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Here is the scenario happened yesterday against chaos space marines.

I rammed(wagon with deff rolla ) to opponents rhino which includes 7 plaque marine.The rhino exploded

1)Can i have to resolve tank shock for marines after i destroyed rhino ?

2)In ramming it says you have to go full speed if possible so can i use burnas inside the wagon after i finished my 12 inch move ?

3) for example i tank shock to a deamon prince deff rolla's rule says for death and glory you make extra hit so if deamon prince didnt survie that attacks is he still do the death and glory attack ?

1) Only if the Ram itself caused the Rhino to explode.

2) No.

3) The DoG happens at the same time as the Rollas hits iirc.

Thanks for the answer.

2. yes, they don't have any fire ports, and there's no distance restriction applicable to open topped. "Passengers inside open topped may shoot" period.

Gwar's wrong about nr2 tho, there's no distance restriction applicable to open topped, only to fire ports.

Actually, Gwar has it right if you look in the BRB on page 66 under Fire Points of the Transport Vehicles section it says in the third paragraph, "Models firing from a vehicle count as moving if the vehicle moves, and may not fire at all if the vehicle moved at Cruising Speed that turn. That is a static rule, not just for fire points, because if there was an execption over on page 70 the execption would have been explained.

To explain to you what Crusing Speed is look on page 57 of the BRB under the Vehicles movement section third bullet point it explains what Cruising speed is. To make it short, a vehicle moving 6-12 inches is at Cruising Speed.

Can't fire out of any vehicle if it moved over 6". Big change in 5th edition.

And red paint doesn't give you am extra inch either as it only benefits the vehicle, not the passengers.

Scott-S6 wrote:And red paint doesn't give you am extra inch either as it only benefits the vehicle, not the passengers.

? The vehicle could move 7" and 'counts as' that for 6" as per the RPJ rules. You could also move 7" and just call it 7" as per the rules.
Rules for embarked passengers state they may not fire "if the vehicle moved at Cruising speed that turn."
Moved 7", 'counts-as' 6", 6" is combat speed, Passengers can fire.

Or wasn't that what you meant?

Why wouldn't you get to deffrolla the marines after blowing up the transport ?


edit: just re-read the ramming rule, interesting, never noticed that before.

I don't think anyone is saying that, what we are sayng thou is unless it's the RAM damage that removes the vehicle it can not continue on. Otherwise once the ram has been made the vehicle would have had to stop due to the ram rules, the D6 hits still happen however.

Gwar! wrote:
3) The DoG happens at the same time as the Rollas hits iirc.

They have to happen after, otherwise a TS has not been has not been 'made by'.

ChrisCP wrote:

Scott-S6 wrote:And red paint doesn't give you am extra inch either as it only benefits the vehicle, not the passengers.

? The vehicle could move 7" and 'counts as' that for 6" as per the RPJ rules. You could also move 7" and just call it 7" as per the rules.
Rules for embarked passengers state they may not fire "if the vehicle moved at Cruising speed that turn."
Moved 7", 'counts-as' 6", 6" is combat speed, Passengers can fire.

Or wasn't that what you meant?

"ork vehicles with redpaint jobs add +1 to their move in the movement phase but do not incur penalties for this extra inch." So, they vehicle does not incur penalties - no mention of the passengers benefiting.

The next sentence reads:
"For example a vehicle could move 13" and still counts as moving 12"

Ie.

The vehicle could move 7" and counts as moving 6" ... So the vehicle moved x+1" but counts as moving x" . Thus counting as moving 6" for passengers when moving 7" or count as moving 12" when moving 13"

Kapitalist-Pig wrote:Actually, Gwar has it right if you look in the BRB on page 66 under Fire Points of the Transport Vehicles section it says in the third paragraph, "Models firing from a vehicle count as moving if the vehicle moves, and may not fire at all if the vehicle moved at Cruising Speed that turn. That is a static rule, not just for fire points, because if there was an execption over on page 70 the execption would have been explained.

To explain to you what Crusing Speed is look on page 57 of the BRB under the Vehicles movement section third bullet point it explains what Cruising speed is. To make it short, a vehicle moving 6-12 inches is at Cruising Speed.

There's absolutely NO mention of passengers firing in that paragraph, please try again , and don't come with a quote on fire ports, an open topped vehicle doesn't have ANY fire ports.

Kapitalist-Pig wrote:Actually, Gwar has it right if you look in the BRB on page 66 under Fire Points of the Transport Vehicles section it says in the third paragraph, "Models firing from a vehicle count as moving if the vehicle moves, and may not fire at all if the vehicle moved at Cruising Speed that turn. That is a static rule, not just for fire points, because if there was an execption over on page 70 the execption would have been explained.

To explain to you what Crusing Speed is look on page 57 of the BRB under the Vehicles movement section third bullet point it explains what Cruising speed is. To make it short, a vehicle moving 6-12 inches is at Cruising Speed.

There's absolutely NO mention of passengers firing in that paragraph on page 57, and the quote on fire ports does not apply because an open topped vehicle doesn't have ANY.

Ork codex, red paint job wrote:Orks believe that a vehicle that has been painted red... blah, blah, blah..... Ork vehicles with red paint jobs add +1 to thier move in the Movement phase but do not incur penalties for this extra inch. For example, a vehicle could move 13" but still count as moving 12"

So moving 7" counts as moving 6"

BGB, fire points, 3rd paragraph wrote:Models firing from a vehicle count as moving if the vehicle moves, and may not fire at all if the vehicle moved at Cruising speed that turn.

Now, cruising speed is when a vehicle moves from 6" to 12". A vehicle with red paint job moves 7", this counts as 6" due to the extra inch granted by the red paint job, therefore counting as moving at combat speed. So they can fire.

That's my opinion

Alternatively just move it 6", does that extra inch really matter that much?

Eldar Own wrote:

Alternatively just move it 6", does that extra inch really matter that much?

It could be the difference between getting hit (in melee) on a 4+ or a 6+ so yeah id say it matters quite a bit!

Wow, I had no idea that burnas couldnt use their weapons out of the BW after moving 12 inches...That sucks =(

Gwar! wrote:
1)Can i have to resolve tank shock for marines after i destroyed rhino ?


1) Only if the Ram itself caused the Rhino to explode.

Wait, what? Can you explain what you mean by this please?

Fxeni wrote:

Gwar! wrote:
1)Can i have to resolve tank shock for marines after i destroyed rhino ?


1) Only if the Ram itself caused the Rhino to explode.

Wait, what? Can you explain what you mean by this please?

The ramming rules only allow the vehicle to continue if the ram itself results in a Destroyed - Exploded result. Anything else brings the vehicle to a halt, regardless of the Deffrolla results.

Ah. Now I understand. Never noticed that before...

This is because Deffrolla hit are a result of a Tankshock being made, "any Tank Shock made by..." Ork codex, not part to the TS itself and the wording on the ram rule needing itself to be the trigger.

Tank shock is a form of ramming... how many times does this need to be drilled in

nostromo wrote:

Kapitalist-Pig wrote:Actually, Gwar has it right if you look in the BRB on page 66 under Fire Points of the Transport Vehicles section it says in the third paragraph, "Models firing from a vehicle count as moving if the vehicle moves, and may not fire at all if the vehicle moved at Cruising Speed that turn. That is a static rule, not just for fire points, because if there was an execption over on page 70 the execption would have been explained.

To explain to you what Crusing Speed is look on page 57 of the BRB under the Vehicles movement section third bullet point it explains what Cruising speed is. To make it short, a vehicle moving 6-12 inches is at Cruising Speed.

There's absolutely NO mention of passengers firing in that paragraph, please try again , and don't come with a quote on fire ports, an open topped vehicle doesn't have ANY fire ports.

I think you're looking for the bit on passengers shooting out of the vehicle.

The bit where moving the vehicle affects the ability of the transported unit to shoot. The number of models able to shoot is based on its fire ports, and an open topped vehicle doesn't have any- all models transported can shoot, measured from the hull. The fireports rule has no bearing on whether or not they can shoot based on moving etc, its just for LOS and number of models

So...

Burnas in Bwagon cant fire if vehicle moves over 6"(or 7" w/ RPJ)

If deffrolla kills target vehicle do you still take ram damage?
If deffrolla just disables target, you still work out ram?
If Deffrolla kills target vehicle and you have only used 3" of your possible 12" (13") movement you continue forward, since "Tank Shocking" is a form of "Ramming"?

If you destroy vehicle and have continued movement does targets embarked squad get deffrolla'd?

Can you Ram (12") Burnas disembark and flame?

Sorry for all the questions, just wanna get this right.

General_Chaos wrote:Tank shock is a form of ramming... how many times does this need to be drilled in

Actually, ramming is a form of tank shock...