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Simple.

are there naval battles in the 40k universe.

yes, read cadian blood for a good naval battle to see what its like if needed

as in between waterborne ships.

Not many planets use aquatic navies but there are probably some people that do and mainstream-wise maybe some are adapted to reach heavily fortified places.
The orks have submarines or submersibles.
In one of the Soul Drinkers series they adapted thunderhawks into ships to reach an island because the air keeps messing with the intake jets or something.

In Flesh and Iron or Blood and Steel or whatever the Space Cajun book was called there is both a "brown water navy"-type guard regiment (the aforementioned Space Cajuns) and a true naval regiment with battleship/carrier hybrids.

Also in some Tyranid fluff piece PDF submarines are mentioned as being lost to the 'nids.

That would be an interesting 'Mod Game Rule' though, something like each ship being like moving island of terrain and nothing but skimmer\flyers and these ships can go over water.

This might be a good idea Solon, I remeber you used to come up here with every idea that occured to you but you don't seem to anymore. You might be on to something really good with this one. I'd look forward to see what you come up with, I know that things are popping in my head even right now.

There already are rules for Amphibiousness

But I had an idea for battleship artillery and off-field airstrikes like you get in games like Command and conquer.

Is this an admission that my ideas are missed? Aww.
Joking.

bring the ideas on for naval combat!

It would definitly involve sea men...

*cringes at possible censure...*

definitely sounds interesting in game terms, but 5 bucks says it would gradually go from naval battle to BOAT ASSAULT WITH GRIMDARK BOATS!!!

I acctually wanted boat assault with Grim-Dark boats :p . I think it would be a cool idea to have a few squads of Imperial Guard on one boat shooting at a few squads of Chaos Marines on another boat and when they collide you get a HTH fight pirate style. Each ship counts as a C&C point and so on. If nothing else then this could be made into a one-off mission that uses alternative rules.

the marines would win, A simial game to warhamer called act of war had an expansion pack go out for Naval battles, If its the same kind of idea the boats would take up quite a bit of the board

In the 41st millennia almost every race has some form of anti-gravity / skimmer technology , so would it then follow that " naval " battles would be more likely to occur ABOVE the waves ???

Further more take that to its ultimate you get BATTLE FLEET GOTHIC , which is ship to ship combat , just pushed upwards and out of the gravity well and into space .

yeah it seems to me when you have thunderhawks and drop pods and battle barges you don't really need to deal with the water, you'll either fly over it, avoid it completley or go into space. so i'd say battle fleet gothic is the best reprentation of sea battle in the grimdark universe of the grimdark darkness...
oh and solon i miss your rediculous suggestions (and the occasional good one) they always brought a smile to my day [sarcasm]
on a different note can one of million actual millitary people we have on dakka (i know your there) solon this? i'd assume that navies (water navies) would get phased out as air forces became better, but then again idk anything about the realites of combat...

I think JoeTaco means </sarcasm>. Man Lego has spoiled you guys with these code tags!

Seriously though I was one of those who may have been too harsh on Solon but his shotgun approach to new rules and new units did produce a few gems worth looking at. I think that the discouragement from other posts and the natural lack of attention span that comes from being a web user made it so that these were never polished and showen through.

Gee, thanks. I'm a user. xP

There are certain situations where naval battles would be needed like, a base in the middle of an island that can't be aproached by air because it's right in the middle (down below) there's a cavern entrance too small and low for even a thunderhawk so naval vessels must be sent in but come in contact with ork submersibles and so must fight.

I'd say if you want to play a game of naval battles just use battlefleet gothic but convert the models to be boats

I was thinking of building D-Day style landing craft for a beachead table I'm going to get on to with a few mates. It makes sense that people would fight on water- they're more than happy to do it everywhere else.

There would be any number of reasons to launch a naval assault when you have an air force. There could be no open spaces large enough to land drop ships in. The target could be too heavily defended with anti-air. Or you could just do it because you don't think the enemy will expect it.

Zed wrote:I was thinking of building D-Day style landing craft for a beachead table I'm going to get on to with a few mates. It makes sense that people would fight on water- they're more than happy to do it everywhere else.

You meen the "Higgins Boat" right? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LCVP

I might try and build three of them

Rules
Transport 25 models, or two Chimera based tanks, or six Sentinels, or one Leman russ type tank
Open top, aquatic only, fast (top speed 12"), Assult Landing craft (can fire both its weapons when traveling at full speed, can move, run and assult as soon as the landing ramp is lowered )

AV-F--S--R
---12-10-10

Armerments
x2 multi-lasers, smoke launchers, spot light.
Cost 75pts

Any takers

Should be a good series of Apocalypse models and datasheets right there - we already have the Orky subs as mentioned earlier.

Fast attack craft and amphibious craft would be cool additions

Ribon Fox wrote:

Zed wrote:I was thinking of building D-Day style landing craft for a beachead table I'm going to get on to with a few mates. It makes sense that people would fight on water- they're more than happy to do it everywhere else.

You meen the "Higgins Boat" right? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LCVP

I might try and build three of them

Rules
Transport 25 models, or two Chimera based tanks, or six Sentinels, or one Leman russ type tank
Open top, aquatic only, fast (top speed 12"), Assult Landing craft (can fire both its weapons when traveling at full speed, can move, run and assult as soon as the landing ramp is lowered )

AV-F--S--R
---12-10-10

Armerments
x2 multi-lasers, smoke launchers, spot light.
Cost 75pts

Any takers

I take .

Ribon Fox wrote:[
I might try and build three of them

Rules
Transport 25 models, or two Chimera based tanks, or six Sentinels, or one Leman russ type tank
Open top, aquatic only, fast (top speed 12"), Assult Landing craft (can fire both its weapons when traveling at full speed, can move, run and assult as soon as the landing ramp is lowered )

AV-F--S--R
---12-10-10

Armerments
x2 multi-lasers, smoke launchers, spot light.
Cost 75pts

Any takers

Yeah that's the one, I couldn't recall the exact name. That's pretty similar to what I had in mind.

I have a 4 ft long scale hull of the bismark that I am going to load up with cannons and build a dry dock for. I plan to use as a either an objective in a game or as a fortress in planetstrike not sure yet.

I too was wondering if there was any place in the 40kverse for waterborne navies, I figured only on the more backwater planets would they be used

LCVP is a beauty for waterborne assault, still used occasionally. (I would beleive so.)

but, as for sea transport, IG would definatly use something a little less flimsy. maybe with AV 16 on all sides. (I know.)

12"? that thing moves flat out full speed of 18", and the only gun on the boat is a HMG, which could be an assault cannon or heavy bolter?

oh, and it's 'assault' not 'assult'


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Joetaco wrote:oh and solon i miss your rediculous suggestions (and the occasional good one) they always brought a smile to my day [sarcasm]

Boy, you weren't around then.

FeistierErmine wrote:There would be any number of reasons to launch a naval assault when you have an air force. There could be no open spaces large enough to land drop ships in. The target could be too heavily defended with anti-air. Or you could just do it because you don't think the enemy will expect it.

You're only thinking in two of the four potential bits of warfare in the 40k background.

A target can have anti-air defenses which prevent dropships or strike aircraft...
But it'd still be vulnerable to a low orbit, precision bombardment from an escort(or larger)starship.

The main reason to use traditional naval assets (As opposed to space-naval assets) is because one can hide underwater easier than one can hide underground.

A few massive submarines as mobile underwater bases were used in either the second or third war for Armageddon I think.

By the Orks.

Captain Solon wrote:
Automatically Appended Next Post:

Joetaco wrote:oh and solon i miss your rediculous suggestions (and the occasional good one) they always brought a smile to my day [sarcasm]

Boy, you weren't around then.

What? i was posting your ideas were dumb and not playtested since i got on dakka.

Kanluwen wrote:

FeistierErmine wrote:There would be any number of reasons to launch a naval assault when you have an air force. There could be no open spaces large enough to land drop ships in. The target could be too heavily defended with anti-air. Or you could just do it because you don't think the enemy will expect it.

You're only thinking in two of the four potential bits of warfare in the 40k background.

A target can have anti-air defenses which prevent dropships or strike aircraft...
But it'd still be vulnerable to a low orbit, precision bombardment from an escort(or larger)starship.

I was mainly just speaking in terms of launching an invasion and actually getting troops on the ground. That would be susceptible to anti-air defenses even using drop pods. We can also assume that if we're bothering to actually fight a battle that orbital bombardment is unavailable, ineffectual, or would just destroy whatever objective is being fought over.

For me, I have no problem believing that there can be water navies in the 40k universe; there are fedual planets out there where humans are doing battle with bows and arrows, for goodness sakes! One possiblity would be ships that are capable of both space and naval operation (think Space Battleship Yamato).

I too have thought about making a ship of some kind for a 40k game...I'm thinking something that looks like a pre-Dreadnought battleship, with all kinds of ornate decoration on it. It could have a couple of Earthshaker cannons for main armaments, and maybe 2-4 battlecannons per side for secondaries. It would be fun, I think!