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Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

Honestly I think GD really only needed to bring in the ability hot swapping (without a gold fee to respec) that D3 had. Otherwise I think its a very solid game and they could even get away with GD2 on that engine and do ok.

But yeah if they need a new engine that's a huge thing. Though they could use something like the Unreal engine.

They've still got 1 solid game before they hit the terrible 3s, Seriously Torchlight 3, Dungeon Siege 3, Diablo 3, Sacred 3 - ALL of them hit massive issues on the 3rd game.

Heck Dungeon Siege 3 and Dungeon Siege 3 felt like they got the same design manager sending them down a failed pathway; whilst TL3 was a rescue of an MMO that didn't work. D3 at least worked mechanically, but it was quite a big departure and the PC being bound to online is a pain.

A Blog in Miniature

3D Printing, hobbying and model fun! 
   
Made in us
Terrifying Doombull




D3 hit like a lot of World of Warcraft changes- the 'oh no, players can't possibly like thinking about skill choices, just make talents the best of three instead of a branching tree.'

There was something in the water at Blizzard HQ that RPG players don't want complexity or thought in their games. Hopefully they're moving beyond it, but its buried under a lot of legacy and business issues.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/03/18 23:54:57


Efficiency is the highest virtue. 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

Yes some elements of it do feel very watered down. Personally though with the way equipment modifies abilities and such I never felt like the option to change abilities on the fly was a problem.

For me it addressed something that plagues me in other games of its kind, including D2, which is that in most of them you're encouraged to focus on a specific "build".

That's fine, but it also means that after a few hours you're ALWAYS pressing the same buttons, getting the same handful of abilities and doing the same thing over and over and over.

It can become stale.
Plus changing to a new character or the same with a new build can take ages to get to a decent point where its not beginner level and not end game.


If I've a fire-focused Sorceress in D2 and I want to go ice or lightning I've got to start over from level 1 right back at the beginning again.

In D3 I can just change my active abilities and off I go.

Now D3 has its own issues, for example the heavy abilities tend to feel like they are the only ones that really do damage; and the way items affect abilities you can feel like what you "should" be using at any one time is a bit more of a lottery than a thought process.

So there ARE downsides that require addressing. For me it helps break the monotony of the grind and battles to have the abilities to swap between and vary your tactical approach.



Another good example is the mage class in Grim Dawn has a magic blast abilities that's just a column of light from you to the mouse. I sunk points into it and every situation I'm in is the same - no matter the foe I'm blasting them with that ability the whole time. No puzzle, no thinking its the same over and over and over again.

A Blog in Miniature

3D Printing, hobbying and model fun! 
   
Made in us
Terrifying Doombull




That's not much of an issue- skill tree resets are a solved problem. That's not any kind of barrier anymore, unless the developers are feel obstinate.

As for spamming abilities- thats... kind of an issue with aRPGs. The only game-play loop is killing tens of thousands of monsters, whether to follow the story or just for loot and character power. It'd be weird (and a little disturbing) if that didn't get dull. The only solution there is to move away from the genre, which would make a lot of folks deeply unhappy.

Efficiency is the highest virtue. 
   
Made in gb
Decrepit Dakkanaut




UK

I addressed it before, but skill respects are different to how D3 does it. In most games Skill Respects are more included for either very late game optional elements because of how much in-game coin it costs to change; or they are designed as mistake fixers and only let you respect a few points or the most recent points.

D3 doesn't put any limits on it. You don't have to grind for X amount of gold to be able to afford respecing your entire skill tree; you don't have the option only to change the last few.


Again its about building a level of variety into the mob killing aspect of the game. You can go from a character who stands there laser blasting with your power-beam to lobbing out area of effect bombs etc...


For me it increased the amount of replayability that I got out of one character. I didn't feel like I had to switch to another version of the same character to get some variety.

A Blog in Miniature

3D Printing, hobbying and model fun! 
   
Made in us
Terrifying Doombull




 Overread wrote:
I addressed it before, but skill respects are different to how D3 does it. In most games Skill Respects are more included for either very late game optional elements because of how much in-game coin it costs to change; or they are designed as mistake fixers and only let you respect a few points or the most recent points.

D3 doesn't put any limits on it. You don't have to grind for X amount of gold to be able to afford respecing your entire skill tree; you don't have the option only to change the last few.
.


Yeah? That's not unique or special to D3 anymore (if it ever was- I very much doubt Blizz was a pioneer in that area). There's nothing inherent to a skill system that requires hoops, limits or payment for a skill reset.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2023/03/19 15:35:55


Efficiency is the highest virtue. 
   
Made in gb
Perfect Shot Black Templar Predator Pilot





The Dark Imperium

I always thought it was a pointless waste of my time to mess around with specs in general when I'd rather be playing the game how I wanted to play it. But DS1 was my first real foray into crpg so guess I've never recovered from this thinking, and as I see more and more games now have play-based-leveling.

   
 
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