Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Question came up in a game this weekend between two people I know.

One guy had a unit of snipers sitting in area terrain, 3-4" into the terrain. The other guy had a monstrous creature sitting in the open, it was not 50% obscured by terrain.

The guy with the monstrous creature argued he should get a cover save, because according to the exceptions on page 22, units firing through more than 2" of area terrain confer a cover save on their target. The monstrous creature itself wasn't getting the cover save, it was being granted a cover save from the unit targetting it shooting through more than 2" of area terrain.




My interpretation of this is that the monstrous creature would NOT get a cover save. The rules on page 51 for monstrous creatures state that the monstrous creature needs to be more than 50% obscured to claim a cover save, and lists no exceptions. I would argue that the exception on page 22 doesn't hold valid, because it is discussed in a section not specific to monstrous creatures, and the specific unit type itself defines what cover saves it can or cannot take.

Quite right. Normal qualifications for cover saves do not apply to MCs or vehicles.

Honersstodnt wrote:The guy with the monstrous creature argued he should get a cover save, because according to the exceptions on page 22, units firing through more than 2" of area terrain confer a cover save on their target.

As an aside, there is a common misconception with that 2" rule.

Firing through less than 2" of area terrain negates any cover save bestowed by the terrain... but firing from more than 2" inside terrain does not automatically confer a cover save. To be firing through the terrain, the LOS needs to pass beteen two elements of the terrain. So for a cover save to apply to shots coming from inside area terrain, the firer needs to be more than 2" in and have their shot pass between elements of the terrain.

Possibly an unnecessary explanation, but a lot of people get it wrong, so just thought it was worth pointing out.

My interpretation of this is that the monstrous creature would NOT get a cover save. The rules on page 51 for monstrous creatures state that the monstrous creature needs to be more than 50% obscured to claim a cover save, and lists no exceptions. I would argue that the exception on page 22 doesn't hold valid, because it is discussed in a section not specific to monstrous creatures, and the specific unit type itself defines what cover saves it can or cannot take.

This would be correct.

insaniak wrote:
As an aside, there is a common misconception with that 2" rule.

Firing through less than 2" of area terrain negates any cover save bestowed by the terrain...

insaniak, I have been looking in the BRB for this, but I'm having trouble finding it. What page is this on?

Page 22, 4th bullet point.

That only references models shooting OUT of terrain, not shooting WITHIN terrain.. perhaps i misunderstood. I thought you had meant that you could close within 2'' of a unit in area terrain and deny them their cover.

Falconlance wrote:That only references models shooting OUT of terrain, not shooting WITHIN terrain..

That's what the thread was about...

I thought you had meant that you could close within 2'' of a unit in area terrain and deny them their cover.

Nope. If the enemy is in the terrain they get a cover save, regardless of how close you are or whether or not your LOS is obscured or passes through elements of the terrain (except in the case of MCs and vehicles, obviously).

insaniak wrote:

Falconlance wrote:That only references models shooting OUT of terrain, not shooting WITHIN terrain..

That's what the thread was about...

I thought you had meant that you could close within 2'' of a unit in area terrain and deny them their cover.

Nope. If the enemy is in the terrain they get a cover save, regardless of how close you are or whether or not your LOS is obscured or passes through elements of the terrain (except in the case of MCs and vehicles, obviously).

Right, gotcha.