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Should they be Slugga or Shoota, I know the main goal is to get in and kill.

But sometimes, you need to pop a few shots.

What's better overall?

I'd say shootas for the wagon, sluggas for the trukk.

If you're in a trukk, it's pretty much a given that your role is to zoom forward until you get stuck in CC or die trying, so you'll want the extra CC attacks. If you survive the wreck of your trukk and haven't hit enemy lines, you should be running, not shooting, so the potential benefit of a shoota is lost, anyway. No contest, here.

The wagon is a bit more debatable, but I would take shootas, here. While the weight of 20-ish boys with an extra CC attack is significant, you aren't always going to have the ideal situation wherein all your troops reach enemy lines at the same time. Vehicles get wrecked, movement gets blocked, etc. The open-topped nature of wagons and the likelihood of having to slog it part way to the enemy mean that there are times you may want to shoot (some enemies need softening up, others couldn't be reached in assault but still need to take some casualties). 20 bodies is still a lot of bodies, so a round of shooting followed by an assault, even with one attack fewer than slugga boys, is still going to put out some hurt. The added flexibility of a shoota is a definite boon, and I think the tradeoff with CC effectiveness is sufficiently countered by A) pre-assault shooting and B) body count.

I've never understood why people suggest shoota boys for wagons, if you sit there and shoot your wagon will be blowing up next turn, leaving your guys standing in the middle of the board getting mowed down.

if they are in vehicles they are slugga and you are trying to get these fragile (small) units stuck in combat were nobody can shoot them.

If we were talking about foot slogging it would be a bit different but slugga always in vehicles.

yournamehere wrote:I've never understood why people suggest shoota boys for wagons, if you sit there and shoot your wagon will be blowing up next turn, leaving your guys standing in the middle of the board getting mowed down.

So parking mid-board to shoot is the only way to lose a wagon? What happens when your boys get stranded anyway? What happens if you're parked (literally or metaphorically, depending on the wagon's survival) on an objective?

if they are in vehicles they are slugga and you are trying to get these fragile (small) units stuck in combat were nobody can shoot them.

Since when are 20 models considered a small unit? It honestly sounds like you're taking the arguments against shootas in trukks (in which case, I'd agree with you) and slapping them onto battlewagons. Wagons are tougher, yes, but they still get popped. Boys like to assault, yes, but there are times where shooting is the better option, if not at least equally effective. Shootas are assault weapons, too, meaning that burna-wagon-esque driveby attacks (approach, blast away, unload, and assault) are also possible, should the wagon survive, instead of the old "dump and charge."

If you look at any of the shoota vs. slugga threads for footsloggers, you see the same argument of flexibility vs. CC focus. If an all slugga rush list if fine if that's your thing, but saying shootas should never go in wagons just doesn't hold water.

Sluggas for trukks (better bring a ton of trukks though) shootas for wagons. Unless you're taking nob wagons in which klaws and sluggas are the way to go with a few big choppas and kombis for musical chairs

Long time ork player here. Sluggas in trucks and wagons, shootas on foot.

Rush all of the vehicles 13 a turn until you get there or get popped. If you get popped, you move 6 and run until you are stuck in. Standing orks are dead orks in a mechanized list.

Inigo Montoya wrote:Long time ork player here. Sluggas in trucks and wagons, shootas on foot.

Rush all of the vehicles 13 a turn until you get there or get popped. If you get popped, you move 6 and run until you are stuck in. Standing orks are dead orks in a mechanized list.

Yup, thats how I do it too.

Yeah but the shootas give you the option of not getting out and still being able to do some damage.

sickening wrote:Yeah but the shootas give you the option of not getting out and still being able to do some damage.

But why? Honestly, if you aren't rushing them to get stuck in, then honestly you are doing it wrong. Why would you waste the points on a battlewagon and use it to shoot bs2 guns from?

sickening wrote:Yeah but the shootas give you the option of not getting out and still being able to do some damage.

Because why would you leave a boyz mob in a trukk? Its GOING to get shot up doing that. Then you get to try and roll 6s to save them. And I personally wouldnt waste a BW with just shoota boyz. I did once in a fun match, it was cool and all, but still a wasted BW.


Sluggas are mounted, and shootas on foot. Trust me.


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Inigo Montoya wrote:

sickening wrote:Yeah but the shootas give you the option of not getting out and still being able to do some damage.

But why? Honestly, if you aren't rushing them to get stuck in, then honestly you are doing it wrong. Why would you waste the points on a battlewagon and use it to shoot bs2 guns from?

Lootas, thats why.

mmmhmmm lootas arent shootas or sluggas, and I rarely put them in a wagon. They do well with a grot wrap on their own.


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mmmhmmm lootas arent shootas or sluggas, and I rarely put them in a wagon. They do well with a grot wrap on their own.

It really depends...Id never put shootas in a trukk but I put them in wagons all the time...seeing has I pay for 3 wagons in pretty much every list i run I usually have 1 open...nobs and boss in 1, burnas and KFF in 2, 19 shootas and a PK nob in 3...I put shootas in wagons for a few reasons.

1. The wagon may go boom far away from where Im trying to get...gives me a chance to do some damage before I get to em.

2. 19 shootas firing out of an open topped wagon does have serious potential to do damage even at bs 2...w/ an RPJ you move 7in and fire...melee guys (i play against mostly tyranids) still need a 6 to hit you...

3. All them boyz in a shoota wagon can score from inside said wagon giving me a tough scoring wagon if it survives that long.

4. Against certain targets (like squishy infantry) all them shootas will probably do more damage than my deff rolla...even if that rolla hits nothing, it forced my opponent to react to it.

The way Ive always seen it boyz get the same number of attacks overall, sluggas get 1 extra melee attack and shootas get longer range and 1 more shooting attack...large mobs go shootas, smaller mobs need the extra melee potential to remain in melee and not get swept...

My take on it anyway!


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One more thing...Id rather have all them shootas in the wagon than nothing!

So you are saying that your opponents pop a wagon full of 20 shootas with a wagon full of 15 burna boys and a wagon full of nobs on the table? Really, is that what you are saying?

My advice is based on competent opponents and time tested tactics. A serious general will focus on the serious threats and the boys will make it across the board.

Inigo Montoya wrote:mmmhmmm lootas arent shootas or sluggas, and I rarely put them in a wagon. They do well with a grot wrap on their own.


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mmmhmmm lootas arent shootas or sluggas, and I rarely put them in a wagon. They do well with a grot wrap on their own.

Indeed they arnt shootas, but he was talking about firing a BS2 weapon from them. Thats why I put the lootas comment on there. I like lootas more in cover personally, but I have seen them do rather nicely in a BW before. Its pretty easy for us Orks to get a spare BW from someone

Inigo Montoya wrote:So you are saying that your opponents pop a wagon full of 20 shootas with a wagon full of 15 burna boys and a wagon full of nobs on the table? Really, is that what you are saying?

Thats not at all what I said...in fact I dont remember saying or even inferring that anywhere in the post...Id honestly rather my boyz not get out of the wagon if i can help it (as i said my regular opponent is quite competent w his stealer heavy tyranids) and its always helpful to have a potentially scoring BW (w the boyz and my nobs I have 2)...I take 3 wagons anyway and dont want one empty...

I find being able to shoot a kannon (frag) Big shoota and 19 other shootas (at another target if i want) along with being able to move at the same time is serious firepower so even if he takes the one or two of the other out not only am i jumping down his throat Im blasting the crap out of him at the same time...

I have found this very effective in my games...perhaps you have different experience...

Ive found being able to shoot and thin them out a bit before assault is effective cause lets face it, chances are our opponents are hitting first and are probably getting their armor saves either way...

Inigo Montoya wrote:My advice is based on competent opponents and time tested tactics. A serious general will focus on the serious threats and the boys will make it across the board.

Please forgive this simple noobs observations...I was uanaware having a different opinion was such a bad thing!

oadie wrote:

yournamehere wrote:I've never understood why people suggest shoota boys for wagons, if you sit there and shoot your wagon will be blowing up next turn, leaving your guys standing in the middle of the board getting mowed down.

So parking mid-board to shoot is the only way to lose a wagon? What happens when your boys get stranded anyway? What happens if you're parked (literally or metaphorically, depending on the wagon's survival) on an objective?

if they are in vehicles they are slugga and you are trying to get these fragile (small) units stuck in combat were nobody can shoot them.

Since when are 20 models considered a small unit? It honestly sounds like you're taking the arguments against shootas in trukks (in which case, I'd agree with you) and slapping them onto battlewagons. Wagons are tougher, yes, but they still get popped. Boys like to assault, yes, but there are times where shooting is the better option, if not at least equally effective. Shootas are assault weapons, too, meaning that burna-wagon-esque driveby attacks (approach, blast away, unload, and assault) are also possible, should the wagon survive, instead of the old "dump and charge."

If you look at any of the shoota vs. slugga threads for footsloggers, you see the same argument of flexibility vs. CC focus. If an all slugga rush list if fine if that's your thing, but saying shootas should never go in wagons just doesn't hold water.

No, stopping in the middle of the board and shooting is not the only way to lose a wagon, but why exactly are you letting a transport carrying a bunch of boyz, with a deff rolla (you are taking deff rollas right?) sit in the middle of the board giving it plenty of los to shoot from and at. I don't know about you but I don't have enough faith in ork vehicles to just have them sit there they need to be doing the job you took them for in the first place, moving boyz and other units forwards, fast.

Yes actually 20 boys in a wagon is a fairly fragile unit, after taking wounds from the wagon exploding and then being caught in the open they will die quick to fire. (note this is not an argument against boyz, I'm just saying they are vulnerable after being expelled from there wagon.) And by small I'm also referring to trukk mobs there.

As for the rest of your points I do not argue the usefulness of a mob of shoota boyz, I use them all the time, just not in vehicles.

The main MAIN reason I am all about choppas in vehicles is that when you have a squad of 10 -15 boyz going into assault you need EVERY wound you can get a combat resolution and that extra attack in there profile is paramount, this is not such a problem when you have 20+ shoota boyz comming in. Plus if you cause to many wounds when shooting your opponent will simply remove the models needed to negate my charge radius, or if they are space marines the will ATSKNF to regroup after falling back.

I personally like my lootas to play in or around a killcannon BW, just because hanging back and lobbing those blasts in is a great way to kill stuff, supported by loota fire you can get some actual killyness going on. Especially nice against infantry hordes, and a good distraction for your opponent to deal with while you're trying to bring in trukkloads of boyz. Bs2 doesn't matter quite so much with blasty weapons. if it drifts, it drifts, but if it hits.... hoo boy.

I like blast templates for Orks anyways. You actually have a better chance of hitting targets then shooting normally with Orks. Why? Because there are 2 hits on any scatter die, and depending on the scatter distance, youve a better chance of tagging units. Ill have to put lootas on top f my things to buy list, as that sounds like a really decent tactic. Shoot with template, mop up with lootas.