Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Ok, firstly I know they are maybe getting a new codex in November but bear with me.
I also know that I might annoy some people with this thread, sorry.

So why are DE good?
I have heard how they demolish entire armies by turn 3 and how they are so fast and awesome but really, how?

Here the main 3 things I have heard:

1) DE have the speed, they are the fastest army in the game!

True, but what are you going to do with that speed when you have the profile of a guardsman? Other that Tau and IG, DE can't really stand up in a fight.

2) DE have Wyches, and wyches are so great because they shut off special things and are unkillable in Close Combat.

I keep hearing about how great Wyches are. But they are strictly average. Unless you get a good roll on the drugs and roll nothing but 5+'s to wound, sure but otherwise they kinda suck... You dont need power weapons or an extra attack per model from extra CCW to be able to take on a T3 4+ Save unit.

3) DE can have Dark Lance Spam.

SWEET! Too bad once you hit a horde you are screwed. Also once you pop your opponent's transports you are pretty much done because after that they just hide in terrain and pop out a missile launcher or two every turn untill it's time to grab some objectives.

Overall, i see them bad at combat (except for their HQ's) and bad at massed shooting (S3 Rifles...). The only things I see them excel at is killing transports and absolutely massacreing troops that are not in cover, which is something you will never see your opponent step out of.

Don't get me wrong, I love Dark Eldar. I just dont see them winning even after I have heard so often how in the hands of an expert they butcher the enemy so badly that his models disintegrate

Speed lets you do much more than just close distance quickly, for a shooting based list (which is what the DE list is usually run as atm) it means that no assault units are going to catch and/or hit you. It lets you catch people out of position and generally makes sure you are always in the best positions to cause maximum damage.

In any case DE are far far better than Guard in combat, WS4 and I5 puts them on a different level. Warriors won't beat Marines one on one very often, but they cost half the points of a Marine anyway. The I5 particularly helps make up for their lack of toughness, enough S3 attacks and they will drop Marines. Wyches are a match for Marines if you can get them into combat safely, Wych Weapons and their other special rules (i.e Dodge) mean they are actually just as likely to do well against the more Elite units (with power weapons etc) than a Tactical Squad. They certainly aren't unkillable though, although it tends to be shooting which causes them issues more than combat. Again they are pretty cheap for what they do, just don't expect them to take on a fully tooled up combat unit and win without support.

Dark Lance Spam isn't as scary as it used to be, the general trend of 5th edition (with new codices and people just generally working out the best way to run things) has been towards large numbers of cheap transports which DE can't handle very well as they can't get enough Dark Lances to make up for the fact their armour is made of paper and they have no cheaper, multi shot S6/7 weapon which would be better suited for the job. DE still don't fear hordes though, they have Disintergrators which clean up any infantry in the game (they are always taken to blast infantry off the board once you kill the vehicles) and can generally do a decent job in assault against horde type armies as well (as they are usually easier to beat in assault than Marines). They also have speed which means they can avoid fights they don't want to be in anyway. Even in horde armies you can still find things to fire Dark Lances at, with Nids you take out the MCs (which causes the rest major issues as well) and against Orks you have Nobz etc.

One of the biggest reasons that DE do so well is that they match up well against certain lists. They are perfectly suited to deal with Marines, blast the vehicles (including Land Raiders) off the board, Disintergrator the infantry and assault to finish them off. Considering half or more lists tend to be Marines it can explain why they do quite well. The other factor is the rarity of DE, and its definitely a contributer to their success. Simply because almost no one plays them many players won't have faced them before and therefore don't know how to deal with them properly.

zeekill wrote:Ok, firstly I know they are maybe getting a new codex in November but bear with me.
I also know that I might annoy some people with this thread, sorry.

So why are DE good?

I mean no offense with this statement : Your post seemed to be a lot of QQ (We all QQ from time to time when were frustrated).
As such, I don't think that replying to each point individually is really important here.

The DE codex is an old codex, and it has very few 'winning combinations'. Do some research through the dakka tactics forums, and you will find some great articles on DE tactics. They should help you win vs. other players.

Tl;DR

Because they're much different than most other armies. Different = Better (sometimes)

If you are thinking of getting a DE army and waiting till nov for the new codex remember this. The army hasn't changed in 2-3 editions, buying wyches, raiders, or dark lance powered ravagers, might end up to bite you in the but, when new units come out that are better, or when these units get nerfed. I know its fun to fantasize about a new army, but the time spent looking at tactics, army lists, and battle reports will be lost time when all the rules are changed and the codex is brought into the 2nd millennium. (only 38 left)

Well, I played DE in the 3rd and a bit in the 4th ed.
Now they hit the shelf until the new codex comes out.