a new 2W veteran unit

CSM already have veteran units, they're called Chosen and Cult Marines, and we already know they're going to 2W. They just need new models (yes, I know we already have new Plague Marines and Rubrics).

H.B.M.C. wrote:
 Daedalus81 wrote:
CSM got their new models and GW already stated they would go to W2.
I wonder more about what Chaos will lose than what they'll gain...

*looks at Plague Marines datasheet. Shudders *

What is the hold up on this?!?!

If we fail to anticipate the unforeseen or expect the unexpected in a universe of infinite possibilities, we may find ourselves at the mercy of anyone or anything that cannot be programmed, categorized or easily referenced.
- Fox Mulder 
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




NE Ohio, USA

chaos0xomega wrote:


Or, you know, I can just order bitz - official GW on EBay, or 3rd party, or 3d print what I need - & magnetize rather than buying entire kits.


The bits industry has mostly dried up and died out, and given GWs new approach to monopose sculpts, etc. I'm guessing that you're not likely to find much of what you're looking for to enable that. Besides that, is it even possible to magnetize a kit of regular intercessors to become assault intercessors (let alone heavy intercessors)? Reivers/Incursors/Infiltrators seem to be off the table, as do Hellblasters. Hows that working out for you?


I guarantee you that I can find anything I desire. Or at least a file for it.
I also guarantee you that I can magnetize virtually anything as I actually have modeling skills.
(now of course turning an Intercessor into a Heavy Intercessor isn't practical as they're completely different armor types - that be the same as turning a Tac marine into a Terminator - I.E. not happening)

So it's working out just fine for me.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




NE Ohio, USA

chaos0xomega wrote:
ccs wrote:
Spoiler:
chaos0xomega wrote:
Sunny Side Up wrote:
 Eonfuzz wrote:

I'm personally upset about this. Why not just release a redesign? Why for all intents an purposes design a Slugga Boy +1.
We have Nobz for that? We have Skarboyz for that?

Argh.


Same reason they made all that "Primars"-stuff up and didn't just release those kits as updated Marine sculpts.

They don't want to invalidate existing armies after the WHF -> AoS backlash.

It's a simple enough fluff-tweak that gives people another decade or two with their "legacy"-miniatures, if they so choose.


Nah, its part of a long term operating paradigm. If Primaris were just a new sculpt for tactical marines then GW would have to include in the kit parts for a whole bunch of special and heavy weapon options, etc. to mirror the tactical marines kit - if they didn't then they would just feed a secondary market of 3d printed and resin cast bits sellers. Instead they release it as a new kit for a new unit with new fluff and less options. Then they follow it up with a half dozen other kits for very similar units each toting their own distinct weapon system, so players have to buy another half dozen boxes to get a mix of weapon types and capabilities in their army. Then, in a few years as sales start to taper off they re-release the same kits but with an extra sprue with a powerfist for the sergeant or a close combat weapon loadout, etc. so players have to pick up a few more boxes worth in order to round out their units with options. Rinse/repeat ad nauseum every few years until these units all possess as many weapon options as a tactical marine squad which has conveniently and quietly been removed from sale some years prior and is no longer available. Then a completely recut kit of intercessors, called Tactical Intercessors, is released covering all the previous options covered by the tac. marines and intercessors kits, plus some additional new options, tactical marines are rendered obsolete but its okay because you can just field them as tactical intercessors now if you haven't already given up on firstborn and moved on to the new shinyness. Once again existing players go out to buy a few more boxes to round out their collections, etc. rinse repeat with other mainline units, etc.

GW can stand to make a lot more in sales over a decade by selling people the same kits over and over again by incrementallEvery time theres a wholesale re-issue of asn existing kit you lose a fraction of your potential sales to established player and collectors saying "no thanks, already got mine, I'm good".y upgrading those kits with some additional content every so many years for the cost of very minimal additional design and production overhead vs. just doing 1:1 replacements of existing units in one go. 1:1 replacements have their own built-in inefficiencies from a sales/profit standpoint, every time theres a wholesale re-issue of asn existing kit you lose a fraction of your potential sales to established player and collectors saying "no thanks, already got mine, I'm good". The only time that 1:1 replacement makes sense really seems to be for kits that weren't already in plastic (Drukhari Incubi, Aeldari Howling Banshees, etc.) or the existing plastic sculpts were aged and dated enough to no longer fit modern "standards" (Necron Warriors - Boyz may prove themselves in time to fall in this category after all).

In order to maximize potential return on investment in the production of new kits there needs to be an incentive to existing customers that own the obsolete product to recapitalize their collection, the best way to do that is to offer them a value proposition that basically says "Even though you already own 6 boxes worth of this unit, buying 3 more boxes will give you the ability to switch outargear your bolt rifles in each squad with promethium-throwers or plasmatic arc-rifles". If they can then get you to make that same decision a half-dozen more times as they round out the weapon options, then they have essentially sold you 27 boxes of Intercessors This is a potentially extreme example, but you get the point - how many people out there already owned 3-6 units of Intercessors and went out to buy 2+ boxes of Assault Intercessors, and are in line to buy 2+ boxes of Heavy Intercessors? If they had released all that as part of one kit (well... maybe not the Heavy Intercessors) from the get-go you would have had people buying only a few boxes of the kit and magnetizing parts so they could hot-swap between options instead of building to the loadout. (plus all the Incursors, Reivers, Infiltrators, etc.) instead of the 6 boxes of embiggened tactical marines that you might have otherwise ended up buying to modernize your existing army.


Or, you know, I can just order bitz - official GW on EBay, or 3rd party, or 3d print what I need - & magnetize rather than buying entire kits.


The bits industry has mostly dried up and died out, and given GWs new approach to monopose sculpts, etc. I'm guessing that you're not likely to find much of what you're looking for to enable that. Besides that, is it even possible to magnetize a kit of regular intercessors to become assault intercessors (let alone heavy intercessors)? Reivers/Incursors/Infiltrators seem to be off the table, as do Hellblasters. Hows that working out for you?


I guarantee you that I can find anything I desire. Or at least a file for it.
I also guarantee you that I can magnetize virtually anything as I actually have modeling skills.
(now of course turning an Intercessor into a Heavy Intercessor isn't practical as they're completely different armor types - that be the same as turning a Tac marine into a Terminator - I.E. not happening)

So it's working out just fine for me.
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





chaos0xomega wrote:

The bits industry has mostly dried up and died out, and given GWs new approach to monopose sculpts, etc. I'm guessing that you're not likely to find much of what you're looking for to enable that. Besides that, is it even possible to magnetize a kit of regular intercessors to become assault intercessors (let alone heavy intercessors)? Reivers/Incursors/Infiltrators seem to be off the table, as do Hellblasters. Hows that working out for you?


On the contrary with 3D printing bitz have never been so ubiquitous.

   
Made in gb
Sagitarius with a Big F'in Gun




Bath

 Xenomancers wrote:


H.B.M.C. wrote:
*looks at Plague Marines datasheet. Shudders *

What is the hold up on this?!?!



the hold up is that the new plauge marines datasheet is written in a very odd manner, but it basically says you can have anything thats in the box, but only in the quantities that they come in the box. so, up to one plague knife, up to one of butobic axe, etc.

the net effect is no matter what you build form the box, it will be a legal squad build (and in the old plague marine box, it was possible to build them into a illegal configuration if you werent paying attention or didnt know better, so this something of an improvement), BUT you cant specialise the squad towards any of those weapon options because you can only have one of a given weapons option, like you could with the old plague marine sheets, which has annoyed people who went out and bought lots of boxes so they can have a squad all armed with, say bubotic axes, or flails of corruption.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/04/20 18:27:24


Then it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an` Tommy, 'ow's yer soul? "
But it's " Thin red line of 'eroes " when the drums begin to roll
The drums begin to roll, my boys, the drums begin to roll,
O it's " Thin red line of 'eroes, " when the drums begin to roll.
"Tommy", Rudyard Kipling
500pts
1000 pts
 
   
Made in us
Da Head Honcho Boss Grot




New Jersey, State of Perfection

ccs wrote:
chaos0xomega wrote:
ccs wrote:
Spoiler:
chaos0xomega wrote:
Sunny Side Up wrote:
 Eonfuzz wrote:

I'm personally upset about this. Why not just release a redesign? Why for all intents an purposes design a Slugga Boy +1.
We have Nobz for that? We have Skarboyz for that?

Argh.


Same reason they made all that "Primars"-stuff up and didn't just release those kits as updated Marine sculpts.

They don't want to invalidate existing armies after the WHF -> AoS backlash.

It's a simple enough fluff-tweak that gives people another decade or two with their "legacy"-miniatures, if they so choose.


Nah, its part of a long term operating paradigm. If Primaris were just a new sculpt for tactical marines then GW would have to include in the kit parts for a whole bunch of special and heavy weapon options, etc. to mirror the tactical marines kit - if they didn't then they would just feed a secondary market of 3d printed and resin cast bits sellers. Instead they release it as a new kit for a new unit with new fluff and less options. Then they follow it up with a half dozen other kits for very similar units each toting their own distinct weapon system, so players have to buy another half dozen boxes to get a mix of weapon types and capabilities in their army. Then, in a few years as sales start to taper off they re-release the same kits but with an extra sprue with a powerfist for the sergeant or a close combat weapon loadout, etc. so players have to pick up a few more boxes worth in order to round out their units with options. Rinse/repeat ad nauseum every few years until these units all possess as many weapon options as a tactical marine squad which has conveniently and quietly been removed from sale some years prior and is no longer available. Then a completely recut kit of intercessors, called Tactical Intercessors, is released covering all the previous options covered by the tac. marines and intercessors kits, plus some additional new options, tactical marines are rendered obsolete but its okay because you can just field them as tactical intercessors now if you haven't already given up on firstborn and moved on to the new shinyness. Once again existing players go out to buy a few more boxes to round out their collections, etc. rinse repeat with other mainline units, etc.

GW can stand to make a lot more in sales over a decade by selling people the same kits over and over again by incrementallEvery time theres a wholesale re-issue of asn existing kit you lose a fraction of your potential sales to established player and collectors saying "no thanks, already got mine, I'm good".y upgrading those kits with some additional content every so many years for the cost of very minimal additional design and production overhead vs. just doing 1:1 replacements of existing units in one go. 1:1 replacements have their own built-in inefficiencies from a sales/profit standpoint, every time theres a wholesale re-issue of asn existing kit you lose a fraction of your potential sales to established player and collectors saying "no thanks, already got mine, I'm good". The only time that 1:1 replacement makes sense really seems to be for kits that weren't already in plastic (Drukhari Incubi, Aeldari Howling Banshees, etc.) or the existing plastic sculpts were aged and dated enough to no longer fit modern "standards" (Necron Warriors - Boyz may prove themselves in time to fall in this category after all).

In order to maximize potential return on investment in the production of new kits there needs to be an incentive to existing customers that own the obsolete product to recapitalize their collection, the best way to do that is to offer them a value proposition that basically says "Even though you already own 6 boxes worth of this unit, buying 3 more boxes will give you the ability to switch outargear your bolt rifles in each squad with promethium-throwers or plasmatic arc-rifles". If they can then get you to make that same decision a half-dozen more times as they round out the weapon options, then they have essentially sold you 27 boxes of Intercessors This is a potentially extreme example, but you get the point - how many people out there already owned 3-6 units of Intercessors and went out to buy 2+ boxes of Assault Intercessors, and are in line to buy 2+ boxes of Heavy Intercessors? If they had released all that as part of one kit (well... maybe not the Heavy Intercessors) from the get-go you would have had people buying only a few boxes of the kit and magnetizing parts so they could hot-swap between options instead of building to the loadout. (plus all the Incursors, Reivers, Infiltrators, etc.) instead of the 6 boxes of embiggened tactical marines that you might have otherwise ended up buying to modernize your existing army.


Or, you know, I can just order bitz - official GW on EBay, or 3rd party, or 3d print what I need - & magnetize rather than buying entire kits.


The bits industry has mostly dried up and died out, and given GWs new approach to monopose sculpts, etc. I'm guessing that you're not likely to find much of what you're looking for to enable that. Besides that, is it even possible to magnetize a kit of regular intercessors to become assault intercessors (let alone heavy intercessors)? Reivers/Incursors/Infiltrators seem to be off the table, as do Hellblasters. Hows that working out for you?


I guarantee you that I can find anything I desire. Or at least a file for it.
I also guarantee you that I can magnetize virtually anything as I actually have modeling skills.
(now of course turning an Intercessor into a Heavy Intercessor isn't practical as they're completely different armor types - that be the same as turning a Tac marine into a Terminator - I.E. not happening)

So it's working out just fine for me.


So... have you magnetized any of those things? or are you just being a pretentious know-it-all? I'm seeing the snark of an internet smart-guy who thinks he has everything figured out, but I'm not seeing anything to actually back it up - so proof in the pudding: did you magnetize your intercessors (or whatever kit is relevant to your army if not Space Marines)? Or are you going to end up having to buy additional minis because you've already assembled and glued everything together like a rube without modelling skills because you, like everyone else, didn't have the foresight to anticipate the release of an updated kit?

Its hard to know to magnetize all your gak when you don't know that theres a reason to do so(because that reason is still years in the future). Everyone I know who magnetized their intercessors did so to swap between three types of bolt rifle, which is totally useless if you're trying to create compatibility with assault intercessors as the points you would need to magnetize for that compatibility are entirely different (and no amount of modeling skills is going to change that, you would basically have to disassemble your minis at that point to enable full arm swaps). Likewise, everyone who I've seen magnetize their assault intercessors made no accommodations for the potential of a future "Assault Intercessors with Jump Packs" kit, either because they haven't thought that far ahead or because they've acknowledged the futility of trying to enable compatibility with a part that doesn't exist yet. Maybe not so bad if you haven't painted your minis yet and don't mind pulling them apart to recut and remagnetize things to work, but thats not really who GW is lookign to milk in this scenario.

This ain't no pansy GW Armor, son - Digital Sculpting Plog, Now with Heavy Weapon Platforms!
Sympathy for the Devil, or: The Project Log from Hell

Ma55ter_fett wrote:It reads like the ramblings of a Nigerian lobotomized Shakespeare typed into a cellphone with a very aggressive autocomplete function.
 
   
Made in ca
Paramount Plague Censer Bearer





The new orks shown so far look really cool. I am looking forward to seeing what the whole range looks like, it's pretty fantastic stuff.

I was never too interested in ork models before, but these really peak my interest.

Space Wolves 4k
Harlequins 2k
Chaos Knights 2k
Sisters of Silence 1k
Skaven 3k
Spiderfangs 2k
Ossiarch Bonereapers 1k 
   
 
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