Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I'll describe the situation as simply as possible.

I'm playing Blood Angels against my friend's Daemon army - his squad of Crushers forces my squad of Assault Marines down to 2, and they fail their leadership test, falling back 9" on my turn- they are within 6" of another one of his units, so he says he keep falling back on the subsequent turn (which makes sense).

But, on the following turn (his turn half), when they fell back again, and outside of his unit's range, he says they cannot regroup until my turn. Because of this sleaze, he moved a unit towards them and, according to him, "made them within 6 inches again, forcing them to fall back until they go off the board".

What I don't understand in all this is ATSKNF seems to state that they auto-regroup unless they're within 1" of an enemy unit (in which case they're destroyed). Can anyone let me know what should have happened?

Read the rules for regrouping, note that you can only regroup on your turn, and note which rules ATSKNF actually override.

End result: your friend was correct, it has worked this way, to my knowledge, since 3rd ed, and is a usual way of removing marines from the board.

Magnalon wrote:Search I'll describe the situation as simply as possible.

I'm playing Blood Angels against my friend's Daemon army - his squad of Crushers forces my squad of Assault Marines down to 2, and they fail their leadership test, falling back 9" on my turn- they are within 6" of another one of his units, so he says he keep falling back on the subsequent turn (which makes sense).

But, on the following turn (his turn half), when they fell back again, and outside of his unit's range, he says they cannot regroup until my turn. Because of this sleaze, he moved a unit towards them and, according to him, "made them within 6 inches again, forcing them to fall back until they go off the board".

What I don't understand in all this is ATSNNF seems to state that they auto-regroup unless they're within 1" of an enemy unit (in which case they're destroyed). Can anyone let me know what should have happened?

He was correct. ATSKNF only removes some of the restrictions. The 6" restriction stays in place and can result in a unit being "herded" off the board.

Also, your assertion that "unless they're within 1" of an enemy unit (in which case they're destroyed)" is completely wrong. He doesn't HAVE to chase them, and don't forget the SM can still shoot, so could possibly kill the unit close to them.

Thanks guys - that seemed really sleazy at first glance, given that he just moved cheap units flat out to herd my powerfist off the board, but RaW is Raw.

The simple solution is to not fail morale checks.

And to be fair, non-SM have a much worse time with it than SM do.

Haha - as an Ork player I know what you mean.

"Oh, so a meager one of your lootas in a squad of ten died and you failed your leadership test? Might as well take them off them boyz off the board! Hur hur!"

Why are you taking morale checks for 10% casualties?

And at Ld9 they have a fair chance of passing anyway.

You can still shoot as you run backwards, remember. Its not fantasy falling back. So if he puts something killable nearby some rapid firing bolters may just clear them out.

nosferatu1001 wrote:Why are you taking morale checks for 10% casualties?

And at Ld9 they have a fair chance of passing anyway.

You can still shoot as you run backwards, remember. Its not fantasy falling back. So if he puts something killable nearby some rapid firing bolters may just clear them out.

I'm still re-introducing myself to 40K, so most of my rule knowledge now is based off my group of friends - they didn't indicate I could still shoot while falling back - that would have been really useful in multiple games .

It's really hard to learn every single facet of every rule in two month's time - but I think Gwar has helped pretty nicely.

And that's why Friends are a Bad Thing™.

The best thing I can suggest doing is reading the book outside of games. Just read it through, cover to cover (of the rules...), then go backwards through it again.

That should get enough rules into your head to start wth, and then simply play as many games as possible. Thankfully I'm blessed with a near-eidetic memory for rules (and symbolics, such as equations, but I am TERRIBLE with names. Weiirdly), just not quite as eidetic as Gwar!s

nosferatu1001 wrote:The best thing I can suggest doing is reading the book outside of games. Just read it through, cover to cover (of the rules...), then go backwards through it again.

I'll do that before my game tomorrow, thanks!

No worries - wait until 6th ed comes around and you start confusing the changes in the rules, start playing old rules (although sadly noones let me forget about rhino rush not working any longer, sad face bezerkers...)

nosferatu1001 wrote:Why are you taking morale checks for 10% casualties?

Close combat, I would imagine.

I played during 3rd Edition then skipped to 5th- so that right there confuses me a ton.

Thats a hellishly wiffed combat, only losing by 1....and still, Ld9 isnt bad. What is bad is that they are unlikely to survive to fall back, unless it was necrons or terminators assaulting them - I2 doesnt do well in sweeping advance!

If someone tries to 'herd' your unit off board, it is nice to have a second unit to countercharge the 'herders', giving your fellas a chance to regroup.

Also your guys dont move during his phase once they are broken unless they were broken in his shooting phase. I might be miss reading what you typed in the first post but you only move when it is your movement, or you fail a LD test during specific instances.

Or in other words you fall back, on your turn you continue to fall back unless you auto rally. His turn you do not move. Rinse and repeat for how ever many times it is necessary.

On a related note, do marines regroup immediately after falling back? Or do they regroup at the start of the marine players next turn?

Noisy: that question was already answered by both Nos, and Gwar.