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1. When the ethereal dies, all tau units (excluding auxiliaries) take a morale check. Does this include the units in vehicles?

2. An ethereal may take a FW honorguard. Later it states when a unit is "joined" by the ethereal they become fearless. Does this mean the retinue is not? Seems kinda of odd that the veterans would be so jaded with the company of the ethereal that they're no longer inspired as such... Just a bad case of RAW? Has anyone ever seen an official rulin on this, like at a tournament or something?

1. Yeah, all Tau units

2. The Ethereal is joined to his retinue as they are a unit. He is no longer and independent character (until they die).

bobert wrote:1. When the ethereal dies, all tau units (excluding auxiliaries) take a morale check. Does this include the units in vehicles?

2. An ethereal may take a FW honorguard. Later it states when a unit is "joined" by the ethereal they become fearless. Does this mean the retinue is not? Seems kinda of odd that the veterans would be so jaded with the company of the ethereal that they're no longer inspired as such... Just a bad case of RAW? Has anyone ever seen an official rulin on this, like at a tournament or something?

1) Yes. As to what happens if you fail, the game breaks.

2) Yes he is joined, but as an IC with a Retinue, so they are Fearless.

Follow up on part 1, do the Tau in the vehicles just immediately disembark and run if they fail the test or does the vehicle go with them? Same question for hammerheads. Do we assume the driver says eff this when te ethereal dies and does a 180, or can they stick around to support the kroot who are probably now trying to eat the dead ethereal...

Also... How would you check the morale on a vehicle? (this is why I'm assuming they can stay)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Clarification request on part 2.
So is an IC assumed to be "joining" his retinue?

bobert wrote:Follow up on part 1, do the Tau in the vehicles just immediately disembark and run if they fail the test or does the vehicle go with them?

There are no rules covering what happens if a unit in a transport fails a morale test. Some players assume that they don't go anywhere, some go with the immediate disembark.

Same question for hammerheads. Do we assume the driver says eff this when te ethereal dies and does a 180, or can they stick around to support the kroot who are probably now trying to eat the dead ethereal...

Also... How would you check the morale on a vehicle?

You don't. You can only check morale on units that have a Ld characteristic.

Clarification request on part 2.
So is an IC assumed to be "joining" his retinue?

ICs with a retinue are a part of the unit. They don't join them... they are simply a member of the unit from the start. That's what distinguishes retinues from units that an IC has joined.

insaniak wrote:ICs with a retinue are a part of the unit. They don't join them... they are simply a member of the unit from the start. That's what distinguishes retinues from units that an IC has joined.

Right, I undestrand this, but does that mean the FW honorguard retinue does not get the fearless trait the ethereal incurs when "joining" a unit. Like I was saying, sounds like a bad case of RAW, but the FWHG also has a higher ballistic skill so I can see the balance. It just seems like off logic thatthe vets aren't fearless. I guess the fearlessness must come from the newbie FWs being super jazzed an ethereal joined their unit. Mainly I was just wondering if anyone has had personal experience with this issue in something like a tournament or sanctioned setting for confirmation. I do appreciate the input though.

The honor guard for Tau Empire are no more a retinue than the Honor Guard or Command Squad for current Space marines.

RAW they are a separate unit; that are completely outside of the FOC, are never referred to in their rules as a retinue, and you are not told that they encompass the ethereal as part of the squad(in the manner of a retinue).


Just to add to this: Aun'va does have a retinue honor guard, even calls them a "retinue" in the rules telling you how to take them/what they do.

The book on retinue:
"Some Codex books allow you to field characters together with a special unit that they cannot leave during the game (which is normally called a 'retinue', 'bodyguard' or similar. Where this is the case, the character counts as an upgrade character until all of the other members of this unit are killed, at which point it starts counting as an independent character and it will do so for the rest of the game."

That being said, the "honorguard"(see above: which is normally called a retinue, bodyguard, or similar) does follow the definition of a retinue pretty clearly. I'm pretty sure they say they're taken as a 'normal fire warrior' to clarify the cost of each model(+2), unit size, layout options, etc.

Given the team as a retinue, it would seem the ethereal is counted as 'an upgrade character' and does not 'join' his honorguard FW team, therefore, the FW honorguard is not fearless.

Does that sound correct?

Kommissar Kel wrote:The honor guard for Tau Empire are no more a retinue than the Honor Guard or Command Squad for current Space marines.

The Tau FAQ states that they are a retinue.

The part of the Honour Guard entry that states that the Ethereal may be 'accompanied' by an Honour Guard is how retinues were written in the 4th ed codexes. The previous Marine codex had the same wording for Command Squads. It also states in the Ethereal's entry that he is an IC 'Unless accompanied by an Honour Guard'... and we know that it's having a retinue that removes IC status, as per the Retinue rules on page 48 of the rulebook.



So far as the Fearless issue goes, he's not joining them (as per the mechanic for joining units provided by the rules) and so does not confer Fearless to his Honour Guard. Which seems a bit daft, so I would probably play it as having the rule anyway, using 'joins' in the more casual sense (he is accompanying them, and so has joined them for the battle) rather than the strict RAW sense.

I'm not sure if it's a full balance on the virtual scale in my head, but the whole team of honorguard FWs have +1 Ballistic skill over an ordinary FW. Maybe they figure that balances out the not getting fearless. Also, when I really think about it. Maybe it's not such a good idea for that unit to 'not' run. I just realised if the ethereal runs of the table he doesn't die, therefore none of the Tau freak.

insaniak wrote:

Kommissar Kel wrote:The honor guard for Tau Empire are no more a retinue than the Honor Guard or Command Squad for current Space marines.

The Tau FAQ states that they are a retinue.

The part of the Honour Guard entry that states that the Ethereal may be 'accompanied' by an Honour Guard is how retinues were written in the 4th ed codexes. The previous Marine codex had the same wording for Command Squads. It also states in the Ethereal's entry that he is an IC 'Unless accompanied by an Honour Guard'... and we know that it's having a retinue that removes IC status, as per the Retinue rules on page 48 of the rulebook.



So far as the Fearless issue goes, he's not joining them (as per the mechanic for joining units provided by the rules) and so does not confer Fearless to his Honour Guard. Which seems a bit daft, so I would probably play it as having the rule anyway, using 'joins' in the more casual sense (he is accompanying them, and so has joined them for the battle) rather than the strict RAW sense.

heh; i missed that bit, I had only read the entry for honor guard in the ethereal listing, not the rest of his listing. I also totally failed at checking the FAQ.