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so, how does Everblight play?
i want to know because this would be the point where i decide if i want to play Horde, as the other 3 faction doesn't interest me that much
is Thargrosh any good?, he does look good....., but is he any good ?

if no then, i am sticking to warmachine, and going to pick up either force expansions, or other faction(cygnar)

Everblight players will tell you that, after Mk2 hit, their faction sucks and Privateer hates them all. Rational people will tell you that Everblight used to be the most horrifyingly broken thing in the game, and that Mk2 fixed most of the problems that made them thus.

Legion of Everblight is often viewed as a glass cannon faction: They tend to hit extremely hard, but much of their line-up can't take hits very well (barring the Carnivean chassis). They're very fast due to wings and/or pathfinder on most of their beasts, although their infantry are somewhat less so (barring Striders, of course). Their ranged game is the best in Hordes, although their melee is no slouch either.

As for warlocks, both Thags are great. Normal Thagrosh is sort of a jack of all trades IIRC, and eThags is a rather brutal beast caster.

To add to what the Laughing Man said, Legion has got, and is getting, a very impressive raft of new models that more than make up for any shortcomings percieved by the naysayers. The Ravagore looks particularly nasty, and the stingers seem pretty zippy, as well.
Assassination and the Alpha strike seems to be the theme with most Legion armies. They don't stand up well in attrition-type battles (Vis a Vis PoM and Skorne), but can layer animi and spells on powerful heavy warbeasts that can wreck your day in round 2. They also have the speed to get there.
I don't personally like the theme of the list, as I prefer my Skorne in look, but as to the feel of play; if you like the models, they are really fun and as competitive as any army in the game.
Armies of Legion tend to be a bit smaller in number than the other factions (possibly excepting Trollbloods), because their cheapest Heavy is 9 points. (I still can't consider the Seraph a Heavy ) However, all of their heavies can destroy any heavy beast/jack in the game in one turn, if applied with the right spells/animi.
Synopsis: I wouldn't worry about playing this army. They are as competitive as any, IMHO.

I have only played against legion with my battleship khador group. I won both games I have had against them (my local gamers dont play hordes so the only games I have had against them ar on vassal). They seem to have a ton of good buffs for their heavies and their heavies hit haaaaaard and move fast. Carni has 2x pow 16 and a pow 19? I think. I lost a behemoth to a scythean and the only reason I won was out of some luck. Downside: I charged that scythean with two manhunters and ended it in three swings from the 4 pts of models.

So yes, from my experience, they are very much glass cannons.

KingKodo wrote:I have only played against legion with my battleship khador group. I won both games I have had against them (my local gamers dont play hordes so the only games I have had against them ar on vassal). They seem to have a ton of good buffs for their heavies and their heavies hit haaaaaard and move fast. Carni has 2x pow 16 and a pow 19? I think. I lost a behemoth to a scythean and the only reason I won was out of some luck. Downside: I charged that scythean with two manhunters and ended it in three swings from the 4 pts of models.

So yes, from my experience, they are very much glass cannons.

In all fairness charging weapon masters are hard on everything.

In other word, we have somekind of a mix between Cryx and low number of khador?

hmmm, interesting, i always wanted a quick kill high risk army, and the shooty part also make it nicer ....
I guess i will try pThargrosh first, so my goal is getting in the enemy face , fast and hard right?

@Laughingman: While Legion was extremely strong in MK1, as it was a glass cannon, but it still required a significant amount of finesse. If anything I feel that it is always a lack of understanding that causes players to call things overpowered. Let's look at the things that got me the most complaints (which were then changed) in MK1 500 point Vayl list (First off, note that it is only 10 models, Vayl, Carnivean, Seraph x2, Shreder x4, Forsaken x2). In my opinion, MK1 Vayl exemplifies the glass cannon archetype.

1. Dark Sentinel. Used to activate unlimited times. One of her greatest assets, but also, one of her greatest weaknesses. The key here is understanding that Vayl is completely helpless if knocked down. Her pitiful ARM and negligible damage boxes (13 of each, she's the frailest commander in the game) means that she has to transfer pretty much everything that hits her - against armies that have autohits or knockdown/stationary spells or feats, Vayl is usually up the creek without a paddle. Dark sentinel is extremely strong, but once declared if knocked down, that advantage is lost for a turn. On top of that, if the dark sentinel is slammed into Vayl, the attacking player gets a nice 2 for 1... No dark sentinel and Vayl is knocked down. Her high defense is moot, and she'll probably have to transfer the colateral damage. Her usual Dark Sentinels have low DEF so this tactic works great against her. While this used to be one of her most potent abilities - it only takes a little thinking outside the box to stop it. On top of the effective knock down method, any out of activation movements don't trigger the sentinel, so guys like Bane Knights can waltz right on past it.

2. Slipstream. After making dark sentinel only activate once, they changed slipstream to only move up to 2" max - while it was understandable to limit Legion's speed. For my list, this meant that she was reduced to zero ways of escaping from reach infantry (espeically after the dark sentinel nerf). Considering that in MK1, she couldn't fight at all in melee, this, combined with the changes to Dark Sentinel made it much more unsafe for her to run at the front, spamming chiller and incite.

Enter MKII

3. Having units move multiple times under her feat was too strong (never mind that knocked down or stationary models couldn't move under the old system!). Only one move per unit now. Combined with fliers no longer immune to free strikes, she is much harder to protect when up at the front of the army. - Without the fliers to run interference under her feat, incite as a first strike weapon is pretty suicidal these days and has been reduced to a "use when it is safe" as opposed to "use it to hit first, and then hit second."

4. On top of this, her crowd control is much diminished as hoarfrost is now just a standard AOE instead of 3" splash around a friendly warbeast.

In exchange, oraculus always hits now, making her a more reliable ranged caster While I'm not saying that she's unplayable now - but it really is a huge change, changing her from a fragile but potent frontline alpha-strike generator to a strong mid-range support/mop up warlock.

Retrias wrote:In other word, we have somekind of a mix between Cryx and low number of khador?

hmmm, interesting, i always wanted a quick kill high risk army, and the shooty part also make it nicer ....
I guess i will try pThargrosh first, so my goal is getting in the enemy face , fast and hard right?

I wouldn't say that the Legion is "Cryx/Khdaor like", but if you must draw a paraellel to WM then I guess it's the closest equilivalent. They're definitely not as sturdy as Khador but do hit like a ton of bricks.

If you're looking for "quick kill, high risk", then I don't think there's a more appropriate army then Legion. In MK2, the Legion is no longer "broken fast", but they are still one the more mobile factions in Hordes. Having a Hordes army where the frenzing warbeasts do not try to kill their own warlock is always nice. Hence Legion is one of the armies that tend to run fairly "hot".

As previously mentioned, I fully agree that Legion does have the "glass jaw" problem. I've witnessed and played games against Legion players when their <<insert Heavy WarBeast Name here>> whiffed a few attacks at a critical juncture of a game and BAM game over... Of course there's always the vice versa where a few good rolls a Legion player tore down a heavy warjack/warbeast when most other armies would have to spend several turns to take it down. Luck of the dice is always a factor, but some armies are more susceptible to good/bad dice then others.

If you like a fast, mobile, and hard hitting army, then I feel that the Legion could be a good fit. However, if you have a problem with throwing and cursing at your dice then... Really think about it before investing.

I wouldn't say that Legion is the fastest Hordes army. Circle is comparably fast (if just a little bit slower). Legion's advantage lies in its easy access to Eyeless Sight, Flight and Pathfinder. Circle has pathfinder, but lacks the former two.

Salisar wrote:

Retrias wrote:In other word, we have somekind of a mix between Cryx and low number of khador?

hmmm, interesting, i always wanted a quick kill high risk army, and the shooty part also make it nicer ....
I guess i will try pThargrosh first, so my goal is getting in the enemy face , fast and hard right?

I wouldn't say that the Legion is "Cryx/Khdaor like", but if you must draw a paraellel to WM then I guess it's the closest equivalent. They're definitely not as sturdy as Khador but do hit like a ton of bricks.

If you're looking for "quick kill, high risk", then I don't think there's a more appropriate army then Legion. In MK2, the Legion is no longer "broken fast", but they are still one the more mobile factions in Hordes. Having a Hordes army where the frenzing warbeasts do not try to kill their own warlock is always nice. Hence Legion is one of the armies that tend to run fairly "hot".

As previously mentioned, I fully agree that Legion does have the "glass jaw" problem. I've witnessed and played games against Legion players when their <<insert Heavy WarBeast Name here>> whiffed a few attacks at a critical juncture of a game and BAM game over... Of course there's always the vice versa where a few good rolls a Legion player tore down a heavy warjack/warbeast when most other armies would have to spend several turns to take it down. Luck of the dice is always a factor, but some armies are more susceptible to good/bad dice then others.

If you like a fast, mobile, and hard hitting army, then I feel that the Legion could be a good fit. However, if you have a problem with throwing and cursing at your dice then... Really think about it before investing.

I had no trouble on cursing at my dice, before/or after praying to it, sometime in the same roll, if it works then it works, i guess i would try to run a simulation first , e.g borrow some friends army, then pit them against the most common faction in my game group Troll/ menoth

Legion is apparently like Cryx, but with more shooting and more expensive monsters.

I do not agree with this. Legion is different because of how the army works. Magic is not the same, as the lack of nodes (couple exceptions) makes them hard to use effectively with offensive magic. Also the carnivean is a fast but also pretty durable beast and expensive pointswise, unlike the slayer, who is cheap and should have paper armour to make the cost accurate.

Troops are also very different as most of them have descent defense3s to protect them. They are also a tad more expensive then most cryx stuff. That results in legion having smaller armies, which is nothing like cryx...

The only thing that is comparable is that legion also has lots of tricks. Or more accurately ignores even more rules per beast then cryx does. (eyeless sight is the prime example)