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Is there anyone out there that puts a power fist or power weapon on space marine scout sergeants? Is it even worth doing or should I just put a bolter in his hands and tell him to go go go?

For shooty snipers, no. For CCW + bp scouts then sure, give the sgt a powerfist and a shotgun.

Power fist and shotgun, I didn't even think of that.

or powerfist with either a combi-melta or combi-flamer. Especially in a vulkan list. Actually, 5 CC or shotgun scouts with a powerfist, combi-melta or flamer on a land speeder storm is hilariously fun in a Vulkan list

A powerfist is a powerfist. If you are assautling, it is going to be useful. Just make sure it is a close combat squad.

It almost seems like scouts are only used as either CC or sniper rifles. What kind of scout squads does everyone use? Any one use all bolters. Does anyone use the heavy bolter?

When I used to use sniper scouts (before I became skilled at list building) I used the heavy bolter. I find it is more effective against things you would be targeting with the snipers than the ML, and the blast is stronger. I don't ever target vehicles with scouts, so it seems pointless to me to put the ML in there.

I've seen boltgun scouts used a couple times, and they never seem to be effective.

MrBakelsworth wrote:It almost seems like scouts are only used as either CC or sniper rifles. What kind of scout squads does everyone use? Any one use all bolters. Does anyone use the heavy bolter?

I've seen Sniper Scouts with a Heavy Bolter and a Telion, so that almost always the bolter shots will hit. I would like to attack a missile launcher rather than a heavy bolter, though, with that configuration.

And for me, the main purpose of scouts is to either sit on a target or be sacrificial units to tie up an enemy. Snipers do better than bolter scouts when camping on an objective, while bolter scouts will do na-da in assault. Why would you need bolter fire when you have tac squads that can perform the same task, only better?

Having Telion use his voice of experience on a blast weapon is indeed not the best idea.
Scouts can be ok as objective campers but they will die horribly to deepstriking HFs and what not. I prefer min with CCWs, a Fist and a LSS

I set my Assault scout sgt up with a combi-melta

Thinking maybe 5 w sniper rifles, and five w/ ccw

I run Power Fist and Combi-Melta in a Land Speeder Storm.

It's really, really nice.

100 pts for Scout Squad x5 w/ 5x Camo-Cloaks, 5x Sniper Rifles and Missile Launcher/Heavy Bolter. -OR- 100 pts for Scout Squad x5 w/ 4x Combat Blades/Bolt Pistols and Powerfist w/ Shotgun.

You can also make the most ridiculously hard thing to get out of cover for objective games. That would be Scout Squad x10 w/ 10x Camo-Cloaks, 5x Sniper Rifles, Missile Launcher, Shotgun, Combat Blade, Boltgun and Powerfist. Especially if you put them in a building split up on the top floors where you should have put an objective/capture and control and reinforce that even further with a Thunderfire Cannon and it's Bolster Defences Ability.

tedurur wrote:Having Telion use his voice of experience on a blast weapon is indeed not the best idea.
Scouts can be ok as objective campers but they will die horribly to deepstriking HFs and what not. I prefer min with CCWs, a Fist and a LSS

Who said you'll use the blast template?

starsdawn wrote:

tedurur wrote:Having Telion use his voice of experience on a blast weapon is indeed not the best idea.
Scouts can be ok as objective campers but they will die horribly to deepstriking HFs and what not. I prefer min with CCWs, a Fist and a LSS

Who said you'll use the blast template?

You did, you said someone used it in conjunction with the HB...

tedurur wrote:

starsdawn wrote:

tedurur wrote:Having Telion use his voice of experience on a blast weapon is indeed not the best idea.
Scouts can be ok as objective campers but they will die horribly to deepstriking HFs and what not. I prefer min with CCWs, a Fist and a LSS

Who said you'll use the blast template?

You did, you said someone used it in conjunction with the HB...

I was thinking you're implying you'll use the missile launcher's frag rounds.

starsdawn wrote:

tedurur wrote:

starsdawn wrote:

tedurur wrote:Having Telion use his voice of experience on a blast weapon is indeed not the best idea.
Scouts can be ok as objective campers but they will die horribly to deepstriking HFs and what not. I prefer min with CCWs, a Fist and a LSS

Who said you'll use the blast template?

You did, you said someone used it in conjunction with the HB...

I was thinking you're implying you'll use the missile launcher's frag rounds.

Depending on the circumstance, I would justify Telion's "Voice of Experience" on a blast weapon. Against horde-like armies, barring that there aren't unit leader types (ie - an Ork Nob), having a BS 6" Blast template is pretty good. BS 6 has a 75% chance of being on target. With the right weapon, you're likely to kill more than 1 model.

Otherwise, Telion's best used for allocating wounds to unit leaders or Special Weapon carriers, if the unit has any.

Yeah, thats an awesome way of spedning 50pts...especially seeing how you are giving up two str 4 rending shots in order to do it.

That said, youd have a 92% chance of being on target with a BS 6 blast, not 75%

Tried bolter scouts. Not brilliant it has to be said... cursed BS3 Sniper scouts I ALWAYS use Telion. Don't care what situation or where I am, I always take him. Fantastic pot-shot master when I need it CC scouts, You could consider a power sword and melta bombs. Can't take out MCs but you can handle everything else for 10pts cheaper.

tedurur wrote:Yeah, thats an awesome way of spedning 50pts...especially seeing how you are giving up two str 4 rending shots in order to do it.

That said, youd have a 92% chance of being on target with a BS 6 blast, not 75%

Well if you could hit more than two people (maybe five will be a nice trade-off), that would be better than two shots, I think?

I use Telion usually for the Krak, and of course it will almost always hit. If I aim for light infantry, if they're clumped together I use the blast, otherwise just gun them down.

starsdawn wrote:

Well if you could hit more than two people (maybe five will be a nice trade-off), that would be better than two shots, I think?

You should always be calling shots on those special weapon / sergeants. Most horde armies also tend to be rather weak when they lose their squad leaders.

2 Snipe shots > a small template every day of the year.

It's entirely situational.

To say that one option is patently "better" than another is kind of silly.

I had some success putting a fist on a sarg in a unit in a land speeder storm. You can put a multi melta on the storm and have the unit assault out of it into another vehicle if the melta does it's job. Then you can be looking at 2 vehicles gone but with the bs of the storm it'll miss half the time.

VinPetrol wrote:

starsdawn wrote:

Well if you could hit more than two people (maybe five will be a nice trade-off), that would be better than two shots, I think?

You should always be calling shots on those special weapon / sergeants. Most horde armies also tend to be rather weak when they lose their squad leaders.

2 Snipe shots > a small template every day of the year.

By saying "most", you mean not all. I don't see why you "should" if it's not all.

As have already pointed out, it's entirely situational.

tedurur wrote:Yeah, thats an awesome way of spedning 50pts...especially seeing how you are giving up two str 4 rending shots in order to do it.

Like I said, it depends on the circumstances. Try to finish reading my comments before replying...

tedurur wrote:That said, youd have a 92% chance of being on target with a BS 6 blast, not 75%

Incorrect. It's 75%. 33.3% (1/3) of Scatter Die landing on Bullseye + 41.6% (15/36) of possible dice combinations that would allow BS 6 to score on target = 75%

Do the math next time, kiddo...

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Monster Rain wrote:It's entirely situational.

To say that one option is patently "better" than another is kind of silly.

QFT. Tedurur, you might want to take note of this.

Rurouni Benshin wrote:
Incorrect. It's 75%. 33.3% (1/3) of Scatter Die landing on Bullseye + 41.6% (15/36) of possible dice combinations that would allow BS 6 to score on target = 75%

Do the math next time, kiddo...

I didn't bother to figure out the dice combinations that add up to 6 or less, so assuming its 15/36 shouldn't it actually be 1/3 + (2/3 * 15/36) =~ 61%?

Dracos wrote:

Rurouni Benshin wrote:
Incorrect. It's 75%. 33.3% (1/3) of Scatter Die landing on Bullseye + 41.6% (15/36) of possible dice combinations that would allow BS 6 to score on target = 75%

Do the math next time, kiddo...

I didn't bother to figure out the dice combinations that add up to 6 or less, so assuming its 15/36 shouldn't it actually be 1/3 + (2/3 * 15/36) =~ 61%?

No, because the 2/3 of the times where the Scatter Die does scatter, the only thing relevant to the equation is the number(s) on the 2d6.

I'm pretty sure you are wrong. The scatter dice only hits a scatter result 2/3 times, therefore the 1/3 times that is already accounted for includes all values of the 2d6.

There are 2 possible outcomes of rolling a scatter dice

1/3 of the time it rolls a hit.

2/3 of the time it rolls a scatter.

A subset of the 2/3 times it rolls a scatter is the number of times you roll a scatter, and the value of 2d6 is <= the firer's BS.

Therefore, the total number of times you don't see the blast template scatter is

1/3 + (2/3 * (fraction of possible dice results <= Firer's BS)

My formula was accurate.

edit: Scratch pretty sure, I know you are wrong. I can do maths.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Proof is that the number of times it scatters 7" or more is 2/3 * 21/36 = ~39%

Hmmm, for some reason I thought youd get to reroll the scatter die since he had a BS above 5....

And as for the math, Dracos is correct.
You dont add probabilities like you do Rurouni Benshin, by that logic someone who had a 50% chance of hitting on his first roll and then had a 50% chance of hitting on the reroll would hit 100%, maybe you should do the math as well kiddo?

Dracos, your formula looks pretty accurate. I'll look further and see if I can confirm it. I have no problems with admitting I was wrong.

tedurur wrote:Hmmm, for some reason I thought youd get to reroll the scatter die since he had a BS above 5....

No, you only get to reroll scatter if the attack itself was TL.