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HQ
-Fateweaver

-Bloodthirster

Elites
-6x- Bloodcrushers
-fury-
-instrument-
-icon-

-6x- Bloodcrushers
-fury-
-instrument-
-icon-

-6x-Fiends
-might-

Troops
-6x- Plaguebearers
-icon-

-6x- Plaguebearers


-6x- Plaguebearers

Heavy Support-
-Daemon Prince
-Flight-
-Iron Hide-
-Mark of nurgle-
-Cloud of flies-
-Noxious Touch-


Usual pick. However may switch 1 of the plaguebearer units with icon with the fiends.

---First wave---
-Fateweaver-
-Bloodthirster-
-Both squads of crushers
-fiends-

2nd Wave-
-all 3 units of plaguebearers
-Daemon prince

I'd transfer your Icons to your 'crushers to give you another wound group to play with. Also, why would you bring in your Icons second wave?

I'd trim your Plaguebearers down to 5's and take some upgrades off the prince to get another DP in this list. More T6 bodies on the field is always better, and I'm not sure you need the wings on them in this list.

Claypool wrote:I'd transfer your Icons to your 'crushers to give you another wound group to play with. Also, why would you bring in your Icons second wave?

I'd trim your Plaguebearers down to 5's and take some upgrades off the prince to get another DP in this list. More T6 bodies on the field is always better, and I'm not sure you need the wings on them in this list.

I put Icons in my 2nd wave just incase i dont get my first wave haha. However i might have to go with your idea and put a icon on each of my crusher units then with the extra 30 pts put a icon on one of my plaguebearer units.

The list is already to slow. It needs the daemon princes with wings.

10 Seekers instead of Deamon Prince?

Split your waves more evenly otherwise you will lose 1/3 of your games.

yermom wrote:Split your waves more evenly otherwise you will lose 1/3 of your games.

Agreed. Unless your version of "competitive" is "My plan is to roll well for which wave I get in every game in the tournament," which people have done before. Sometimes it even works... specifically, with a probability of (2/3)^(number of games).

yermom wrote:Split your waves more evenly otherwise you will lose 1/3 of your games.

Actually not really. I played in a 2k tourney just this last weekend (same list just with another DP) and won the tourney . And had my 2nd wave come out 2 out of the 3 games. Tabling a space marine bike army first game. All i have to do is play more defensive if i get my 2nd wave.

I don't know about Daemons, but I'd advise listening to Yermon, he's got a good record and is a good Daemon player.

I think the list looks OK, but I believe the waves to be a but unbalanced, as are the spread of points. By all means, focus on Blood-crushers and HQ, but don't let it ruin the rest of your army...

Just Dave wrote:I don't know about Daemons, but I'd advise listening to Yermon, he's got a good record and is a good Daemon player.

I think the list looks OK, but I believe the waves to be a but unbalanced, as are the spread of points. By all means, focus on Blood-crushers and HQ, but don't let it ruin the rest of your army...

So far It has been entered into 3 tourneys and remains undefeated in tourney and friendly play. And have another tourney set for this weekend.

As said before, the difference in waves doesnt seem to faze this list. If i get the unchosen side all i do is play more defensive, on the following turns whatever ends up coming in goes where i need it since i have the spread of icons on the plagues.

Also the question in need was what to spend the extra 30 points on. Which i think claypool had good ideas and the list has been twicked to mirror them.

italiaplaya wrote:

Just Dave wrote:I don't know about Daemons, but I'd advise listening to Yermon, he's got a good record and is a good Daemon player.

I think the list looks OK, but I believe the waves to be a but unbalanced, as are the spread of points. By all means, focus on Blood-crushers and HQ, but don't let it ruin the rest of your army...

So far It has been entered into 3 tourneys and remains undefeated in tourney and friendly play.

Have you played anything with even halfway decent shooting?

An IG army with a PBS... you might as well concede.

Fast mech...

Well, I guess you can own the FLGS cub seal's marine foot horde

Jabbdo wrote:

italiaplaya wrote:

Just Dave wrote:I don't know about Daemons, but I'd advise listening to Yermon, he's got a good record and is a good Daemon player.

I think the list looks OK, but I believe the waves to be a but unbalanced, as are the spread of points. By all means, focus on Blood-crushers and HQ, but don't let it ruin the rest of your army...

So far It has been entered into 3 tourneys and remains undefeated in tourney and friendly play.

Have you played anything with even halfway decent shooting?

An IG army with a PBS... you might as well concede.

Fast Mech

What do you plan to do with the PBS against fearless daemons?

Reducing fateweavers ld to 2, wounding him with a lasgun, laughing.

Jabbdo wrote:Reducing fateweavers ld to 2, wounding him with a lasgun, laughing.

Lasguns wound on leadership?

Do you play daemons??

If fateweaver takes a wound, he takes an ld test or runs off crying.

Really, know what you're talking about before you state stuff...

Jabbdo wrote:Do you play daemons??

If fateweaver takes a wound, he takes an ld test or runs off crying.

Really, know what you're talking about before you state stuff...

Sorry that i forgot one obscure rule about one Daemon character.....



What advice have you really added here? I actually made a suggestion, and questioned one of your comments, your just here to argue....and then insult other people, seriously get a life...

Jabbdo wrote:Do you play daemons??

If fateweaver takes a wound, he takes an ld test or runs off crying.

Really, know what you're talking about before you state stuff...

I play at many large tourneys within a 2 hour driving distance. After having been to a GT and there lack of competitive play I rather not attend anymore. They are good however if you plan on talking about how nice everyones armies are painted, as well as how fluffy there lists are. I myself however as well as my gaming group have been running around in hopes of running our very own GT in the Bay area within the next year. The date as plan is in March 4th and 5th i believe. The thread is in tournament discussion. It will be straight competitive play. No painting, no soft score bs. However painted armies will be a must.

After having fateweaver run off twice first turn in the last 2 games of my last weeks tourney. I dont mind it to much. Ah what a great waste of 333pts. Might I add they only shot 1 unit at him both times.

List i usually run into at 1850pt would be mec IG. Nob bikers, TH/SS terminie spam marines. thunderwolve calv. done the correct way with stormshields. Missile launcher spam space wolves the list goes on.

italiaplaya wrote:

Jabbdo wrote:Do you play daemons??

If fateweaver takes a wound, he takes an ld test or runs off crying.

Really, know what you're talking about before you state stuff...

I play at many large tourneys within a 2 hour driving distance. After having been to a GT and there lack of competitive play I rather not attend anymore. They are good however if you plan on talking about how nice everyones armies are painted, as well as how fluffy there lists are. I myself however as well as my gaming group have been running around in hopes of running our very own GT in the Bay area within the next year. The date as plan is in March 4th and 5th i believe. The thread is in tournament discussion. It will be straight competitive play. No painting, no soft score bs. However painted armies will be a must.

After having fateweaver run off twice first turn in the last 2 games of my last weeks tourney. I dont mind it to much. Ah what a great waste of 333pts. Might I add they only shot 1 unit at him both times.

List i usually run into at 1850pt would be mini leafblower IG. Nob bikers, TH/SS terminie spam marines. thunderwolve calv. done the correct way with stormshields. Missile launcher spam space wolves the list goes on.

Fair enough. Best of luck to you then!

One thing I've noticed when using crushers is that pavane helps a lot, it migitates lack of grenades and lets you push people around, and closer to your crushers. I normally use 2 slaneesh DP's, though if I have HQ slots free I'll drop one of them for the masque, she's a bargain for what she provides. Just my 2 cents.

The only problem I run into is mech eldar really. However I played a duel seer council eldar list with lots of jetbikes and fire prisms. And ended with a win. (1 of the players that took down fateweaver first turn)

rodgers37 wrote:

Jabbdo wrote:Do you play daemons??

If fateweaver takes a wound, he takes an ld test or runs off crying.

Really, know what you're talking about before you state stuff...

Sorry that i forgot one obscure rule about one Daemon character.....



What advice have you really added here? I actually made a suggestion, and questioned one of your comments, your just here to argue....and then insult other people, seriously get a life...

I am not here, as so you so eloquently put it, to "insult people". I am here to give constructive criticism where it is needed, and heartfelt congratulation where it is deserved. No more. No less.

Satisfied?

Fateweaver can be a big hinderance to a Deamon list in a way....
When you have multiple units getting his re-roll bonus, its great, but the problem is, he's 333 points, and if he dies turn 1/2 (or runs away....), or you get distracted (which you probably don't....) trying to get as many units near him as possible, rather than picking your targets correctly...

Jabbdo may have a point about pavane....You could fit in 2 Slaanesh Chariots, with a few upgrades here (and then add the Seekers, because they are cool )....That could be something to try out at some point....

Jabbdo wrote:

italiaplaya wrote:

Jabbdo wrote:Do you play daemons??

If fateweaver takes a wound, he takes an ld test or runs off crying.

Really, know what you're talking about before you state stuff...

I play at many large tourneys within a 2 hour driving distance. After having been to a GT and there lack of competitive play I rather not attend anymore. They are good however if you plan on talking about how nice everyones armies are painted, as well as how fluffy there lists are. I myself however as well as my gaming group have been running around in hopes of running our very own GT in the Bay area within the next year. The date as plan is in March 4th and 5th i believe. The thread is in tournament discussion. It will be straight competitive play. No painting, no soft score bs. However painted armies will be a must.

After having fateweaver run off twice first turn in the last 2 games of my last weeks tourney. I dont mind it to much. Ah what a great waste of 333pts. Might I add they only shot 1 unit at him both times.

List i usually run into at 1850pt would be mini leafblower IG. Nob bikers, TH/SS terminie spam marines. thunderwolve calv. done the correct way with stormshields. Missile launcher spam space wolves the list goes on.

Fair enough. Best of luck to you then!

One thing I've noticed when using crushers is that pavane helps a lot, it migitates lack of grenades and lets you push people around, and closer to your crushers. I normally use 2 slaneesh DP's, though if I have HQ slots free I'll drop one of them for the masque, she's a bargain for what she provides. Just my 2 cents.

I have actually been thinking about switching the daemon prince to slaas. with pavane. or even tzeentch for some more shooting. Might have to try out pavane though. But was debating if the Dp would need wings.

I've found that pavane princes do fine without wings, if you have several they can even make do without iron hide. As pavane is 18" range, they can afford to scatter on the drop (I'd put them into the second wave) and pavane gives them a sort of reverse fleet so they can assault too if needed.

A prince w/ MoS, pavane, and grenades (for 5pts might as well) is only 125pts.

Try them out some time, see how they work for you.

I was thinking they wouldnt need the wings either. But iron hide I may have to stay with. Leaving it at 150 each.

You can play defenseively like that against most armies. Maybe not IG or missile spam but in most cases sure. dHowever if the remaining forces of your army come in piecemeal or all together a turn or too late, suddenly you dont have a chance to do much of anything.

As a daemon player your opponent wont take heavy casulties until turn 2 at best. Throw in the fact that your second wave doesn't do anything and it becoes turn 3 at best. Often that first turn of casulties is spent clearing a screen or poping transports. (againt good players anyway) meaning turn 4 at best until you get to his real units. That doesn't leave you much time to actually win the game, where that does leave him with at least 3 shooting phases to win. Stacking your waves like that is a good way for you to get draws at best.

yermom wrote:You can play defenseively like that against most armies. Maybe not IG or missile spam but in most cases sure. dHowever if the remaining forces of your army come in piecemeal or all together a turn or too late, suddenly you dont have a chance to do much of anything.

As a daemon player your opponent wont take heavy casulties until turn 2 at best. Throw in the fact that your second wave doesn't do anything and it becoes turn 3 at best. Often that first turn of casulties is spent clearing a screen or poping transports. (againt good players anyway) meaning turn 4 at best until you get to his real units. That doesn't leave you much time to actually win the game, where that does leave him with at least 3 shooting phases to win. Stacking your waves like that is a good way for you to get draws at best.

What you seem to forget is that 2 out of the 3 missions in the rulebook whether the tournament uses right out of the book or changes them up a little are object based games. If your not going to go after the objects i'll be happy to sit on them till you come to them. The list is not easy to take down having most units T5 and above with mulitiple wounds and cant be instant-killed with rerolls on atleast some of the units in high priority areas where fateweaver should be placed by.

I use the mission to my advantage. And have thus far have not had any problems. As i said in the first post though I have thought about switching the fiends with a unit of plaguebearers in the wave set up

Putting good units into the second wave does not necessarily make it better. I think it's imperative to have fiends (a fast element) in the first wave givng it an element of speed. Putting fiends in the second wave is giing your opponent a target. I strongly suggest putting 1 crusher wave per squad. It allows you to still play a game while you're waiting for your primary wave.

It's not hard to contest an objective last turn. If you're playing daemons and you're just sitting back on objectives (with non troops) and not rushing towards at the enemy, your either playing tzeentch or you're doing it wrong.

If the enemy is mobile which a good army is he will have no problem moving before you drop (assuming he goes first which you want right?) to hold the objectives. Then what? Your second wae comes in the way back to try to play defenseively? Castling up in the corner is not how you beat daemons by any means.