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Hi everyone,

I'm fighting a battle with my best friend. My Chaos Marines Squad is on the 2nd floor of a ruin near to the edge of the tabletop. His Genestealers entered from reserve. In the following turn he decided to

1st: enter the ruin (6" with three dice)

2nd: run towards and (4" with one dice)

3rd: assault my Chaos Marines Squad on the 2nd floor. (6" with three dice)

In the assault phase only the Broodlord managed to reach the Chaos Marines Squad. Four Genestealers remained exactly beneith the Chaos Marines Squad, five Genestealers were on the balcony, but if the balcony guys had been on the same floor, there would have been a wall between them and the Chaos Space Marines Squad as high as the half of a Chaos Space Marine.

My question:

Which part of the Genestealers Brood is eligible to assault?

Do we resolve close combat in initiative order?

Do I get a cover save being merely in the ruin or must there be another obstacle?

Do I get a cover save, when Genestealers from a lower floor attack me (rending)?

If the Broodlord had reached my Chaos Marines Sqaud during the Movement or Shooting phase, but there had been other Genestealers that had been forced to make a difficult terrain test, would have the whole Brood's initiative been lowered to 1?

If the Brood completely had managed to reach my Squad by the minimun of one 1" and would decide to assault, who would strike first and would I get a cover save?

The walls are irrelevant to determining which units are able to assault, measure 2" from the base of an engaged model as per normal assault

You go first actually, since the Genestealers lack grenades, and he had to make a DT test to get to you

You do get a cover save for being in area terrain - usable against shooting, not CC

See previous, no cover against CC attacks

If any model makes a DT test, then it strikes at I1 unless it has a special rule that provides it with a 'grenade' type effect
-Edit: The broodlord can get to 1" of your squad which by the rules means he 'always' will make it regardless of the test, but the unit still must test.

Sort of an irrelevant question given the answer to the previous few....

First of all, the diagram in the "ruins" rules shows very clearly who can and cannot assault.

Second, cover saves may only ever be taken from shooting attacks, and do not apply in close combat.

Third, the Stealers assaulted through cover without assault grenades, and therefore hit at I1.

Fourth, the Broodlord could NOT have reached you in the movement or shooting phases - you must always remain at least 1" away from enemy models until you launch an assault.

Did I cover everything?

Being in the ruins gives you a cover save, HOWEVER when you come to assault you will find you are expicitly denied the ability to take cover saves.

If you have not gone to ground the combat will not resolve in normal init order. The BL is a member of the unit, so if the unit makes a DT check the entire units Init is dropped. It doesnt matter if they get to 1" away or not, they MUST take a DT to assault you and MUST therefore strike at Init 1

As for who can fight in the close combat - the ruin rules cover this very clearly.

Oops, I missed the multiple floors part, thanks for the catch Saint.

Edit: and Nos

I'm not sure I totally understand the situation, but I'll do my best to answer.

wixxer wrote:Hi everyone,

I'm fighting a battle with my best friend. My Chaos Marines Squad is on the 2nd floor of a ruin near to the edge of the tabletop. His Genestealers entered from reserve. In the following turn he decided to

1st: enter the ruin (6" with three dice)

2nd: run towards and (4" with one dice)

3rd: assault my Chaos Marines Squad on the 2nd floor. (6" with three dice)

In the assault phase only the Broodlord managed to reach the Chaos Marines Squad. Four Genestealers remained exactly beneith the Chaos Marines Squad, five Genestealers were on the balcony, but if the balcony guys had been on the same floor, there would have been a wall between them and the Chaos Space Marines Squad as high as the half of a Chaos Space Marine.

My question:

Which part of the Genestealers Brood is eligible to assault?

Any model in base-to-base and any model within 2" of base-to-base. Don't forget the defenders react and have to pile in to put more genestealers in base-to-base!

wixxer wrote:
Do we resolve close combat in initiative order?

Yes! You always do! However, assaulting through difficult terrain means you strike at initiative 1 unless you have assault grenades.

wixxer wrote:
Do I get a cover save being merely in the ruin or must there be another obstacle?

You never get cover saves in assaults, only against shooting attacks.

wixxer wrote:
Do I get a cover save, when Genestealers from a lower floor attack me (rending)?

See above.

wixxer wrote:
If the Broodlord had reached my Chaos Marines Sqaud during the Movement or Shooting phase, but there had been other Genestealers that had been forced to make a difficult terrain test, would have the whole Brood's initiative been lowered to 1?

That can't happen. You can't make contact outside of the assault phase. You have to stay 1" away. So, even if he got to 1" away, he'd have to make the difficult terrain test (would always get enough for BtB) and strike at I 1.

wixxer wrote:
If the Brood completely had managed to reach my Squad by the minimun of one 1" and would decide to assault, who would strike first and would I get a cover save?

See above.

calypso2ts wrote:Oops, I missed the multiple floors part, thanks for the catch Saint.

*sigh*

This is the problem with long-winded questions. They require a long-winded response and 100 people are all busy typing before we see the others have already answered.

Next time I am going to answer them machine gun style with a single post for each unanswered question...

Thank you very much, calypso.

One more question, concerning the the balcony guys who were on the 1st floor, assuming they had been on the 2nd floor, and considering that there had been a bellybutton high wall between them, would the CSM have been able to claim a cover save?

Best regards.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Thank you guys, you are wonderful...

I really feel like being in love with all of you!!!

wixxer wrote:Thank you very much, calypso.

One more question, concerning the the balcony guys who were on the 1st floor, assuming they had been on the 2nd floor, and considering that there had been a bellybutton high wall between them, would the CSM have been able to claim a cover save?

Best regards.

No cover saves in CC. Ever! Under any conditions.

You can try cowering behind the wall all you want, but the genestealers can easily reach over the top and eat you.

Nope, because you can never take a cover save against a CC attack. As much as you really really want to against Genestealers, cover is for shooting attacks only - unless otherwise specified.

(thanks to St Hazard, Nos and Grakmar as well naturally)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
You win this round Grak...

wixxer wrote:One more question, concerning the the balcony guys who were on the 1st floor, assuming they had been on the 2nd floor, and considering that there had been a bellybutton high wall between them, would the CSM have been able to claim a cover save?

No cover saves in close combat, period. Regardless of what's in between you and them.

Edit: Crap! I'm slow today.