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So I have a Vulkan list that lacks some long range AT. My heavy supports are filled with 2 vindis and a TFC. I will not remove any of them for an AC/LC predator as the TFC is great for crowd control againt nidz, orkz, guard, and even SM when the transport is gone.

Currently I have been running the Redeemer and doing well, but I think that by having a regular LR I may give my Vindis some nice targets.

This is my current list.


HQ: Vulkan He'stan 190

Troops: 10 TSM 240
Meltagun
ML
PF
Rhino w/ Dozer

10 TSM 240
Meltagun
ML
PF
Rhino w/ Dozer

10 TSM 245
Flamer
MM
PF
Rhino w/ Dozer
Combimelta


Elites: 5 Assault Termies TH/SS 450
LRR w/ MM

Heavy Support: Vindicator w/ Siege Shield 125
Vindicator w/ Dozer 120
TFC 100

Fast Attack: Land Speeder w/ MM and HF 70
Land Speeder w/ MM and HF 70

Redeemer is more fluffy for a salamanders army but if you're lacking anti-tank go vanilla land raider.

if your somehow lacking in AT in a sally army...then something is wrong

however overall i prefer the redeemer as it can generally do more dmg than the regular raider

I'm not lacking in the general AT department, just the LONG RANGE AT department. I love my Redeemer, but I need something to pop transports starting turn 1. I don't need the frag launchers or even the assault cannons.

seein as there are Land Speeders in his army I would consider fluff an issue

How often do you get to use the MM on your tacticals? 3 MMs is a waste, drop 2 for MLs to get some long range.

As for the pool, I would probably go with a Vanilla but then again, once you are within 24" the redeemer is a better choice at taking out armour as well.

I would go with a crusader, with multi melta. Its a close range beast, which is fitting considering its cargo. Once you are in the optimal zone, you can move 6 and fire everything. It has fair armor killing power, with superb anti infantry power. A great line breaker for your other squads to follow.

I think I would give the tactical squads flamers over meltas. Then give the sarge a combi melta and PF. Ends up being 240 once you add the rhino (with no upgrades) You aren't going to need to fire the melta often with a tac squad (and the TLing), but with all those transports blown up, having some flamer support as crowd control is useful (and free!)

OH sorry, I meant to switch 2 of those MM's for ML's, that is how I have been running them.

As for the Crusader, I see no real point in taking it as I have no need for all that transport room. I am only considering the regualar LR or the Redeemer.

I know once within 24" the Redeemer is a better choice, but I want to give my vindis or TFC some nice targets early in the game.

The crusader extra room isn't the purpose of taking it. (I never use all of it) The reason for taking it is the hurricane bolters (defensive weapons) and assault cannon and optional (but no brainer) MM. You can actually fire all the weapons on it while moving, and don't have to worry about super short range of the redeemer weapons. If you don't like it, to each his own, I don't really like the redeemer, even in a salamander army (they aren't flamers or heavy flamers, so don't TL).

I personally like regular LR well enough, but not as termy delivery. Lascannon gunboats are good, but don't really ever want to move.

Well, I do from time to time use the Crusader.
Sure the Flamestorms are not TL, but when you kill Power Armor on a 2+, TL is not much of an issue!

redeemer. regular land raiders aren't too hot, only if you have a passive unit inside would I even consider using a normal land raider. redeemers are nice if you have terminators or some such nonsense inside, since you're getting close anyway. flamestorm cannons can wipe out entire squads in one go! the only thing less points efficient than a land raider is a land raider crusader!

crusaders are the middle red headed step child. they cannot handle hordes, or marine EQs as well as the redeemer, they can't handle transports as well as normal land raiders. for the set-up you have, i would 100% definitely take the redeemer.

ding 1st post!

pdawg517 wrote:I'm not lacking in the general AT department, just the LONG RANGE AT department. I love my Redeemer, but I need something to pop transports starting turn 1. I don't need the frag launchers or even the assault cannons.

You want 2 TL/AC dreads or some typoons if your looking for that.

A TL LC has about a 14.5% chance to destroy av 12. A TL AC has a 9.4%. Given at the dread solution is half the cost, you get better transport cracking power. The only thing the mars pattern allows you to do is wrap a squad in AV 14 at long range for objective camping, which is nice but is it worth the loss of firpower?

The numbers go into even more favor of the ACs vs AV 11, or for energy fields

I use the crusader in my list. I really like it. Using it to deliver termies means it is going to get in close. I would try to look elsewhere to get thee long range cracking you are looking for. That is just me, though.

Redeemer can take more TH/SS Termies!!!

Well, I totally lied and switched the TFC for a pred :( . I love my TFC but I really needed the long range AT.