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I'm a big Raven Guard fan, and the new Blood Angel Codex offers some interesting ways to represent an all Jump Pack RG army.

But, would it be effective?

In 1850 points, you can easily fit in:

1 Captain w/ JP and lightning claws

3 x 10 Man Assault Squads w/ 2 meltas, sarge w/ PF

2 x 10 Man Assault Squads w/ 2 flamers, sarge w/ PF

and have a little over 500 points left.

Is there something that "has" to be included to help make this list more effective?

Is an 'all jump pack' list viable?

It doesn't HAVE to be all 'jump pack', but I'd like it to be mostly 'jump pack'.

Also, as this is a Raven Guard army, and I think the "Decent of Angles" and the ability to take Assault Marines as Troops helps better represent a RG army.

Having said that, no Death Company, or Baal Predators or Furiosos or any other distinctly BA things should be taken...

I'm in it to have fun, clearly, and it is something I want to model up an paint, but I'd like it to be effective too!

Any and all help will be greatly appreciated!

Maybe a Chaplain w/ JP and another Squad or two of assault marines I could see that working well with this list.

Points-wise, I think I can maybe add in a Chaplain and one more Assault Squad...

So, is this enough 'melta' and 'flamer' to deal with armor and horde?

From the perspective of a Ork player, I am still under sure if he could have massive waves of orks in a Footslogger army style. I would also wonder how it would do against something like a heavy vehicle and/or terminator army. Just food for thought.

In the end, it probably will just manage to be "OK", but I suppose I'm OK with that!

Maybe with the proposed Chaplain and another flamer Assault Squad...

The only thing I have actually done with my BA JP army as of lately, is hybridized it a bit.

I usually ran a 1500 Pt army with as many assault squads as possible, but I also had a libby, chappy, and two dev's squads.

Now I am sure the Dev's don't fit your theme, they just offer a very very nice balance to help deal with Mech heavy armies. Target priority is difficult when you have 20-30 Assault marines charging you, or 4-8 ML's firing at you from back field.

Also, I take it you aren't interested in Sanguinary Priests (FNP helps a ton)? I would take them and proxy them as Apothecaries basically.

Run a Librarian to get Shield of Sanguinius (5+ cover save to all units in 6" range) AND Unleash Rage (re-roll hits just like a Chaplain) for 100 pts flat, plus a force weapon. That's way cheaper than a Chappy, and in my opinion, better.

Also think about adding a Priest or two for a mere 50 points each, giving all units within 6" FNP and Furious charge - when your units are chugging across the field, FNP is pretty huge for up to 3-4 squads at once.

I second the apothecary idea. I'm doing that for my Pre-Heresy WE all-jump-pack army when I make it. I don't want 'blood priests' so I'm going to make them the guys who tweak the aggression implants (Furious) heal wounds and give them stimulants (FNP).

I think you could do well to throw in 2 JP Chappies and 2 JP Priests. A JP Libby for 125 is a steal as well.

I think DoA is very Raven Guard. I also think full JP armies aren't the best thing out there, but they can be and are competitive if built correctly. 50 marines is hard to stop. People forget that in the age of transports and small squads, but it's especially true when you give them 'apothecaries' to keep them alive to get to the enemy.

The Libby will give you that incredibly important 5+ for a front-leaning charge as well.

The Captain is meh, but you already know that.

Sanguinary Priests are really what make ASMs worthwhile, aside from the ability to take them as troops. As un-Raven Guardy as it may be, I'd throw some in.

This is purely personal preference and fluff interpretation, but I don't think I'd go ALL Assault Marines for a Raven Guard force. They like 'em, absolutely, but I never got the impression they were a pure assault army. I'm actually trying to do something sort of similar at the moment, and trying to figure out a way to get mobile shooting in without going boring old mech. It's not happening, but I haven't given up hope.

From the perspective of a Raven Guard player, while I love the concept of Assault Marines as troops, the RG aren't based around using them. It just happens to be a commonly used tool because of Shrike's usual abilities and it fits the fluff of a fast-striking force.

Instead of focusing on all Jump Packs and Assault, look at RG more as a "Hit hard, hit fast, hit the weakpoints" type army. It's less about running over the enemy with fast assault troops, and more about taking out everything good in their army quickly and efficiently. While Jump Marines make good support choices for such an army as they can engage and kill things very quickly (especially with meltaguns) you shouldn't feel confined with those.

While I know you don't want to use too much of the BA -only stuff, Baal Predators and Storm Ravens would make an interesting additions to the army. Both deliver a lot of firepower quickly, and the Storm Raven allows an amazing transport capacity. I'd also urge you to consider taking Deep Striking Assault Terminators. With DoA they should land safely, and with or without a Sanguinary priest, they should hit very hard.

So I'd almost tell you to drop an Assault Squad or two and add some ways to get some high efficiency shooting or some other durable units in there. Right now you can get across the board quick, but in the end, especially without Sanguinary Priests, you're just marines with swords.

The BA Codex has so many neat toys that aren't too nonfluffy for RG, I'd make every effort to take advantage of them.

I'm not against Sanguinary Priests as I could just use them as 'standard' Apothecaries and there is a fluff basis for RG being 'advanced' in the area of bio-tech...

And I don't mean to say that ALL RG armies are ALL Jump Pack based - I'm just saying that my particular force is.

It does nicely represent the ability to strike where necessary.

I suppose 2 Devastator squads would 'help', especially w/ Missile Launchers for horde/mech work...

So, based on some of the advice here:


HQ: Captain (1#, 155 pts)
1 Captain @ 155 pts w/ Jump Pack; Lightning Claw x2)

Elite: Sanguinary Priest (2#, 180 pts)
1 Sanguinary Priest in Power Armour Jump Pack; Bolt Pistol; Power Sword
1 Sanguinary Priest in Power Armour Jump Pack; Bolt Pistol; Power Sword

Troops: Assault Squad (10#, 235 pts)
9 Assault Squad @ 235 pts
2 x Melta Guns
1 Sergeant w/ Power Fist

Troops: Assault Squad (10#, 235 pts)
9 Assault Squad @ 235 pts
2 x Melta Guns
1 Sergeant w/ Power Fist

Troops: Assault Squad (10#, 235 pts)
9 Assault Squad @ 235 pts
2 x Melta Guns
1 Sergeant w/ Power Fist

Troops: Assault Squad (10#, 225 pts)
9 Assault Squad
2 x Flamers
1 Sergeant w/ Power Fist

Troops: Assault Squad (10#, 225 pts)
9 Assault Squad
2 x Flamers
1 Sergeant w/ Power Fist

Heavy Support: Devastator Squad (178 pts)
8 Devastators 4 x missile launchers

Heavy Support: Devastator Squad (178 pts)
8 Devastators 4 x missile launchers


Total Roster Cost: 1846

I could make a slight change by changing the 2 x 8 man Dev squads w/ 4 missile launchers into 3 x 5 man Dev squads w/ 3 missile launchers and that would make it 1850 on the nose...

You could use the Dante character and just rename him for your chapter... fits in nicely with an all JP army by giving the ability for a unit not to scatter, plus giving all your JP units the ability to reroll the reserves, helping to keep you from showing up piecemail. I'd absolutely have in the apothecary models. Also, a vanguard vet unit with DoA can be very deadly.... kit them out with a PF and a few PW.... being able to assault the turn you arrive and only having to worry about scattering d6 instead of the 2d6 makes this unit a lot less risky. The combo I like most is to use a vanguard unit, see where they land and then have an apothecary and Dante with a troop squad land almost right next to them (since they don't scatter) and then position your apothecary so that the vanguard are within 6" to get the benefit of the furious charge.

dont give Sang priests power swords since they can be targeted in close combat and usually killed quickly making the PW a waste of your points.
if you dont like devs maybe dreds can take their place? just ref dreds or libbie dreds with the blood lance, i dunno if that woudl fit yr fluff.

Agreed - keep the Sanguinary Priests naked.

If you're planning to DoA them the majority of the time, you might want to consider finding room for at least one Vanguard Veteran squad. Nothing quite like tying up the other guy's rock unit before it has a chance to cut into something you don't want it cutting into.

are vanguard vets good for DoA, i always use DC for that task.

Sageheart wrote:are vanguard vets good for DoA, i always use DC for that task.

Yes, they are. As I said, I think they're essential, if only for Heroic Intervention.

The trouble with a deep-striking pure assault list is that it deep strikes...and then has to sit there a turn before it can assault. Vanguard Veterans can assault the turn they land, giving you the opportunity to tie up something nasty that could paste your vulnerable assault marines if it got the charge, or take out a killy shooting unit that could cause a lot of damage while you're waiting for your next turn. Blood Angels need to get the charge; they're no better than vanilla marines in taking one. Vanguard Veterans let you either kill or at least tarpit the stuff that can really hurt you as you're sitting there for a full turn waiting to get that charge.

Seaward wrote:

Sageheart wrote:are vanguard vets good for DoA, i always use DC for that task.

Yes, they are. As I said, I think they're essential, if only for Heroic Intervention.

The trouble with a deep-striking pure assault list is that it deep strikes...and then has to sit there a turn before it can assault. Vanguard Veterans can assault the turn they land, giving you the opportunity to tie up something nasty that could paste your vulnerable assault marines if it got the charge, or take out a killy shooting unit that could cause a lot of damage while you're waiting for your next turn. Blood Angels need to get the charge; they're no better than vanilla marines in taking one. Vanguard Veterans let you either kill or at least tarpit the stuff that can really hurt you as you're sitting there for a full turn waiting to get that charge.

I second the Vanguard Vets. In a full squad of 10, all armed up with combi-flamers/meltas (if you are vs a horde/mech depending). They can really put some hurt out and especially in the hands of BA be downright nasty! I have used them in some games to simply take out an HQ or heavy support option. Against Orks they are great at wiping out covered Lootas. Against Chaos, they do pretty decent against a DP (if eqiupped right). Generally they are the closest thing to my *Death Star* unit, them and well my Libby with whomever.

I was thinking of doing a small elite force of all jump troops for a Nightlords themed army. Same deal as your idea. I kinda think the nilla codex does a fine job representing Ravens though.

is this for a tourney or just normal play? if you're not worried about preapproval or opponent's permission... have you thought about using the raven guard special character korvydae (spelling is off) from the latest IA book? he allows assault squads as troops and can be combined with shrike as your two HQs for a distinctively RG feel.

Deuce11 wrote:I was thinking of doing a small elite force of all jump troops for a Nightlords themed army. Same deal as your idea. I kinda think the nilla codex does a fine job representing Ravens though.

It does, to a point.

I was liking the BA's ability to rapidly deploy assault troops, and do so very accurately.

I think it would work well to represent a RG force, and I'd leave out most (if not all) of the distinctly BA stuff in using the codex to also do this.

warboss wrote:is this for a tourney or just normal play? if you're not worried about preapproval or opponent's permission... have you thought about using the raven guard special character korvydae (spelling is off) from the latest IA book? he allows assault squads as troops and can be combined with shrike as your two HQs for a distinctively RG feel.

Not a bad idea, actually!

I'm not a huge tournament gamer, so it this could be one way to go, but I'd also want to try it out in a tournament setting too, as it will undoubtedly take me a while to assemble and paint as I am one of the World's Slowest Painters.

The first list that you threw up is actually a fairly strong list... it would be competitive on a tournement level. I would just change your HQ to a Chaplin, and add another. Then take some Priests and another assult squad. Deep Strike the entire army and win!

Raven Guard as Blood Angels. interesting idea.

An all-jump pack list with vanguard vets and assault troops probably way to go..

Just a pity you can't take Shrike