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My latest disposition. This uses virtually all my men, so please no list rewrites. I do have spare heavy weapons. One chimera is actually a hellhound as a counts-as, so I could switch that back. Otherwise everything else is wysiwyg.


COMMAND 242 pts

Lord Commissar (Boltgun, Meltabombs)
Company Command Squad (Boltgun, Medic, Regimental Standard, Mortar)
-Chimera (Multilaser, Hull Heavy Bolter, Pintle Heavy Stubber)


ASSAULT PLATOON 570 pts

1st Platoon Command Squad (3x Flamers, Heavy Flamer)
-Chimera (Turret Heavy Flamer, Hull Heavy Flamer)

1st Platoon Infantry Squad (Meltabombs, Commissar w/ Power Weapon, Grenade Launcher, Heavy Bolter)
2nd Platoon Infantry Squad (Meltabombs, Grenade Launcher, Heavy Bolter)
3rd Platoon Infantry Squad (Meltabombs, Grenade Launcher, Heavy Bolter)

1st Heavy Weapons Squad (Mortars)
2nd Heavy Weapons Squad (Mortars)
3rd Heavy Weapons Squad (Autocannons)


SUPPORT PLATOON 602 pts
2nd Platoon Command Squad (4x Grenade Launchers)
-Chimera (Multilaser, Hull Heavy Flamer)

4th Platoon Infantry Squad (Grenade Launcher, Heavy Bolter)
5th Platoon Infantry Squad (Grenade Launcher, Heavy Bolter)
6th Platoon Infantry Squad (Grenade Launcher, Heavy Bolter)

4th Heavy Weapons Squad (Lascannons)
5th Heavy Weapons Squad (Lascannons)
6th Heavy Weapons Squad (Missile Launchers)


ARMOURED DETACHMENT 586 pts

Armoured Sentinel (Plasma Cannon, Searchlight)
Leman Russ Battle Tank (Hull Lascannon)
Leman Russ Demolisher (Hull Lascannon, Plasma Cannon Sponsons)
Basilisk

2000 pts


I'm bringing it to battle tomorrow to a GW event, sign said 1000-2000 pts bring-and-battle. I pretty much have to be ready for anything here in Calgary.

Comments? Criticisms? Advice on running this? What threats are most dangerous to this company? Opinions on expansion?

I don't think the single power weapon in a blob is necessary. Like wise for the PCS HF, I think normal flamers are a better value. The second PCS should have 4 flamers rather than 4 GLs IMO. The difference is really huge, GLs popping away won't do much compared to one good turn of the burny dance.

Armoured sentinel with PC is also overpriced. Could you swap it (after the HF/PW savings) for 2 outflanking sentinels with lascannons? Give your army some more firepower, something that doesn't have to deploy in your zone.

Sorry if that's recommending new models, but hey, hard to change a list without such ideas. The extra flamers at least you should have to hand, since cadians come with so many.

As far as threats go, the obviouos one is flammers but this is true for any massed infantry with no transports. Your lack of PF's is notable, these come in handy while going against MEQ's who mostly want to chew you up in CC where your supiorior firepower will matter less. I think taking the Hellhound as a Hellhound (or other varient there of) would help keep assault infantry at a distance. Keep your CCS back near your Heavy Weapons squads so that you can use the better special orders against heavier targets. Keep your PCS's near the blobs and love the FIRE FIRE FIRE order, it truley is a beutiful thing when 30 las shots become 60 at 24" with a sprinkling of GLs and HBs!

Your biggest trouble I think will be against anyone running a leafblower or blitz assault list. This is because you have your Troops concentrated into effectivley two squads so finding cover for them all against ordinance will be an issue. It would only take one sacrificial assault squad to tie up an entire platoon killing thier firepower and with the lack of PFs I mentioned earlier you may be there for more then a turn or two.

You want to fire as often as possible, if you are playing a capture and control type game don't worry if your opponent grabs the objective early you DO have the firepower to knock almost any Troop off of it in one turn.

So, for just a few changes to the details, I'd replace the commissar blob's heavy bolters with power weapons for the sergeants in those squads. Heavy weapons and assault squads don't mix well. That, and swap the medic for an officer of the fleet.

I think this list has a bigger problem, though, and that's that you're playing a static infantry gunline. This poorly fits the metagame of 5th ed, which means it's less competitive than it was in 4th.

For example, you've got just a single unit of guardsmen to go and capture all of the other objectives on sieze ground while the rest of your dudes park their butts. Likewise, your list has very poor counter-attack ability. By this, I mean that if your opponent drops a bunch of terminators on your home objective of a capture and control, you will have a very hard time dislodging him. In any case, your opponent wouldn't need to worry about defending his objective, so he can focus all of his energy on simply contesting yours. That and static armies are just waiting to get ripped apart by outflankers and deepstrikers.

Sitting still and relying on heavy bolters to do mass carnage is going to give you a lot of uphill battles.

Ya, in addition to that, you really don't have anything that can kill tanks. 6 Lascannons (also considering a scatter laser, multilaser, or anything S6 with a lot of shots will easily wipe out a whole squad with one shooting phase) and a demolisher aren't going to cut it. A mechanized list will roll right through you, or just sit back hiding the whole game and wait to grab objectives at the last second.

Well, I didn't get my newest chimera built in time so I went with a modified version of the list above. The changes were: No chimera for 2nd PCS, Missile Launchers instead of a Mortar squad (so two ML HWS and one Mortar HWS). I didn't go with meltabombs on first platoon, and I put Extra Armour and Dozers on the Demolisher and 1st PCS's chim, while removing the stubber from the command chim.

I had two battles against Blood Angels. The first battle was a pretty lopsided victory in my favour, as my Basilisk really shined, and my anti-tank stuff did a good job of slowing his landraider and killing transports, while the mortars made a key pin of a squad that had disembarked a wreck. He tried for a draw, with his last lonely marine being dragged down by charging heavy weapon squads, while attempting to contest my objective. Like you say Ailaros, he didn't attempt to defend his objective, but you can't contest when all your models are dead.

The second battle my first two turns of fire were not as spectacular, with pie scattering and rhinos pulling cover saves and lascannons rolling ones to pen. I also royally pooched my targetting priority turn 2, allowing the presence of that mini-monster of a character (the one with T6 and 6 wounds and psychic wings and 4 S10 attacks - nasty) to rattle me into trying to take him out with pie as he charged towards my demolisher. I should have just accepted that he had outmanouvred me, and targetted something juicier before going down. We didn't actually finish, but they were closing in, in strength and wasn't looking good...

Thanks for the comments, I'll respond to them later but have to for now...

Tx again for all the replies, they were all thoughtful and extremely helpful.

@Ibby: You are probably right about the power weapon. I would have rather had a heavy stubber on my CCS dakkabunker. I've been using the commander from the old cadian command box (one of my favorite models), but I can make a new commissar easy.

I agree that the flamer is good value compared with the HF, but I kinda like the thought of the squad+chimera having three normal and three heavy flamers. 'Burny dance' indeed. Agreed that it's fat that could be trimmed, and also makes the squad more expendable (which it already is - lol they all are!).

The grenade launcher is definitely less exiting than the flamer, but they still hurt tight formations. I've been using that squad to issue furfsurf to the bubblewrap while popping shells over the troops heads. I'm also a little exited to try them out in a chimera and have 7 mobile S6 shots. Having two of the flamer squads would put redundancy into that role (and I do have oodles of them), but I think I'm going to experiment with this a little more.

The reason I built the sentinel armoured was to add a little more anti-meq to the army. I feel that part of the list is a little unreliable, being mostly (sometimes) scattering pie. I probably wouldn't really miss it though. Sentinels, being low(er) $, are on top of my list for expansion,and eventually I plan to have at least 2 scout and 2 armoured in my collection. I think your suggested swaps would be very beneficial to this list, giving me more tactical flexibility. I'm pretty much going to get on that. I need ideas for models that don't rewrite the list, so tx.

@CG01: The first thing my opponent said after I deployed was "I wish I had more flamers". Definitely an enormous threat, and I'll have to place my units farther apart from each other if I face alot of them, so that they can be hosed down after they kill something. I'm already trying to slow and stop close assault threats, so that usually includes flamer-toting units, so there's that as well. Are there any really awful vehicles I should beware, things more exotic than imperial and ork units?

I've always imagined that PF's only really belong in an army that's really geared towards CC, being that the squads they are allowed in are so squishy. I sure would have liked one when my PCS charged that insane BA character, just to tie him up for a turn. That guy is hard to put a wound on! I've been wanting to build a model with the PF from the new command sprue - I would think that 1PCS would be the most appropriate place to try one out, iyo?

I do miss the hellhound. The ability to kill assault infantry at a distance, with more reliability than pie and no cover save, is awesome. Given that 2PCS pretty much does his job without a chim, I'm really tempted to work it back in. Three chimeras tho... arrrghhh!

You've nailed my tactics on the head. The CCS works great with the lascannons, missile launchers, and autocannons. And you're totally right, it's "a beautiful thing when 30 las shots become 60 at 24 with a sprinkling of GL's and HB's!" The marines did not like leaving the wrecked transports to advance into that, let me tell you! With so many squads, I had good coverage. And I do rely on my firepower to clear objectives for me, or at least support an infantry assault.

I need someone to explain 'leafblower' and 'blitz assualt' to me in detail. However I disagree that my Troops is concentrated (slow maybe), and would argue that one of the main strengths of my list is the fact that I have so many scoring units. More on this later.

@Ailaros: I think I'm definitely going to experiment with those two suggestions at the beginning of your post. The command squad hasn't taken much fire since it's only serious weapon is a single mortar, and I know there are reserve-oriented players in my area. I won't really miss 3 HB's, I've already got lots of anti-inf firepower. Would you suggest changing the squads' specials to flamers? The only real problem with arming first platoon like this is that I like to deploy the squad as 10 man units when mission/terrain/opponent calls for it, and I think the HB instead of the PW is more flexible in that case.

As far as playing a static gunline that poorly fits the metagame, well that's just too bad for me. As Ronald Dumsfeld once said "You don't fight with the army you wish you had, you fight with the army you do have". As far as only having "a single unit of guardsmen", you're missing a key part of my tactics, and that is that the infantry squads can move if they want. If 1PCS is going somewhere, and 1Platoon is in a blob, then with RRR the blob can pretty much keep up with the chimera. In any case, I have 6 infantry squads, and even if they all move then I'm prepared to go without those 6 HB's for the turn. I can also use leapfrog tactics to keep up fire on the move, especially when deployed as small units. I won't be "sitting still and relying on heavy bolters" at all. Only the HWS's and CCS are truly static, and even then there's the command chim which could take a HWS and score, or a 10 man inf squad. I also only need to contest, so my tanks can help there. As far as "just waiting to get ripped apart by outflankers and deepstrikers", that threat can be ameliorated in deployment (for instance I'm often in a corner, blocking a whole board edge, which neutralizes outflanking me on that side). And the emperor help them if they get bad rolls for the one turn deepstrikers will live. Deepstrikers will land, and will kill my stuff, and may defeat me often. But I'll get better at fighting them. Any tips on that?

@ Nungunz: I have 8 lascannons, 3 missile launchers, one each of battle, earthshaker, and demolisher cannons, coming from 6 units that can kill AV14. That's with 3 AC's, 3 plasma cannons, 2 multilasers, 10 grenade launchers, and 8 HB's to back up my anti-vehicle arsenal. With that much stuff I'm getting flank shots for sure, and I sure don't think transports are going to "roll right through" me. And how will they "grab objectives at the last second" if they haven't been killing my troops, who in this descent into theorycraft have positioned themselves defending them?

I'm not really that worried about anti-tank for most lists I'll go against, but I think something like 3 landraiders or more than a few guard tanks will give me trouble.

Anyways, kudos if you read all that, more if you have more comments, constructive criticism or advice. I'll soon post a new list incorporating some of the suggestions.