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While most uses of orders are common sense, some are less obvious. For example, orders can be used as place holders in order to manage the order in which you do things.

While it is rarely advantageous to do so it is legal to give the FRFSRF order to a unit and then choose not to fire any of that unit's lasguns and it is also legal to give that order to a unit containing no lasguns at all. The situation required is that you want a unit to shoot before a different unit receives FRFSRF. Obviously this requires two command squads to pull off.

One such scenario is a four flamer command squad and an infantry squad both in position to shoot an enemy unit, and a second command squad behind the infantry squad. You want the four flamers to hit as many enemy models as possible and then finish them off with lasfire, so the command squad has to shoot first. The command squad orders itself to FRFSRF even though it has no lasguns, then the other command squad orders the infantry squad to FRFSRF.

A second one involves an enemy transport. You have two platoon command squads, a melta unit (which can be one of the command squads), and an infantry squad. The infantry squad can't shoot their lasguns at the passengers until the vehicle is destroyed, so you use an order to make the meltas shoot first and then use FRFSRF to shoot at the disembarked passengers with your infantry squad.

Sneaky. I never thought of that, just assumed you'd always use furf'n'surf on a squad with lasguns. Sneaky.

Great idea. I'm a little embarrassed I haven't figured this out before I read it here. I've often been annoyed at the fact that I can't hit a squad with PCS flamers before I pound it with lasguns. How wrong I've been.

Been there, done that. I think the best one was to issue a shooting order to my Psyker Battle Squad so that they could cast Weaken Resolve on Fateweaver and then order the 30-man blob to Bring it Down............. Yeah, put one wound on him and he's gotta pass a LD test on a 2.

don_mondo wrote:Been there, done that. I think the best one was to issue a shooting order to my Psyker Battle Squad so that they could cast Weaken Resolve on Fateweaver and then order the 30-man blob to Bring it Down............. Yeah, put one wound on him and he's gotta pass a LD test on a 2.

The timing of the orders doesn't matter here. I'm pretty sure the fateweaver takes the check at the end of the shooting phase.

ArtfcllyFlvrd wrote:

don_mondo wrote:Been there, done that. I think the best one was to issue a shooting order to my Psyker Battle Squad so that they could cast Weaken Resolve on Fateweaver and then order the 30-man blob to Bring it Down............. Yeah, put one wound on him and he's gotta pass a LD test on a 2.

The timing of the orders doesn't matter here. IRCC the fateweaver takes the check at the end of the shooting phase.

I didn't remember either, so I checked, and the book doesn't say. It just says "for every unsaved wound suffered by Fateweaver, take a Ld test." It doesn't specify whether the test is taken immediately or at the end of the phase.

So I guess it's a check-with-your-opponent thing. If he wants to test immediately, then use Don Mondo's FRFSRF trick. If he wants to test at the end, you can use your FRFSRF on something else.

I figured it was immediately too. That trick is applicable to pinning, though it's hard to come up with scenarios where it makes the slightest bit of sense to try to exploit it. Maybe if you're trying to shoot sniper rifles at a unit in cover.

Why would the Command squad in the examle have to give itself FRFSRF? wouldnt it just shoot as normal and then the other command squad would give FRFSRF to the lasgun squad.

Grey Templar wrote:Why would the Command squad in the examle have to give itself FRFSRF? wouldnt it just shoot as normal and then the other command squad would give FRFSRF to the lasgun squad.

Orders must be issued at the start of the shooting phase. You can't issue orders after anyone has acted without orders.

Very nice manoeuvre. My compliments, I have to include that in my playstyle. As a tallarn-like player I wont get around dirty tricks

The only thing I've done particularly clever with orders before was to use "bring it down!" on a melta squad and then "go go go!" to give the melta squad a 4+ cover screen from a blob squad.

Less sneaky and more common sense, though.

Raxmei wrote:I figured it was immediately too. That trick is applicable to pinning, though it's hard to come up with scenarios where it makes the slightest bit of sense to try to exploit it. Maybe if you're trying to shoot sniper rifles at a unit in cover.

Yeah, we've always interpreted Fateweaver's test as immediate.
I don't bother with it for pinning, cause if they're taking a pinning test then they bare likely taking a Morale test, which will break the pinning anyways.

Doesn't it say in the codex that each squad can be affected by orders only once?

konst80hummel wrote:Doesn't it say in the codex that each squad can be affected by orders only once?

You may attempt to issue only one order to any one squad per turn, yes. So far all of the examples given comply with that restriction.

Ailaros wrote:The only thing I've done particularly clever with orders before was to use "bring it down!" on a melta squad and then "go go go!" to give the melta squad a 4+ cover screen from a blob squad.

Less sneaky and more common sense, though.

??

i'm assuming you mean in the same shooting phase, which you can't do. once a unit has been given an order (BID in this case), it can not be given another (GGG) that turn. lol, it'd be great if it worked that way... kind of a goblin fanatic shooting attack on an elastic band!

I think he means he gives the blob Move Move Move to get them in fron of the melta squad.............

that works too. i guess i just never considered giving an in range blob squad GGG since i play shooty IG.

I had to read it a few times but this is a cleaver way to cancel out this disadvantage, thanks for the post.