Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

So I may have made a post the other day about how I sold my space marines and attempted to buy an awesome necron army off craigslist. Well, the necron guy backed out, however, I did find a nifty tau army that I've wanted to play since forever ago.

The thing is, I'm a super duper uber noob when it comes to tau and I've only played against them once in my entire decade of playing back in 4th edition, needless to say I'm relying on you guys and random batreps to get me up to speed.

Well first off, I made a general list of units I got in the trade that I've somewhat formed into units that I think may be good. So here it is. *Note that I don't plan to use everything here, just listed some things I thought would work well*

HQ Commander (Shas'o)
AFP/CIB/Targeting array, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

Elite Crisis Battlesuit team x3 (Shas'ui)
TL Missile pod/flamer x3,
Leader: bonding knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

Elite Crisis Battlesuit team x3 (Shas'ui)
Plasma rifle/missile pod/multi-tracker x3
leader: bonding knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

Elite Stealth Team x6 (Shas'ui)
Burst cannon x4, fusion cannon x2
Leader: Bonding Knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

Troop

Fast Attack Pathfinders x8
rail rifle x3
Transport: Devilfish
Disruption pod/multi-tracker

Fast Attack Vespid Stingwings x7

Fast Attack Vespid Stingwings x7

Heavy Hammerhead Gunship
railgun, smart missile system, disruption pod, multi-tracker

Heavy Hammerhead Gunship
railgun, smart missile system, disruption pod, multi-tracker

Heavy Broadside x3 (Shas'ui)
Shield generator x3
Leader: Bonding Knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

So first off I have some questions about the commander. Are the special guns fun to use? I figured since they're both short range weapons (18") They'd be fun to use in unison against blob squads. I also liked the idea of having atleast 2 shield drones per crisis team and on the commander to give them some extra durability. I'm not sure if the commander is very synergistic with the two crisis squads though. (I plan to run a squad of fireknives and a squad of deathrains).

My second question is about the crisis teams. How do their layouts look? Am I missing an upgrade or spending too much points?

My third question is about the stealth team. How, viable are they? They seemed pretty difficult to kill and offered some anti-horde firepower as well as some anti-tank.

Fourth. What troops would be well suited to the crisis layouts I plan to use? I have 52 FW's with the rifles, 12 with the carbines and I also have 28 kroot and 4 kroot hounds. I know I need to have atleast one group but due to their weakness I don't want to use a whole lot til I can get more devilfish (I only have the one atm). Also, can I use the devilfish that the pathfinders brought and stick FW's in them instead and just scout move the pathfinders? Also, Kroot seem like in a large mob they would be a decent ojbective holder and melee screen, what's the best way to use em?

Fifth. The hammerheads and the broadsides will be the backbone of my army. They'll obviously be my main tank killers so I'll probably want to take them in every large point battle. Did I go overkill on the broadsides' gear though? And did I gear the hammerheads with the most cost effective equipment?

6th. Vespid? They any good? They seem like nice units to hand back and defend objectives and the broadsides with, and they aren't that expensive for jump infantry with fleet.

7th I also have an ethereal I can stick in there to help with leadership problems but I hear they are pretty bad.

Well that's basically the gist of it guys, sorry if this was a long one I just really need advice as it all looks good on paper but I have yet to use the army. Thanks for taking the time just to read this!

Hi i think you have gone a little OTT with the broadsides sheild gens, normaly they can sit bad in some terrain and take a 4 plus cover so spending a fair amount on giving them all a 4+ invun imo is not needed. shield drones are always good to soak any high S instantkilling weapons, I normaly give my team leader target lock meaning you can target 2 things at once no point wasting 3 railguns on a rhino . ASS is somtimes a good buy also so you can move and still shoot.

I also believe this list is illegal. You only have one troop.

@kendowned that's a really good point I forgot about cover, and the target lock would be beneficial. Not to mention dropping the shield gens saves me 60 points.

@revackey I really hope you're joking dude. You're either just trolling or you didn't read my post at all.

I apologize I didn't know that the Tau counted a Devilfish as a troop, I thought you only had 1.

lol... If you read my post, I didn't put troops in the list as I was asking what troops are the best to use, kroot vs firewarriors. And how many per squad? I'd assume the full 12 due to the low leadership. But the devilfish and pathfinders are fast attack... so I don't know where you got that idea. I also wanted to know if I could take the compulsory devilfish with the pathfinders, but load it up with firewarriors instead and have it be legal?

I'm sorry I thought you were discussing tactics and I don't know Tau tactics.

Never take the Shas'o he's not a good choice. El with Targeting array is just as good and cheaper.

Stealthsuits should only be taken as mobile marker lights.

Your Crisis suits are good though.

Railrilfes should never be taken on Pathfinders. Makerlkights are too important to give up. You need more MLs in the list.

Vespids are awful. Even against MEQ (the thing they are best against) you are better off point for point with rifle armed FWs at 12" and with the FWs you can fire before the enemy gets with 12"...

Hammerheads are OK. I'd drop the smart missile system for burst cannons. You get more shots and it is 10 points cheaper. Ignoring LOS is much less important in 5th Ed than 4th.

Broadsides need ASS incase of DoW deployment. Otherwise TA is the only option worth considering for them. Take a team leader with HW Target lock and drone controller with 2x Shield drones to get some protection on the unit.

Kroot are in general considered the best troop choice. Personally I prefer mech FWs in Fish for late game objective grabbing. THough I do use 1 unit of Kroot for outflanking and getting at their backfield units.

Ethereal is awful, never ever take one. When they die (which they will do easily) then your entire army has to take an LD test, with Tau LD that is bad news...

Hope this helps. Tau need to remain mobile. Kroot can bubble wrap you to stop you auto-losing to turn 1 assaulting armies. Otherwise your best option is to go ninja and take a positional relay (the only thing that makes an 'O worth considering).

12 Fire Warriors, 20 Kroot. At max.

I also wanted to know if I could take the compulsory devilfish with the pathfinders, but load it up with firewarriors instead and have it be legal?

not only is this legal it is damn near manditory...

Posting Individual points costs is a no-no. Please edit them out. Check the post rules.

hivefleetmonolith wrote:HQ Commander (Shas'o) = AFP/CIB/Targeting array, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

1. Gluing the metallic weps on sucks.
2. The AfP and CiB are okay, but the FireKnife or FrieStorm are better configs, IMHO.
3. As mentioned by FiN, a Shas'El with Target Array is better.

hivefleetmonolith wrote:Elite Stealth Team x6 (Shas'ui) = Burst cannon x4, fusion cannon x2

I used to run this. They're better used as all anti-I. 6 BurstCans are good anti-I. Resist the temptation of the FBs.

hivefleetmonolith wrote:Fast Attack Pathfinders x8
rail rifle x3
Transport: Devilfish = 80+15 = 95
Disruption pod/multi-tracker

Echoing FiN's advice: Lose the RailRifles, and don't bother with a MT for the d'fish. Poor points spent on allowing GunDrones to shoot.

hivefleetmonolith wrote:Fast Attack Vespid Stingwings x7
Fast Attack Vespid Stingwings x7 =

Maybe, *maybe*, run one crew of 9, but there are far better choices to spend points on. Piranhas.

hivefleetmonolith wrote:Heavy Hammerhead Gunship = railgun, smart missile system, disruption pod, multi-tracker

I sometimes add Target Lock so the BCs hit troops and the RG nails a tank. After going back and forth between BCs and SMS, the BCs are slightly better, for less cost and two more dice (despite 6" of less range).

hivefleetmonolith wrote:Heavy Broadside x3 (Shas'ui) =Shield generator x3
Leader: Bonding Knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

Again, FiN stated the good loadout for these.

hivefleetmonolith wrote:So first off I have some questions about the commander. Are the special guns fun to use?
My third question is about the stealth team. How, viable are they? They seemed pretty difficult to kill and offered some anti-horde firepower as well as some anti-tank.

Answered.

hivefleetmonolith wrote:Fourth. What troops would be well suited to the crisis layouts I plan to use? I have 52 FW's with the rifles, 12 with the carbines and I also have 28 kroot and 4 kroot hounds.

I have 48 FWs. More than enough for any size army. Only 20 kroot though. Go with a FW unit per pathfinder unit (so the FWs can use the PFs' D'fish) and then kroot.

hivefleetmonolith wrote: Did I go overkill on the broadsides' gear though?

A couple times, I ran the b-side team with all Drone Controlers, and 6 SDs. I made sure to 'bubble wrap' them with a large kroot unit. They didn't move, but they sure could take a beating. Bit of a points sink, though.

hivefleetmonolith wrote:7th I also have an ethereal I can stick in there to help with leadership problems but I hear they are pretty bad.

That 6 SD unit I just mentioned? I had the ethereal in there too, for Fearless. But that was the only time I put him in the army.

Overall:
1. I'd make the HQ an 'El, FK or FS.
2. B-sdides like FiN indicated.
3. FWs and kroot (10 to 12 per unit)
4. XV8 configs are good.

Ok so this is my list so far. Thank you for all your advice so far.

HQ Commander (Shas'el)
AFP/CIB/Targeting array, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

Elite Crisis Battlesuit team x3 (Shas'ui)
TL Missile pod/flamer x3,
Leader: bonding knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

Elite Crisis Battlesuit team x3 (Shas'ui)
Plasma rifle/missile pod/multi-tracker x3
leader: bonding knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

Elite Stealth Team x6 (Shas'ui)
Burst cannon x4, fusion cannon x2
Leader: Bonding Knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

Troop Kroot x10

Troop Kroot x10

Troop Firewarrior x12 (shas'ui)
leader: markerlight, bonding knife

Fast Attack Pathfinders x8
rail rifle x3
Transport: Devilfish
Disruption pod/multi-tracker

Heavy Hammerhead Gunship
railgun, smart missile system, disruption pod, multi-tracker

Heavy Hammerhead Gunship
railgun, smart missile system, disruption pod, multi-tracker

Heavy Broadside x3 (Shas'ui)
ASS x3
Leader: Bonding Knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2), HW target lock

=1720

So I'm wondering what to do to finish getting it to 2k?

I can accept that you ignore my advice on the FBs in the Stealth crew

but posting points cost violates GW's Intellectual Property rights, meaning Dakka gets mean e-mails threatening to be sued. It's not likely to happen, but really, we don't need the numbers.

hivefleetmonolith wrote:Elite Stealth Team x6 (Shas'ui) = Burst cannon x4, fusion cannon x2
Leader: Bonding Knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)

I'll try one more time.

FusionBs mean really close range, which leads to being assaulted. And this is a huge unit (for Tau) with 8 models, easily *caught* in h2h.

hivefleetmonolith wrote:Pathfinders x8 = rail rifle x3 Transport: Devilfish = Disruption pod/multi-tracker

You'll pay ~12 points so two GDs can shoot, with their crappy BS? if you want the D'fish to be a decent gunboat, go whole-hog: SMS, MT, DisPod and Target Array. This is called a Warfish. *That's* a good upgrade.

hivefleetmonolith wrote:So I'm wondering what to do to finish getting it to 2k?

Anther set of Pathfinders and their Warfish and a set of FWs to hop into that Warfish.

I think its already been said but i wouldnt take railrifles on a pathfinders lots of markerlights = awsome, making ur fire warriors bs 5 when rapid fireing is great plus geting rid of any pesky cover saves stoping the true potential of your firepower.

I normaly run an expensive shas'el bodyguarded hq maxing them all up with plasma's and fusions all at bs 4/5 not sure if its a good idea but its fun owning squads with lotsa ap 1/2.

also i dont normaly bother with SMS on hammer head if just go for the cheaper birst cannons but take SMS on the devilfish otherwise the dones pop off when it dies and gives away another KP.

umm other than that pritty tasty list i like kroot as troop nice being cheap and having infiltrate dunno if its just cos my club has alot of trees.

First off, if you really want good Tau help, just go and read articles on advanced Tau Tactica. The guys there are very good... and in this link:
http://advancedtautactica.com/viewforum.php?f=34&sid=d6a86efa8223d492ddc43ca8ecdf199c
They have decriptions of every unit, how they are typically used, and other useful tidbits.

Now for my own info...
I guess I'll go from bottom up.
Broadsides: I like. 2 Shield Drones for the entire squad and a Target Lock on the commander will keep the footprint at 5 (easier to hide) and plenty durable. Plus, hoping for luck, you'll be able to smash 2 vehicles a turn. Add another identical squad and you can smush 3-4. In general, good choice for a unit, and one of the better choices for Tau in 5th edition as it is so heavily mechanized.

The hammerheads: Personally, I think the SMS is overcosted and in general not worth your time and points (considering you have to model your own!) Consider this: for.. is it 10? 10 less points you gain two more shots for having a pair of burst cannons. Only disadvantage is 6" of range and that nifty ignore LOS thing. In all reality though, if someone is closing that quickly with your Hammerhead, you'll want more shots. In my last game the burst cannons did way more than my railgun ever did thinning out charging Terminators and the like with sheer amount of dice rolls. With how expensive Tau stuff is, I'd reccomend being as economical as possible with every you buy. I think your SMS points are better spent elsewhere, such as on Flechette Dischargers or other vehicle/battlesuit upgrades. Oooh! Or a Target lock. You DEFINITELY want one of those, or half your guns are wasted whenever you fire that Railgun 72" downfield.

Pathfinder's.... definitely going to say nay to the rail rifles. Think of it this way: 3 shots. BS3. 1.5 hits. 5/4 wounds. So roughly one marine (out of cover dead.) And you're spending how many points? Go with all markerlights. Not only can you up the BS of anything in your army, but you can also strip cover saves and lower leadership on pinning tests. SOOO much better. And you want as many hits as possible.

I'll say this... not really a fan of the markerlights IN the fire warrior squad, but in the end whatever way you go it's not really a list changing upgrade so I won't comment either way. Personal preference.

DEFINITELY drop the Fusion Blasters off of the Stealth Team. Average roll of night fighting is ~21" If you shoot at 12" and move 6" you're only 18" away. You will get seen, and shot. Instead, take advantage of that 18" range and skirt that the entire game. It's harder to roll a 24" than it is an 18" by far. THEN! You can even drop the shield drones to save 30 points and if you REALLY want to have fun, switch them out for a pair of marker drones that can fire on the move with your squad. Expensive as hell, but 18 BC shots at BS5 is a pretty good way to kill Infantry, MCs, and Light Vehicles through sheer amount of hits. Plus if the team is out of range with their own guns they can help markerlight something else for somebody. But definitely go all Burst cannons.

Now the big points. I like your simple Crisis squads. 3 suits each, with a pair of drones for leadership and wound absorption services. Vewy nice. However that lone commander with his own drones? Not only are you going to attract a fair amount of firepower... but you won't be able to exactly dish out that much for how many points you're spending there. Think about it. For 150 you could get 15 Fire Warriors which is 30 shots. You shoot <10 and only gain durability and mobility. What I'd do is drop a Crisis suit from one of your two squads and have the Commander join that squad so it still numbers 3. You get better leadership, and better point efficiency.

Now with all the point saving things that have been offered.... buy some Piranhas! Cheap, Fast AV 11 to contest and tank shock, overwhelm with a buttload of Burstcannon Fire, or melt tanks with Fusion Blasters. That, or beef up the Kroot squads a bit. Mine have been performing shamefully at only 10 since they lack an armor save.

So didn't mean to cut off a few of your advice (my last post the window had been open all day and I didn't refresh only to find several new posts between my post). But yes I've taken it all into account. And here is my playtest ready list.

HQ Commander (Shas'el)
AFP/CIB, HW multi-tracker, HW target lock, HW drone controller (shield drone x2)
HQ Crisis Bodyguard x2
Targetting array/plasma/fusion x2, HW multi-tracker

Elite Crisis Battlesuit team x3 (Shas'ui)
TL Missile pod/flamer x3,
Leader: bonding knife, HW drone controller (shield drone)

Elite Crisis Battlesuit team x3 (Shas'ui)
Plasma rifle/missile pod/multi-tracker x3
leader: bonding knife, HW drone controller (shield drone)

Elite Stealth Team x6 (Shas'ui)
Leader: Bonding Knife, HW drone controller (marker drone x2)

Troop Kroot x10

Troop Kroot x10

Troop Firewarrior x12 (shas'ui)
Leader: Bonding Knife

Fast Attack Pathfinders x8
Transport: Devilfish
Disruption pod

Heavy Hammerhead Gunship
railgun/burst cannons, disruption pod, multi-tracker, target lock

Heavy Hammerhead Gunship
railgun/burst cannons, disruption pod, multi-tracker, target lock

Heavy Broadside x3 (Shas'ui)
ASS x3
Leader: Bonding Knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2), HW target lock

= 1997

So I took the rail rifles off the pathfinders as I need more markerlights and railrifles aren't that great. I changed the fusion blaster back to burst cannons on the stealth squad and changed the drones to marker drones. I had to reduce the number of shield drones per crisis squad to 1, which is unfortunate but not a big sacrifice. And I also added a bodyguard to the commander and they're gonna be an up in your face squad hopefully. I suppose I'm still lacking a little in troops but I plan to infiltrate the kroot near objectives and keep them in cover and I plan to have the firewarriors in the devilfish and come in from reserve for some late game objective grabbing/contesting while trying to keep them at full capacity in case they need to kill a troop that tries to contest the objective they want to take.

So how does this look guys? worthy enough for a playtest?

Looks prety good. Worth a play test. You are light on scoring bodies though with 1 FW the only thing that seems suited to taking objectives.

So I think you were right about the lack of scoring units. At this point level I think I may have been a little battlesuit heavy as well. So I revised my list a little and this is what I came up with.

HQ Commander (Shas'el)
AFP/CIB, HW multi-tracker, HW target lock, HW drone controller (shield drone x2), bonding knife

Elite Crisis Battlesuit team x3 (Shas'ui)
TL Missile pod/flamer x3

Elite Crisis Battlesuit team x3 (Shas'ui)
Plasma rifle/missile pod/multi-tracker x3
leader: bonding knife, HW drone controller (shield dronex2)

Elite Stealth Team x6 (Shas'ui)
Drone controllers
Leader: Bonding Knife, HW drone controller (marker drone x2)

Troop Kroot x12

Troop Kroot x11

Troop Firewarrior x12 (shas'ui)
Leader: Bonding Knife

Troop Firewarrior x12 (shas'ui)
Leader: Bonding Knife

Fast Attack Pathfinders x8
Transport: Devilfish
Disruption pod

Heavy Hammerhead Gunship
railgun/smart missiles, disruption pod, multi-tracker, target lock

Heavy Hammerhead Gunship
railgun/smart missiles, disruption pod, multi-tracker, target lock

Heavy Broadside x3 (Shas'ui)
Advanced stabilization system x3
Leader: Bonding Knife, HW drone controller (shield drone x2), HW target lock

= 1999

So Basically I took out the bodyguard and moved some shield drones around. I gave the commander 2 shield drones and a bonding knife and took them off the crisis squad with the flamers because the commander will be joining that squad. I also beefed up the kroot squads slightly. I also added the smart missiles back to the hammerheads only because I play WYSIWYG and I only have the SMS. I also added another bonded firewarrior squad to help with objectives and for the extra anti-infantry they provide. Overall I'm happier with the way this list looks.

So the way the army will hopefully work is that the pathfinders will be somewhere near the action in cover, shooting their markers and staying put. The kroot squads will stay in cover and hopefully be near objectives to provide some anti-infantry harassment. One firewarrior squad will be held in reserve in the devilfish to provide late game support/objective taking while the other will be either helping to screen other units or booking it toward an objective.
The fireknife crisis suits will be midfield targetting transports and vulnerable elites. The Commander and crisis squad will be around the mid field, the missile pods shooting at transports at range, or if the enemy gets close the commander will use his weapons in unison with the flamers to do some anti-mob damage. The stealth squad will be anywhere needed to mow down infantry with their BS 3-5 18 shots of pwnage. The broadsides and hammerhead will be dedicated to their anti-armor purpose in the rear of the army.