Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So in last days game my Chaos boys failed their moral test ALL THE TIME, and I was forced to fall back for the first time in my short WH40k career. So we checked the fall back rule and it seems pretty straight forward, move towards your table edge 2D6 every movment phase. Now, I really needed my havocs to get back in the game since they still had a looted tank to destroy, so I check the regroup rule.
Regroup can not be attempted if:
- The unit is below half strenght
- There are enemies within 6 inches
- The unit is not in coherency
So what you're telling me is cause I have 2/5 havoc left I can't get em back? Why should I even have em on the table then? Why not remove right away as deserters or shot as cowards? Why bother with a 2D6 every movment phase to remind me how useless they now are? Can someone please tell me I've misunderstood this rule or confirm that the fall back rule is really, really annoying

You have it right.

The unit they cannont regroup if any of those conditions apply (unless they have been assualted where they immediatly attempt a morale test. If they succeed, then they fight.)

The reason they are still on the board is that they can still shoot! Of course they count as moving when they shoot but if a unit starts running away and happens to be in rapid fire range of an enemy squad, it has a chance of destroying/making the other squad flee as well.

Limbo wrote:So what you're telling me is cause I have 2/5 havoc left I can't get em back? Why should I even have em on the table then? Why not remove right away as deserters or shot as cowards? Why bother with a 2D6 every movment phase to remind me how useless they now are? Can someone please tell me I've misunderstood this rule or confirm that the fall back rule is really, really annoying

In short, yes. The reason they are kept on the table until they hit the edge is because you can still fire while falling back (counting as moving), they still affect LOS and certain armies have rules that will allow a unit that's below Half Strength, or within 6" of an enemy, or not in coherency or a mix of all three, to regroup ANYWAY, the main one being if a unit somehow gains fearless (falling into Synapse for example).

Suddenly I feel like having more IoCG in my army. Thanks for the quick replies

Also...the game may end before they fall off the edge.

my favourite fall back moment was:

a little while ago in a battle i was having Sgt Harker the remaining member of his vet. squad ended is fall back about 3 inches short of the table edge.

due to his relentless rule he let of a hail of heavy bolter rounds (from his adequately named 'Payback').. through the twisted ruins of an imperial city at a terminator assault squad (equiped with SS's and TH)

the ruins and the shields failed to get in the way of Harkers well placed shots and my luckless oppenent failed all three of his resulting armour saves (i have since been tempted to put a sniper scope on Harkers heavy bolter)

that moment of brilliance earnt him model of the match

Catachan_Devil wrote:my favourite fall back moment was:

a little while ago in a battle i was having Sgt Harker the remaining member of his vet. squad ended is fall back about 3 inches short of the table edge.

due to his relentless rule he let of a hail of heavy bolter rounds (from his adequately named 'Payback').. through the twisted ruins of an imperial city at a terminator assault squad (equiped with SS's and TH)

the ruins and the shields failed to get in the way of Harkers well placed shots and my luckless oppenent failed all three of his resulting armour saves (i have since been tempted to put a sniper scope on Harkers heavy bolter)

that moment of brilliance earnt him model of the match

Harker: THIS IS FOR MY MEN YOU B*****!!

Terminators: "AHHHH"



Also the situation the OP is describing is one perk of playing SM.

ATSKNF allows auto-regrouping as long as they are in coherency and more then 6" away from the enemy.

Maybe IoCG would do the trick? Not really needed on things like termies but on CSM I think it's useful

Something I've wonderd for a while is why CSM doesn't have ARSKNF. Anyone got a good reason for why that is? To balance out the CSM magic bag maybe?

VoxDei - irrelevant, as soon as the mission ends falling back units are removed

Limbo - because CSM DO know fear; thats kinda the point of them.

They no longer have blind, unswerving faith in a corpse, and the know all too wel to fear Chaos Gods.

nosferatu1001 wrote:VoxDei - irrelevant, as soon as the mission ends falling back units are removed

Limbo - because CSM DO know fear; thats kinda the point of them.

They no longer have blind, unswerving faith in a corpse, and the know all too wel to fear Chaos Gods.

they do have lots of fearless troops (cult troops) as well as a blanket +1 to their initiative compared with the loyalist marine equivalents.

Fearless is very different to ATSKNF in background though.

I suggest you read the fluff to learn the difference between how SM and CSM mentally operate. Leadership is not *just* how likely you are to run, either - like most of the characteristics in 40k it has mroe than one meaning.

i know the fluff but thanks for the suggestion. i'm just showing the OP that his army has morale bonuses and abilities that are analogs (but not the same) as ATSKNF.

VoxDei wrote:Also...the game may end before they fall off the edge.

At the end of the game you remove all models that are falling back before counting victory conditions. Those falling back guys count as a kill point and can't hold or contest an objective they happen to be around.