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My buddy came up with a list I can't deal with. No matter what I think of I can't wrap my head around what to do to beat this.

I play eldar, but what would YOU use to take this down.

The list is something like this

Straken w/ medic and some meltaguns
CCS w/ fist medic and meltas

4 x demo vets with 3 meltas and a fist

6 vendettas

Marbo

If he gets first turn its all over. Scout forward, drop everything off, and then order to deny cover saves till the cows come home. Shoot/throw at them and assault with strakens furious bubble.

Halp.

Go all in reserves

I hope he's not claiming that Straken's order can deny cover saves. The "fire on my target" order just forces you to reroll successful cover saves.

To elaborate on what BlueDagger says, when you get second turn, start everything in reserve. Hopefully you've got a mech army with 1 or 2 autarchs. That means most of your army will be coming in on turn 2, getting the first shot off and crippling/shaking the vendettas, then just mop up.

It's an alpha strike list. Granted it's vicious, but it still depends on alpha strike. Outflank war-walkers, throw stuff in reserves, infiltrate stuff into strange locations inconvenient to his charge. Eldar have some of the most fun alternate deployment options I've ever seen. Have some fun using them. Oooh! I got it. Screen your dudes with an infiltrating Striking Scorpions unit. He'll have to stay at least 12" away from them during scout. He then sacrificially has to grind himself against them because they're the only thing in assault range.

What about those annoying bouncing Aspect warriors, who come in, frag something then hop out?

(or did they fix them, I'm not an Eldar player)

Swooping Hawks. They still do that, but at 21 points a piece, and dependent on rolling for reserves each time, you need an Autarch and even then they might not be worth it.

daedalus wrote:Swooping Hawks. They still do that, but at 21 points a piece, and dependent on rolling for reserves each time, you need an Autarch and even then they might not be worth it.

Ahh ok, I wasn't completely aware of the details behind them. Thanks.

What I see is a whole lotta S8 weapons which is awesome against tanks and big guys but fairly useless against T3 models like most Eldar infantry.


I would think about using units that had a significant Inv save (if Eldar has any).

Dire Avengers, if you can keep them protected, seem like a good counter to his infantry once they're exposed.
The key will be to fry the Vendetta early. You could try to out skimmer him, doesn't that one upgrade drop his Lascannons to S8 and ignore the +2d6 for Melta? Again I'm not sure on the price tag but it seems fairly useful.

Ok this is a bit cheeky but include 2 10 man ranger (or whatever the cheap option with infiltrate is). Allow him first turn.

According to the rules for deployment (p.92 under infiltrators and scouts) you both place infiltrators before scout moves are taken. Infiltrate as close as you can to your opponent (18" in the open 12" out of sight) forming a corden (with up to a 24" gap in the middle I'd play safe and leave 20").

When he starts his scouts move refer him to the scouts rule (p.76 under scouts) where it states that during a scout move you may not move closer than 12" to any enemy model.

The Strange Dude wrote:Ok this is a bit cheeky but include 2 10 man ranger (or whatever the cheap option with infiltrate is). Allow him first turn.

According to the rules for deployment (p.92 under infiltrators and scouts) you both place infiltrators before scout moves are taken. Infiltrate as close as you can to your opponent (18" in the open 12" out of sight) forming a corden (with up to a 24" gap in the middle I'd play safe and leave 20").

When he starts his scouts move refer him to the scouts rule (p.76 under scouts) where it states that during a scout move you may not move closer than 12" to any enemy model.

Not cheesy at all--it's a totally valid strategy to use infiltrators to push back scout moves.

Actually going with a lot of rangers/pathfinders is a good idea in general. If his vendetta-mounted vets don't have flamers, rangers and pathfinders can shrug off the vast majority of their shooting. Saving versus lascannons or meltaguns on a 2+ will even nerf the "fire on my target" orders.

Pathfinders aren't a bad idea actually, but I didn't know that scout moves couldn't bring you within 12. That hurts the list a bit, thanks!

Also the last time i tried playing it was with grey knights...obviously that didn't end well. Neither did my buddies chaos land raider spam but with all the melta going around that shouldn't be a surprise either.

Going all infantry is an option, but seeing as I do have a mech army I'll try to make that work.

Eldar seem to have the best counter tothe melta vet list. You can throw a lot of stuf on your own birds to negate the light weaponry. Out maneuver his infantry. You are eldar. Take out his vendettas with cheap vehicle missles as they come in from reserve and then dire avenger his blobs of dudes. Or, ir you have jetbike council, they could do either of hese things by themselves

He has to squadren his birds, so a squad of fire dragons can melt 2 birds with 1 volly. 2 slagged vendettas is more points than a land raider.

The start everything in reserves crowd has your best strategy down. If you're currently taking Falcons for transport, switch them to WS. The anti-melta forcefield is a major help vs this list.

Could you post your current list? It'd help to give pointers on things to switch around.

I'm not an eldar player by any means, but as a Guard player with that list, i'd fear troops en masse. This list seems very good. straight forward, and powerful, but very tailored to anti vehicle, and while still packing a punch against troops, he doesn't have enough to table a horde army.

That being said, I know your eldar aren't horde, but maybe try playing them as such?

The infiltrators denying scout movement is a great first step, but then you need something to take out the valks at range to capitalize on the area denial. (considering he can only target up to 3 tanks a turn with 6 vendettas you'll need more than 3 units to handle this task to avoid being wiped first turn. Maybe a combo of tanks and wraithlords w/ brightlances and nothing else) This seems to me to be the more difficut part of your task. Your target priority should be on eliminating an entire squadron. don't pick them off piecemeal. If you take down 2 vendettas in the same squadron then he can only shoot at 2 targets instead of 3.

Your next target is the Vet squads. They may be shooty, but they still suck a cc compared to a dedicated cc squad. Your troops should have initiative so its up to you to get the assault. Striking scorpions and banshees should do the trick. if you have wave serpants then transport your banshees. (The transports may also confuse you're opponent when he's thinking about target priority. A waveserpant full of banshees is a lot scarrier than a wraithlord with a brightlance. If he shoots your transports, that gives you more of a chance at downing his vendettas).

If you try this strategy, then avoid useless upgrades. Don't get the extra bells and whistles that seem to make your individual unit better. instead save those few extra points to put more bodies on the board. (Don't get the holofield for your tanks, get more tanks) one shot may be able to stun a tank with all the bells and whistles. one shot will never stun two tanks.

an throw up your list. It may make it easier for people to give you advice. I hope this is helpful.

Firedragons would be a priority 1 target, so they would need a wave serpent to get them there, a falcon would be blown out of the sky turn 1.