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Hey all. I'm fairly new to w40k. I got a bunch of Orks and a few Marines on my trip to the UK and I really love 40k. This is my first attempt at making a viable general purpose list. It's probably full of holes and extraordinarily easy to beat, but that's why I want constructive criticism.

HQ:
Grand Warlord Traskugg (Ghazghkull): 225pts
Mad Dok Zaggastomp (Grotsnik): 160pts

Troops:
30 slugga boyz: 180pts
20 gretchin: 80pts
5 meganobz w/Cybork: 250pts

Elites:
15 lootas: 225pts
10 tankbustas w/ 3 bomb-squigs led by nob w/pk: 175pts

‘Eavy support:
Battlewagon w/Killkannon, deff-rolla, ‘ard case, grot riggers, and lobba: 205pts
Total: 1500
(I love it when I make a list and then calculate the points and it turns out to be the exact number of points I was going for.)

The idea is to load up Traskugg and the MANz in the battlewagon and floor it to the hardest target (I'm mainly thinking MCs or psykers or some such thing), jump out and destroy it, split Traskugg from the Manz and send him off to kill on his own. The lootas would run to an objective with the grots as a screen to shield them from oncoming fire and then they'd camp on an objective.
Mad Dok Zaggastomp would be attached to the unit of slugga boyz to give them FNP and have them run to the enemy. Basic stuff and probably really easy to see through and counter. But then, that's why I'm a newbie.
Also, the main armies I'll be playing against with this list are Nids, Eldar, and Marines. Primarily Nids. Comments on how it would perform against the various armies would be cool.

First off, welcome to Dakka! This is a great place to get to know fellow hobbyists and to learn more about the game.

Your list is a little fragmented, but thankfully most of these errors are easy to correct if you're open to changes.

Ghazghkull is an amazing HQ, no doubt about it, however, he is way too many points for a 1500pt list. I would definitely run a Warboss with PK, Attack Squig, and Cybork body instead.

I love the Mad Doc, and he can be useful if used carefully and correctly. I think this list would benefit more from a KFF Mek though. If you want to run the Mad Dok effectively, consider this list: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/309083.page

You are VERY low on troops. I never leave home without at least 40-60 boyz depending on point level. Also, all your boy mobz should have a Nob with PK and Bosspole.

Gretchin are good, but only take 19 of them. That will save you 13 points.

Meganobz are great models, but not terribly good. They will always be outperformed by diversified Nobz. Mad Doc makes them decent, so I guess it's your call on them. Never run them without Grotsnik though.

Lootas great! Tankbustas bad :(. Get more Lootas instead of Tankbustas.

You need more Battlewagons. To find the points, drop the Killkannon. If you're using the Wagon as a transport, you won't be firing it enough to justify paying for it. The Lobba should go too.

I run them as:
Battlewagon 135pts
+ Deff Rolla
+ Armor Plates
+ Boarding Plank
+ Red Paint Job
+ Big Shoota


Any questions?

Are there any pieces of this army that you absolutely MUST keep? I mean - as far as suggestions go, are there any things you do not want to drop?

Thanks guys! I'm more than open to changes. Yeah, Ghazghkull is a monster for sure, but you may be right. He's pretty damned expensive to field.
I absolutely must keep the lootas. Not only are my Orks Death Skulls, I've had a lot of success with lootas so far. It'd be a very rare circumstance that would see me field less than 10 lootas. They may not be suitable for every situation, but they're so good.

Okay, I'll probably drop Traskugg in favour of a warboss. The combination of PK and AS is awesome. Also, my Nid-enthusiast friend really likes the whole "zerg-rush" idea and will probably field a lot of hormagaunts. Are boyz a good match for hormagaunts in cc? I've read the Nid codex extensively, but I'm not sure how it works in practice. I assume it depends on who assaults.

How would I deal with a carnifex, though? I was thinking the MANz would be perfect for slicing up the carni, but then again their wagon might be destroyed before it could reach them.
So you think a squad or two of nobz with diverse wargear would be the best?

Lootas are a great choice for any Ork list. Keep them for sure!

In my experience, Boyz struggle against Hormies. They go first and have almost as many attacks and with Toxin Sacs, wound on a 4+. Of course, I run exclusively 12 man mobz, so take that into consideration.

Deffkoptas are great for taking out Carnifexes! If you give them TL Rokkits and a Buzzsaw, they can put a wound on it and then charge it, striking at the same time.

Diversified Nobz are almost always a better choice than MANZ.

What's your opinion on nob bikers? I don't actually have any NB models, but I was just wondering if you feel strongly one way or the other. I've heard they're somewhat overpowered thanks to the wound allocation rules.

The only thing I see hormies struggling with is either str or points cost. It's one of the two, because if you give them adrenal glands and toxin sacs they cost 8pts per hormie if I remember correctly. I should aim to take them down with massed loota fire.
Looted wagons seem to me to be a good choice. They're pretty cheap and have a nice weapon in the boomgun. Their only problem as I see it is their crappy armour.

So with the nobz, how many pks do you think I should have? I was thinking along the lines of three of them. I obviously want pks because Tyranid mcs don't generally have invulnerable saves (the Swarmlord is terrifying though)

At first I thought burnas would be great against Nids, but when I looked closely at it I realized you're essentially paying 9 more points to give a boy a better weapon. He's still really squishy.
Here's a revised list. Again, more comments would be awesome so I can refine it further.

HQ: Warboss Smurfkrump w/PK, attack squig, and cybork body: 110pts

Troops:
20 slugga boyz led by a nob w/pk and bp: 160pts
20 slugga boyz led by a nob w/pk and bp: 160pts
19 slugga boyz led by a nob w/pk and bp: 160pts

Elites:
15 lootas: 225pts
10 nobz w/ 2 pk, 4 bc, WAAAAAGH! banner: 295pts

Fast Attack:
3 deffkoptas w/tlrl: 135pts

Heavy Support:
x2 Battlewagon w/deffrolla, armour plates, boarding plank, red paint job, big shoota: 270pts
Total: 1499

I decided to cut out the grots altogether because the boyz should be able to give the lootas more than enough cover for a turn or two. Also, a WAAAAAGH! banner is worth it, right? I figure an extra WS to each nob can't really go wrong for a measly 15pts extra. I was going to give 2 nobz kombi-skorchas, but I decided not to. Maybe I should though. Comments?

Im liking this last list the most...

HQ: Warboss Smurfkrump w/PK, attack squig, and cybork body: 110pts
He's good - I like the S10 attacks

Troops:
20 slugga boyz led by a nob w/pk and bp: 160pts
I drop this unit for a unit of Grots - 19 and a herder and Id reserve them to have have them come on late game and contest a home field OBJ.

20 slugga boyz led by a nob w/pk and bp: 160pts
19 slugga boyz led by a nob w/pk and bp: 160pts
These 2 units are good.

Elites:
15 lootas: 225pts
Split these into 3 units of 5...

10 nobz w/ 2 pk, 4 bc, WAAAAAGH! banner: 295pts
Id drop a few of these to include a pain boy and cybork bodies. Oh - these can count as troops because youre including a Warboss.

Fast Attack:
3 deffkoptas w/tlrl: 135pts
Drop one and add buzz saws onto the other 2.

Heavy Support:
x2 Battlewagon w/deffrolla, armour plates, boarding plank, red paint job, big shoota: 270pts

By dropping the 20 Boy Mob - you can field another BW and have all them ride.
Total: 1499

I drop this unit for a unit of Grots - 19 and a herder and Id reserve them to have have them come on late game and contest a home field OBJ.

I forgot grots were scoring units.

By dropping the 20 Boy Mob - you can field another BW and have all them ride.

Do you think this would be better than a trukk? Without armaments all I'm really paying for is the deff rolla privileges and extra armour.

Just so you know, I'm also using this list as a starting point for what to buy. I have all the lootas, nobz, warboss, deffkoptas, and boyz, but all I have are badly-proxied battlewagons. So with my Christmas cash (and my other disposable income) I'm probably gonna pick up a few battlewagons on my next trip to Moncton, along with two packs of lootas/burnas and two packs of boyz (so I can effectively get 5 lootas, a mek, and 5 burnas out of each pack) I might also get the battle or megaforce for the trukk, the boyz, and the bikers.
I have some time. The Eldar and Nid players don't even have their armies yet.

You need transports for your units. get a Battlewagon for the Nobz and the other units of Boyz, split the Lootas down into two units of 5 then throw on buzzsaws on the Kopters. Include a Big Mek with KFF to give 4+ cover save to the tanks

Sounds good. I'm in class now, so I'll throw together the list when I'm done my work.
So you're saying the BM should be in the tank? If that's the case, is it then 6" from the vehicle he's in? Because that would be useful.

So no trukks then? I guess I could have the nobz and boyz jump out and krump heads while the wagons run over as many enemies as they can.

Yes 6" radius from the battlewagon for the Big Meks KFF, which increases the range

NO Trukks. Trukks are garbage. Only do Trukks if taking loads of them and they're still pants.

mercer wrote:You need transports for your units. get a Battlewagon for the Nobz and the other units of Boyz, split the Lootas down into two units of 5 then throw on buzzsaws on the Kopters. Include a Big Mek with KFF to give 4+ cover save to the tanks

THIS THIS THIS THIS.

Here it is.

HQ: Warboss Smurfkrump w/pk, attack squig, and cybork body: 120pts
Big Mek Blastakill w/kff: 85pts

Troops:
15 slugga boyz led by nob w/pk and bosspole: 130pts
15 slugga boyz led by non w/pk and bosspole: 130pts
19 gretchin: 67pts
6 nobz w/ 2 pks, 4 big choppas, painboy, and all cybork bodies: 250pts

Elites:
5 lootas: 75pts
5 lootas: 75pts
5 lootas: 75pts

Fast Attack:
2 deffkoptas w/tlrl and buzzsaws: 140pts
(are bigbomms useful against Nids?)

'Eavy Support:
1 battlewagon w/ deffrolla, armour plates, boarding plank, red paint job, big shoota:135pts
2 battlewagons w/armour plates, red paint job, big shoota: 215pts
I suppose the rationale behind including only one big shoota is because it counts as the primary weapon if it's over str4, correct? I'm still not entirely sure of all the vehicle shooting rules.
Total: 1497pts

Are the buzzsaws on the koptas completely undroppable in your opinion? I decided to cut them from this list at first because they... Oh crap. I realized just as I was typing this that they're necessary. Koptas have hit and run! Wahoo! Perfect. So I can shoot, move in to slice them up, rinse, and repeat. revising it.
I did decide that I didn't want the boarding planks. They're useful, but not massively so. If I'm wrong, please let me know. I guess a power-klawed attack against a vehicle next to me is great, but I need to cut something out to let the buzzsaws back in.

Edit: After some thought, I decided to get rid of the deffrollas and boarding planks on two of those battlewagons and put the nobz in the kitted-out one. Is that a bad decision?

I guess im the only one here that thinks ghazzy is never to expensive in any list 1,000pts or up. Yes he is 225 pts but orks are cheap all around. I mean you get 30 boyz for 180pts so you have points to spare. Plus if your opponent is shooting at ghazzy that means he is not shooting at everything else.

I agree a Mek with a KFF is almost mandatory.

Actually in every list I have done so far it’s been built around ghazzy and mek with a kff and then fill it out with the rest.

But back to big daddy ghazzy Not only does he have the 4 wounds, 7 attacks on the charge, EW, but he has the prophet of the waggh which guarantees your 6in run movement….just let that sink in…..k good you got it now? That adds a whole other degree of flexibility to your army. You now know that when you charge(as long as its not through cover) you have 12in to work with not 7-12 but always 12.

Also ghazzy can handle his own with most anything. A normal warboss would never think of charging a dread or defiler or anything with str 10 cause one failed save means bye bye warboss. Ghazzy on the other hand…Dread? Yup can do. I pen on 3’s ironclad k well now 4’s. Defiler? Back to the warp for you. Oh you are a fancy dread with a force weapon…..well….oh wait are you a greyknight Grandmaster dread? No? Ohhh vampire dread then…come here let me trim those fangs you sparkly douche. Gahzzy will always make up his points no matter what. He always has for me.

BTW trucks even in small numbers 1-2 will cause a problem. Even though they are av10 and opened topped cause if you shoot it, it could fly directly at you… and if its getting shot at that means other things aren’t getting shot at. Target saturation is the name of the game to many things to shoot at. I like to put my nobs in a truck that will make your opponent think… 18 boyz and ghazzy in a BW or 10 nobs with painboy in truck…or mek battlewagon….Or more nobs in a truck. And they all have a 4+cover save!!!!! What to do?... Eat ork choppa is what they are going to do…

Orks Orks Orks Orks Orks Ork

And always take deffrollas. ALWAYS!

Huh. I'm well aware of how incredible Ghazghkull is. But the fact is he seems much better in footslogging armies where his Prophet of the WAAAAAAGH! ability can really come in handy. In my armies I tend to play my Orks rather shooty so the boyz are only for objectives and hard target (mc) killing. I wouldn't generally consider less than 15 lootas, and they're not particularly mobile. Nor do I wish them to be.

Looking better. I'd take warbuggies over the deffkoptas, but they are both fine. If you use Deffkoptas, take buzzsaws instead of bigbomms. Other than that, this is about as good as I think you can do at 1000 points.

drop the big choopas on the nobz and get a war banner and a bp that will still give you wound allocation and the +1 to ws the pk's will take care of the rest

big bombs are fluffy fun nothing else

on the bw I would drop all but the deffrollas and the bs. the points can be used else where. with the points get some more boys.

hope that helps

you have to realise that hit and run never works with orks, you need to pass a initative test :(

I don't think I'm willing to drop the koptas. I've had extreme success with them so far and they make great scout units. Yeah, I thought as much with the bigbomms.
Also, it's not impossible to hit and run. In my games against SM, I was able to do it about 4 out of ten times. Not too bad. Against Eldar I have no chance obviously.

I love twin-linked rokkits.

Keep the buzzsaws and I think you're getting confused on hit and run as you take a initiative test against your own initiative, doesn't matter if Eldar of Space Marines if you roll under your initiative you fly off

Oh. One of my Nid-loving friends decided he really wants to play Necrons instead. I assume all I need is lots of power klaws and rokkits.

Aye, against Necrons you need stuff like that. Though they're pretty slow and don't have loads of models so you should swap them.

I'll just try to phase them out. That should do it.

You need to target prioritise, but go for the Warriors as they make up the bulk of the Necron rule - Destroyers can be nasty too so make sure you get those as well. After that everything else as and when as it's mostly a shooting army with different strength guns, that's it.