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Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

It could also just be the rendering art style they've chosen and the fact that renders always make a model appear far larger than they are in the hand. Apply paint to a real model and see it in person and some "cartoony" designs can appear far more serious and muted. Or oversized parts that look bold in a large render that fills your screen, just look normal when the model is only 1 or 2 inches tall in your hand. Heck sometimes those oversized parts are what turns a model from a display model to a gaming model. There's a fair few patreons in the 3D printing world having to slowly learn that whilst they can make 28mm realistic scale models that render fantastically; the ultra thin arrows and blades are just not "fun" to play with when they snap and break even getting off the supports.

Print Hunter
Check out the latest 3D print model releases!  
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





I'm really surprised as well by this move. If MWG didn't contact GW previously, I don't see how this can go "under the radar" given how blatant Dave is in his multiple videos about the campaign. It's not like MWG is a small channel having a small fanbase and no visibility on social medias. "Not-terminators"...come on. There were a kickstarter about not-craftworld eldars that was put down for far less than this.

Wouldn't be surprised as well if Dave didn't contact GW at all and thinks he can get away like this easily. Or just doesn't think too much in this field at all. He's the kind of guy that lets his passionate ideas take over the best of him, even when it's clearly a bad idea that can't end good (remember the T'au video debacle, for an example).

But hey, reality will hit them hard if GW decides to do so.

I don't see this project about selling .stl files at all. Given the advertisement and how far it apparently went, to me it's solely oriented towards selling high quality PVC miniatures at a high price. It's clearly not for the poor nor those who already have access to a 3D printer.

A very weird move mostly motivated by Dave's passion / hubris, IMHO.

This message was edited 5 times. Last update was at 2022/01/23 17:16:30


 
   
Made in fr
Lesser Daemon of Chaos






And the campaign is on.

And was funded in 13min

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/26 09:16:05


-"For the Ruinous Powers!" 
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





Not really surprising, given their community.
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut






There are some decent sculpts there, underneath all the "detail".
   
Made in gb
Battlefield Tourist





On an Express Elevator to Hell!!

I'm going to go against the consensus here and say these are some of the coolest-looking Chaos minis I have ever seen.

I always loved the original RT-era chaos marines, in that they were truly 'chaotic' - all of the warping, heavily distorted armour and essentially a marine looking through a funhouse mirror and turned inside out. That, for me, is what 'chaos' was about, the weird and unknowable (and frightening, because of that) - that style gradually got replaced with baroque edging and spikes onwards through 2nd edition and after (although I do think the latest official chaos marines are very good).

These are the first Chaos marines I have seen (other than the odd small garage or fan effort) that capture that 'character' of the early Realms of Chaos and Rogue Trader-era marines. I was looking for something modern to do my 2nd edition Chaos set, these look like they will fit the bill perfectly.

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Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut






I really don't feel those look anything like the old Renegade Citadel line, but YMMV.
   
Made in gb
Battlefield Tourist





On an Express Elevator to Hell!!

It's more to do with the running edges, twisted sections and overlapping armour - it gives more of a feeling of it being 'warped', rather than borque edges that have been rivetted into place and have sharp, more clearly defined edges or spikes.

I am sure you will agree there was a very marked difference from 1st to 2nd edition chaos space marines in this respect - hopefully not just making this up in my head

Obviously its 35 years since the original chaos marines were made and sculpting and design has become so much more impressive, with a lot more possible technically - but I would say undoubtedly whoever has designed these has spent a lot of time looking at the old Realms of Chaos and Slaves to Darkness books, and the old minis. They've also achieved something quite aesthetically different from the current GW range as well, which I think is quite important.




Epic 30K&40K! A new players guide, contributors welcome https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/751316.page
Small but perfectly formed! A Great Crusade Epic 6mm project: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/694411.page
 
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut





 His Master's Voice wrote:
I really don't feel those look anything like the old Renegade Citadel line, but YMMV.


Have to agree with this, I don't see much correlation. The old-school styles had a certain 'gribbly-ness' to how that warping effect showed through; things like a leering demonic face pushing through the armour would be a focal point and its weirdness accentuated by its placement. Something like that would just get lost on these sculpts amongst the plethora of other stuff loaded onto every single segment.

There's clearly the talent there but, for me, a good, intricate miniature design can have lots of details but still allow for 'space'. Best way I can describe my reaction to these is that they're exhausting to look at.
   
Made in gb
Grim Dark Angels Interrogator-Chaplain





Cardiff

And what is going on with those not-Rhinos. They are… dull, with weird multi track blocks. They’re worse than the marines for needless busy.

Still, there’s evidently a market. It just ain’t me!

 Stormonu wrote:
For me, the joy is in putting some good-looking models on the board and playing out a fantasy battle - not arguing over the poorly-made rules of some 3rd party who neither has any power over my play nor will be visiting me (and my opponent) to ensure we are "playing by the rules"
 
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





 JohnnyHell wrote:
And what is going on with those not-Rhinos. They are… dull, with weird multi track blocks. They’re worse than the marines for needless busy.


Gotta prove it's just "inspiration", you see.


Still, there’s evidently a market. It just ain’t me!


Where there are fans around a personnality, there is always money.

TBH, I don't mind Dave wanting his own vision of Chaos space marines being done. It's just he's clearly wanting to monetize that on the back of GW and his fans, and his justifications are exactly the same than people doing KS about "not GW models".

From my point of view, the only difference is the status of MWG vs an obscure 3D sculptor coming from nowhere.


As for the miniatures themselves...they're all monoposes with clearly different proportions from GW's miniatures and you can only buy the physical miniatures, not the .stl - with all the joyous added costs of import / VAT if you live outside of MWG's country. Easy pass. They're not that outstanding to be worth the hassle.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/26 14:05:48


 
   
Made in gb
Dakka Veteran





I was quite interested in this although I agree that the minis have possibly too much going on but not a deal breaker for me.
However once I add on shipping costs and vat the overall price isn't that great considering they're made out of inferior materials to GW's plastics. Also, there's still the possibility this could get cancelled if GW decide to take them on.
Still tempted though...

I've been playing a while, my first model was a lead marine and my first White Dwarf was bound with staples 
   
Made in pl
Longtime Dakkanaut





Sarouan wrote:
From my point of view, the only difference is the status of MWG vs an obscure 3D sculptor coming from nowhere.

He might be banking on being too big to fail. After all, we saw inane crowd whipping themselves into screeching frenzy when obscure content creators bored with 40K decided to quit on their own (complete with idiotic conspiracy theories that surely GW forced them to even though GW praised said content creator before and never had a problem with parodies) - imagine the reaction if GW really sent MWG cease & desist (and they would have a pretty good case too, MWG isn't even pretending it's not just slightly changed copy & paste designed to milk their fanbase)...
   
Made in fr
Lesser Daemon of Chaos






 Irbis wrote:
...even though GW praised said content creator before and never had a problem with parodies...


That's ... one way to put it.

-"For the Ruinous Powers!" 
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Irbis wrote:

He might be banking on being too big to fail.


I have that feeling too ! TBH, even GW's IP aside, we're still in the middle of a pandemy jamming everything and they heavily implied the miniatures are produced in China. And they seem to be very confident in the easy delivery of all that.

Only confirmation I got from GW is that they're not working with MWG on that project and they don't seem to care very much. Well, at least, that's what the customer service from this area seemed to imply.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/26 21:21:58


 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Sarouan wrote:
 Irbis wrote:

He might be banking on being too big to fail.


I have that feeling too ! TBH, even GW's IP aside, we're still in the middle of a pandemy jamming everything and they heavily implied the miniatures are produced in China. And they seem to be very confident in the easy delivery of all that.

Only confirmation I got from GW is that they're not working with MWG on that project and they don't seem to care very much. Well, at least, that's what the customer service from this area seemed to imply.


You actually reported this to GW?
   
Made in fr
Lesser Daemon of Chaos






caladancid wrote:
Sarouan wrote:
 Irbis wrote:

He might be banking on being too big to fail.


I have that feeling too ! TBH, even GW's IP aside, we're still in the middle of a pandemy jamming everything and they heavily implied the miniatures are produced in China. And they seem to be very confident in the easy delivery of all that.

Only confirmation I got from GW is that they're not working with MWG on that project and they don't seem to care very much. Well, at least, that's what the customer service from this area seemed to imply.


You actually reported this to GW?


That's... I ... Maybe they have shares in GW stocks ?

-"For the Ruinous Powers!" 
   
Made in us
Manhunter





Sticksville, Texas

Are the bases for these minis cast onto them?
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





caladancid wrote:


You actually reported this to GW?


Reported ? No, I just asked if they were working in partnership with MWG, since they have books for review from GW in advance.

And besides, come on...with all the advertisement Dave made in his multiple videos in all social medias, it's not like MWG did anything to try to hide their project. It's plastered blatantly everywhere. GW doesn't need anyone to report what can be seen easily in the open.
   
Made in fr
Lesser Daemon of Chaos






 NH Gunsmith wrote:
Are the bases for these minis cast onto them?


Looks like it.

-"For the Ruinous Powers!" 
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





 NH Gunsmith wrote:
Are the bases for these minis cast onto them?


So far, they are packaged pre-assembled, from their answer in the comments.
   
Made in gb
Battlefield Tourist





On an Express Elevator to Hell!!

 DreadfullyHopeful wrote:
caladancid wrote:
Sarouan wrote:
 Irbis wrote:

He might be banking on being too big to fail.


I have that feeling too ! TBH, even GW's IP aside, we're still in the middle of a pandemy jamming everything and they heavily implied the miniatures are produced in China. And they seem to be very confident in the easy delivery of all that.

Only confirmation I got from GW is that they're not working with MWG on that project and they don't seem to care very much. Well, at least, that's what the customer service from this area seemed to imply.


You actually reported this to GW?

That's... I ... Maybe they have shares in GW stocks ?


I wouldn't be so surprised. I remember during the Chapterhouse cases there were people on certain forums trying to give 'lists' of users that they suspected of being involved with recasting, and providing information to GW.

I'll be honest I can't understand it. There are so many horrible and troubling things going on in the world, ways that energies could be spent trying to do good; charities, environmental activism etc. Spending that concern/anger(?) to score brownie points and shore up a multi-million pound company that won't even notice something like this release, you would have to think comes pretty far down the list of priorities.

Epic 30K&40K! A new players guide, contributors welcome https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/751316.page
Small but perfectly formed! A Great Crusade Epic 6mm project: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/694411.page
 
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Pacific wrote:

I'll be honest I can't understand it.


Just wanted the information from GW, that's all. Nothing difficult to understand.

Given all the advertisement from MWG and their partnership with GW on reviews, it's a honest question to know if they have also given their consent to Dave's project. as a backer, it's also interesting information.

Again, world is not Black and White. And MWG isn't white at all here. They're not clear at all on the topic.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2022/01/27 10:49:40


 
   
Made in gb
Battlefield Tourist





On an Express Elevator to Hell!!

OK that's fair enough and apologies for implying that was the case in your instance.

I do think any call to GW about this (or other instances of 3rd party stuff that is dancing close to the edge!) risks making an issue of it, and putting it in front of GW legal, when otherwise it might not have - would end up with a lot of disappointed backers (about 1700 at time of writing) not to mention the guys that have poured effort into creating this stuff.

Epic 30K&40K! A new players guide, contributors welcome https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/751316.page
Small but perfectly formed! A Great Crusade Epic 6mm project: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/694411.page
 
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





 Pacific wrote:

I do think any call to GW about this (or other instances of 3rd party stuff that is dancing close to the edge!) risks making an issue of it, and putting it in front of GW legal, when otherwise it might not have - would end up with a lot of disappointed backers (about 1700 at time of writing) not to mention the guys that have poured effort into creating this stuff.


I don't think my mail would be the cause of that. Dave made multiple videos and messages on social medias advertising the project well in advance (there was also a draft on the crowdfunding site for a while). Plenty of people saw them, and the majority are GW customers (because duh, that's the most of MWG's main market here, let's not fool ourselves).

It's in the open, for anyone to see. If Dave was stupid enough not to talk with GW about this and hope it went "under the radar", then he's the fool to blame.

BTW I asked MWG about if they talked with GW previously about that project and so far, I got no answer. Only GW responded with a negative. That's all I see.
   
Made in fr
Lesser Daemon of Chaos






Sarouan wrote:
 Pacific wrote:

I do think any call to GW about this (or other instances of 3rd party stuff that is dancing close to the edge!) risks making an issue of it, and putting it in front of GW legal, when otherwise it might not have - would end up with a lot of disappointed backers (about 1700 at time of writing) not to mention the guys that have poured effort into creating this stuff.


I don't think my mail would be the cause of that. Dave made multiple videos and messages on social medias advertising the project well in advance (there was also a draft on the crowdfunding site for a while). Plenty of people saw them, and the majority are GW customers (because duh, that's the most of MWG's main market here, let's not fool ourselves).

It's in the open, for anyone to see. If Dave was stupid enough not to talk with GW about this and hope it went "under the radar", then he's the fool to blame.

BTW I asked MWG about if they talked with GW previously about that project and so far, I got no answer. Only GW responded with a negative. That's all I see.


Still, in most of the world it might be construed as "a dick move". I mean they aren't selling scan of leaked codex, actual GW minis without the license to do so, and so on.

I mean, YMMV but for me anyone who wants to sell or distribute minis, even explicitly to serve as proxies in a game they do not own. Is firmly "white" as you said so. And courts be damned

-"For the Ruinous Powers!" 
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





 DreadfullyHopeful wrote:


Still, in most of the world it might be construed as "a dick move". I mean they aren't selling scan of leaked codex, actual GW minis without the license to do so, and so on.

I mean, YMMV but for me anyone who wants to sell or distribute minis, even explicitly to serve as proxies in a game they do not own. Is firmly "white" as you said so. And courts be damned


Yeah, YMMV indeed. I guess making profit from miniatures you clearly say are inspired from a specific range of a game you also are making profit by producing battle reports on your website while not talking with the game's maker first if he's fine with that isn't a "dick move" for you. Or maybe it's fine because it's GW.

Besides, I just asked for information, that's all. If MWG doesn't want to answer, that's their decision. So I can ask the other party. And since the other party did answer, I got my information in the end.

So maybe asking for information is a "dick move" now ? What a world we live in nowadays.
   
Made in gb
Moustache-twirling Princeps




United Kingdom

I've backed more than one KS / crowdfunder (but not for miniatures) that has taken my money and then gone "sorry - we're aborting due to legal issues, and we can't give you your money back", so it's not unreasonable to check these things out first.
   
Made in at
Discriminating Warrior





Austria

I am surprised how close some of those minis are and that they try to pull this off

If they have used some background information to get this done now when rumours of a new Codex are in the air, well trouble might be ahead

that this is being "white", GWs business practices are bad enough and people who try to make a profit on top of that with close proxies, not really (please give GW money and play their games so we can sell you Chaos Marines)

PS: asking if this is legit might be a considered a dick move, while on the other hand giving a KS money without any proof that it is legit is not the best idea either

Harry, bring this ring to Narnia or the Sith will take the Enterprise

M41 - Alternative Rules for Battles in the 41st Millennium (40k LRB Project) 
   
Made in be
Longtime Dakkanaut





beast_gts wrote:
I've backed more than one KS / crowdfunder (but not for miniatures) that has taken my money and then gone "sorry - we're aborting due to legal issues, and we can't give you your money back", so it's not unreasonable to check these things out first.


Exactly. And time can't be wasted for waiting answers, since the campaign only last a week before you get billed.

The other big factor is that shipping fee isn't included and you'll only be faced to it when the pledge manager will be there. So you're still in the unknown about what can be a huge amount to pay in addition...
   
 
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