Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

i was versing someone, and was about to fire my Leman Russ Battlecannon at some units inside a building, my opponent said "no, you cant, he doesnt know theyre there" and he quit the game when i said they could, so, can i shoot them?

Sir Stroud wrote:i was versing someone,

You were reciting poetry at them?

and was about to fire my Leman Russ Battlecannon at some units inside a building, my opponent said "no, you cant, he doesnt know theyre there" and he quit the game when i said they could, so, can i shoot them?

Was it an intact Building, or Ruins?

If the first, then no, you can't shoot at them. See the Building rules on page 78 of the rulebook. Essentially, Buildings act as immobile Transport vehicles.
If the latter, then you can shoot at them if you can see them. Ruins count as Area Terrain. See the Ruins rules on page 82 for details.

There's 2 factors here:
First: Were they in a Building, ie something you both agreed on before the game to be an intact building, not a ruin? If so, you could not have shot at them, but you could have shot at the building.
Second: Could you, from the position of the leman russ, see a member of the squad you were aiming at? If you could, and the thing was a ruin, not a building, then you could have shot them

They where intact . But if they shot out of it, how am i meant to kill the t'au bastards?

You destroy the building, which forces them to disembark. Again, see the Building rules for details.

thanks,

insaniak wrote:You destroy the building, which forces them to disembark. Again, see the Building rules for details.

Or you can fire a template weapon at a fire point, which hits the building and the troops ocupying it.

More importantly, there is no such rule as "they don't know that unit is there."

The night-fighting rules replicate that situation to a small extent, but to the larger extent, all units possess the god-like awareness of the tabletop that their owning player does.

Also remember if you fire a template into a building you score d6 hits so if there is only 1 model in the building he can be hit 6 times. Right?

yep

Yes because the unit suffers D6 hits.

But if a model is in a window, or on the roof of the building, you can shoot that right? Would they just get a cover save from the building?

I ask cause Im only putting my first army together and intend to have mainly ruins on my table but may throw in a building or two.

How is a ruin different to a building with true line of sight though? If someone is behind a wall then you can't see them and can't shoot them and a wall can be part of a building or part of a ruin.

ColdSadHungry wrote: But if a model is in a window, or on the roof of the building, you can shoot that right? Would they just get a cover save from the building?

No, you can't target a unit in a building. Only the building itself can be targetted the one exception being template weapons.

ColdSadHungry wrote:I ask cause Im only putting my first army together and intend to have mainly ruins on my table but may throw in a building or two.

Ruins and buildings are distinctly different.

ColdSadHungry wrote:How is a ruin different to a building with true line of sight though? If someone is behind a wall then you can't see them and can't shoot them and a wall can be part of a building or part of a ruin.

You need to read the section of the rules starting on page 77. This deals with all the rules for ruins and builidngs.
A unit behind a wall is neither in a building or a ruin unless the wall is part of the ruin.
Bottom line, the rules give all the details for gameplay within ruins and buildings, and all terrain features including these need to be discussed and agreed upon between you and your opponent before the game starts.

ColdSadHungry wrote:How is a ruin different to a building with true line of sight though?

An intact building is basically an immobile transport vehicle with access points and fire points.

The rules of buildings are defined on p.77 onwards.

There are two types of buildings, impassable and not impassable.

Models cannot go inside impassable buildings. Some models can climb on top but it counts as dangerous terrain.

Non-impassable buildings count as transport vehicles with no movement capability, however models are allowed to go on top if there is a suitable parapet. When doing this, the models may not be shot at directly even if in plain sight, because it is still inside a vehicle, and the building is counted as open topped for the vehicle damage table.

Ruins simply count as area terrain, and all models at least partially inside them get a 4+ cover save regardless of LoS (p.22). However only models with TLoS to models in the ruin can fire.