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I'm currently researching a colour scheme for my models. They are based on roughly July-August 1944 Totenkopf. From what I can from photos and literature tell this means mostly M44 pea-dot/erbsenmuster for jackets and about 80/20 split between feldgrau and pea dot for trousers.

My questions, principally from not being able to tell from black and white photos are:
1. helmet covers - from what I can tell these are generally supposed to be oak leaf (and I hope so as I think oak leaf autumn looks really good at small scale). Is this generally the case?
2. Was oak leaf used on the jacket as well at that period for Totenkopf? From all the photos I've seen from that era it appears not, and is just mainly 1943 or so.

One other question I have is regarding 2cm quad Sd Kfz 7/1 anti-aircraft guns. The flames of war list I am using allows these as part of the army, but I wonder if these should be painted as Waffen SS or if they would in fact be part of the Luftwaffe and therefore use a different style of camouflage. Were these ever crewed by Totenkopf themselves?

Thanks!

TBH there are no hard and fast rules when it comes to German WW2 uniform. This becomes more true the later you go and in particular when dealing with the Waffen SS.

SS Camo came in a whole host of patterns from many different sources so I would do what "feels" right, you wont go far wrong.

As for the SdKfz 7/1, that would have been organic to the unit and therefore crewed by Waffen SS.

Also, I do not know much about the Totenkopf history but it does seem as the Kampfgruppe structure was used more widely, you could have Luftwaffe crewed guns attached to a Kampfgruppe.

I believe. Obviously not as knowledgable as some, but basing what little I know and the various Army Lists, it would depend on what you were going for as well as what "section" you were pulling them from. Whether Combat, Weapon, of Divisional Support platoon entries.

Each SS-Panzergrenadier-Regiment had its own flak company, the SdKfz 7/1's would have been from this, so SS crew. Also each SS Panzer Division had its own Flak Battalion equiped with 88's. All a SS Panzer Division's Flak was organic to the unit, no Luftwaffe envolvment at all.

legoburner wrote:I'm currently researching a colour scheme for my models. They are based on roughly July-August 1944 Totenkopf. From what I can from photos and literature tell this means mostly M44 pea-dot/erbsenmuster for jackets and about 80/20 split between feldgrau and pea dot for trousers.

My questions, principally from not being able to tell from black and white photos are:
1. helmet covers - from what I can tell these are generally supposed to be oak leaf (and I hope so as I think oak leaf autumn looks really good at small scale). Is this generally the case?
2. Was oak leaf used on the jacket as well at that period for Totenkopf? From all the photos I've seen from that era it appears not, and is just mainly 1943 or so.

One other question I have is regarding 2cm quad Sd Kfz 7/1 anti-aircraft guns. The flames of war list I am using allows these as part of the army, but I wonder if these should be painted as Waffen SS or if they would in fact be part of the Luftwaffe and therefore use a different style of camouflage. Were these ever crewed by Totenkopf themselves?

Thanks!

1 - Waffen SS Helmet Covers

Welcome to the world of anal wargaming!

Helmet covers came in the following patterns...

Oakleaf A
Oakleaf B
Planetree
Blurred Edge (or 'Smoke')
Palm/Forest (rather rare)

To be honest, in 15mm they will all look pretty much the same! So go with Oakleaf, it was the most widely used.

Depending how mad ya want to be, try here... http://german-helmets.com/ and I can give you pics from a few books if you want them.






2 - Oakleaf Jackets, generally post-1943.

Oakleaf tunics did exist, the M43 Oakleaf Drill Tunic is one version but they generally seem to have been locally made from Zeltbahns and been rather popular with officers... All soldiers seem to like to look 'cool' even in the 1940s! How wide spread they were is open to conjecture but several examples still survive. I have also seen them in Blurred Edge and Planetree.



the repro above is based on an original seen in Beavors book on Waffen-SS uniforms.

The only mass produced camo tunics were M44 Dot Erbsenmuster (Pea Dot) and a large number locally made using the Italian M29 camo.




Aldramech has answered your AA queries... Each Waffen-SS unit had its own flak assets.

Is he a catalog model P? lol We just need him looking at his watch and maybe standing around in his pants pointing at something in the distance

Thanks for all the help, much appreciated!

Aldramelech wrote:Is he a catalog model P? lol We just need him looking at his watch and maybe standing around in his pants pointing at something in the distance

He is in the next picture.

That pose is entitled 'German looking startled' I believe...