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I was playing an opponent who was using the Callidus Assassin and we ran into a couple of situations that we weren't clear about. We had a 3rd party make a ruling and moved on but I thought I'd see what other people thought.

The Jump Back rule was a problem:
1a)When is the start of the assault phase? Is it before I declare my assaults? Before I move my units into assault? Or, is it before I start making my assault attacks?

1b)I had the assassin surrounded when she rolled a "2" for her jump back. No matter where she went she would have still been touching one of my figures. Should we have just left her in her starting point? Moved her and let everyone who was still in assault range attack her? Or, moved her so that she was no longer in melee (but farther than her die roll permitted)?

Depending on the answers given there may be follow up questions but I would appreciate opinions or rule citations.

Leo_the_Rat wrote:I was playing an opponent who was using the Callidus Assassin and we ran into a couple of situations that we weren't clear about. We had a 3rd party make a ruling and moved on but I thought I'd see what other people thought.

The Jump Back rule was a problem:
1a)When is the start of the assault phase? Is it before I declare my assaults? Before I move my units into assault? Or, is it before I start making my assault attacks?

1b)I had the assassin surrounded when she rolled a "2" for her jump back. No matter where she went she would have still been touching one of my figures. Should we have just left her in her starting point? Moved her and let everyone who was still in assault range attack her? Or, moved her so that she was no longer in melee (but farther than her die roll permitted)?

Depending on the answers given there may be follow up questions but I would appreciate opinions or rule citations.

1a) When the Assault Phase Starts, before anything else has been done, before moves have been made. Yes, this means she can Jump Pack, then assault the unit she just Jumped away from.

1b) The rules break because the rules don't tell you what to do.

As per your answer to 1a). Does this mean that if she does this in my turn that after she jumps back I can then assault her with the same troops she left as well as anyone else in range?

Leo_the_Rat wrote:As per your answer to 1a). Does this mean that if she does this in my turn that after she jumps back I can then assault her with the same troops she left as well as anyone else in range?

Yes.

Which is why you Jump Pack in your turn.

And if you jump back in their turn, you can just get assaulted again. Maybe useful if you can make them go through terrain without grenades? Otherwise I'd not let them get the charge bonuses.

ElCheezus wrote:And if you jump back in their turn, you can just get assaulted again. Maybe useful if you can make them go through terrain without grenades? Otherwise I'd not let them get the charge bonuses.

Also useful to get away from the Dread they just moved up, or the assault unit, etc, use the jump back so that only the initial unit can assault back in.

so, I am still unclear.

1. does jump back happen after the assault move happens? Thats how I always played it back in the day

2. is the callidus out of combat, even if it is in base contact? once again, it read that anything over a one gets you out of combat. I am not aware of any erata or anything updating the jump back combat move. I assume for fluffs sake, if the model doesn't jump clear then she is more just dodging and bobbing and weaving so fast it confuses the enemies or some such.

3. I'm also pretty sure the assaulting model does get a consolidate move as though they won combat. Yes/no?

1. No, at the start - as the first answer stated. Befpore you do *anything* else.
2. The callidus is not out of combat if you are in base contact - best thing is just to not move. It can be sueful to base that IC you've been hiding however....
3. They didnt win combat, so no. Consolidate happens after you win combat - no combat occured. Unless the FAQ decides to change this of course...

Actually by RAW under the assassin herself if the unit is no longer in combat then they can only consolidate. I think this was to stop people from making a sweeping advance after the combat(s) were done.

OK, let's clear this up.

1. The Callidus Jump Back occurs at the start of the assault phase, before the player whose turn it is makes any assault moves. Heck, it happens before he even declares any assault moves!

2. Rules break down if the Jump Back is not enough to get her away from the unit she's in combat with, as it doesn't tell us how to handle it. The rule is clearly meant to get her out of combat but the move isn't enough to do it. Gonna have to work out your own house rule for that one.

3. Per the Callidus rules, the unit she jumps away from may consolidate. BUT!! the FAQ has changed that, allowing them to make an assault move if her Jump Back leaves them unengaged.

Q. If a Callidus disengages from close combat at
the start of her Assault phase, can she then
declare a charge against an enemy unit?
A. Yes. Conversely, if it is her opponent’s Assault
phase and the enemy unit she was fighting is left
unengaged it is then free to declare a charge.

Which FAQ is that from? I looked in both the Daemonhunters and witchhunters and couldn't find your quote.

Leo_the_Rat wrote:Which FAQ is that from? I looked in both the Daemonhunters and witchhunters and couldn't find your quote.

The one on the GW website.

Just for clarity it's only in the daemonhunter FAQ and not the witchhunter FAQ for some odd reason.