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How does this work:

Let's say I have a unit of 6 Fiends, those bad mamba jamba Fiends that don't have assault grenades but their 14 point cousins do. I declare an assault on my opponent's Terminator squad. I measure the 12" from the closest model in my squad of Fiends and the closest model in his squad of Terminators and I have a clear path to him (and within range). However, the next closest Fiend has to try and make base contact with a Terminator that is NOT in base contact with one of my Fiends. This forces him to take a path that moves him through a crater which is difficult terrain. Does this mean I need to first measure out all of the paths that my Fiends are going to take, determine that they need to assault through cover, and then make a difficult terrain test?

I have heard some people mention that if the first guy gets there with no problem then the rest of my squad gets to ignore the terrain. I have even heard one guy say that I don't even have to make base contact with the rest of his squad and I can make him move his Termies out of cover and come to me!

Clarifications would be awesome! Thanks.

Page 36, main rules:

"If, following the rules for moving assaulting models (see page 34), any model in an assaulting unit will have to go through difficult or dangerous terrain as part of its assault move, the unit must take the relevant terrain test before moving."

Any model, so if one model will have to test, then the UNIT must test and the entire unit is limited to the difficult terrain distance. And no, if you can reach an unengaged model, you do NOT get to ignore it and make it come to you, you must attempt to reach it, even if the end result is a failed assault.

Any model, so if one model will have to test, then the UNIT must test and the entire unit is limited to the difficult terrain distance. And no, if you can reach an unengaged model, you do NOT get to ignore it and make it come to you, you must attempt to reach it, even if the end result is a failed assault.

They must do this by taking the shortest possible path, right? Even if that means trying to charge the enemy through a pond, crater, over a fence, or anything similar that would impede movement? Which, in essence, means that the troops that are fighting in the 40k universe are morons and don't know how to walk around it?

Nope, only the first model is limited to the shortest path. So if they can go around the terrain and still reach the unengaged model, they may do so. After the first model, the rest are only bound by the list of rules on page 34, ie A. reach unengaged, B. then engaged, C. then within 2", D. then just maintain coherency. But they must try to do A before B, B before C, etc.

You had the first part correct.

You move the closest model into base to base.

Then you start moving the rest of your models to try and get into base to base in any order you want. You do not have to move the next closest model.

So as long as you do not move any models through the difficult terrain you will be fine.

Note however if one terminator is somehow situated where you can make base contact with it by goign through terrain and in no other way and you go to move your last Fiend that, sadly, has no other option to get into base with an unengaged model you must move into that model through terrain. Careful planning can go a long way to avoid these kinds of situations.

Agree with all of the above.

Moving models from the back of the assaulting unit can often mitigate this.

Wow. This is 100% news to me. I thought that all assaulting models had to obey the "taking the shortest possible route" rule when assaulting, not just the first model. So, this means that it is actually possible to assault a unit that is partially in cover and not have to make a difficult terrain test? Given that certain variables are in place, of course.

Let me ask you this, though. Let's say I am assaulting a Rhino with my Fiends. The first guy makes it there just fine. The next Fiend I move in to assault can run around a piece of area terrain to get in with the 2" reach but he can't make it in base to base. HOWEVER, if I measure a straight line to the Rhino (which passes through the area terrain), he CAN make it into base-to-base (remember, the first Fiend already made it into base-to-base contact with the Rhino). Does this mean the whole squad needs to take a difficult terrain test?

no it just means you need to choose a different second model for the assault.

If there is a narrow passage between 2 areas of difficult terrain, and only the closest model can make it into assault range through this passage, the rest having to move through the Difficult terrain in order to get into contact, then the whole unit must make a difficult terrain test, and that may prevent even the first model from making contact. In this event the Assault will fail, and no models would make contact or even move.

Kurce - as KK said you can NORMALLY find a way to avoid this requirement.

If you move a model at the back of the unit forwards it normally wont have the movement to get into btb, and as such isnt forced to go through terrain. You then make sure you position it such that the mdoel that *may* have to go through terrain can no longer do so.

If you cant do this with one model, move as many in the way until the 2nd closest will no longer drag you through terrain.

There MAY be some occasions where you cant avoid the Difficult terrain check, however this is mostly when you havent thought ahead in your movement phase!

nosferatu1001 wrote:Kurce - as KK said you can NORMALLY find a way to avoid this requirement.

If you move a model at the back of the unit forwards it normally wont have the movement to get into btb, and as such isnt forced to go through terrain. You then make sure you position it such that the mdoel that *may* have to go through terrain can no longer do so.

But by moving the models from the back of the unit forward, blocking units that could have made it into base contact, you might violate a part of the assault rules, on page 34 BRB 2nd paragraph under 'Moving Assaulting Models', "Assaulting units must attempt to engage as many opposing models as posssible with as many of their models as possible..."

So if I have, for example, a unit of 8 models in 2 ranks of 4, with the front rank being 6" away from an enemy unit and the second rank being 8 " away. I have to move the closest model to the enemy first. If I now move the back rank forward, they will be in coherency with the first model and within 2" of a model in base contact with an enemy unit and so the rules have been followed. But now the rest of the models cannot move within 2" of the first model, and since they are not within 2" of a model in base contact they are not engaged and cannot attack. I have violated the rule because I have "held back" 4 models in the unit. If I moved the front rank first, then I would have been able to engage the enemy unit with all 8 models, which satisfies the rule. And if, in moving any of those models, any one of them would have to move through difficult terrain, I would have to test for the entire unit.

a) "engage", not "get into b2b with"

And, given you can never engage a vehicle, in this instance it makes no difference either way.

b) if you still end up with as many models fighting as would otherwise have done so then you have satisfied the requirements.

edit: and c) the key word is "as possible" - if, by following the assaulting rules you HAVE put as many as was possible, by moving them in the manner you are allowed, then you have satisfied the "as possible"

After all you can state that trying to move through terrain could a) reduce the total number of models that can make it in (if you roll low, but still make assault) or b) stop the assault from happening at all.

time wizard wrote:

nosferatu1001 wrote:Kurce - as KK said you can NORMALLY find a way to avoid this requirement.

If you move a model at the back of the unit forwards it normally wont have the movement to get into btb, and as such isnt forced to go through terrain. You then make sure you position it such that the mdoel that *may* have to go through terrain can no longer do so.

But by moving the models from the back of the unit forward, blocking units that could have made it into base contact, you might violate a part of the assault rules, on page 34 BRB 2nd paragraph under 'Moving Assaulting Models', "Assaulting units must attempt to engage as many opposing models as posssible with as many of their models as possible..."

Not really, you are still following RAW by choosing what models to move after the first. Even if these models end up preventing others from getting into B2B (which the assault rules to account for). The practice is very similar to removing shooting casualties from a unit in such a way as to prevent the unit that is shooting you from assaulting that same turn.

-Yad

I don't have my rulebook, but I recall that it says that the remaining models after the first may then be moved in any order that you want so long as it obeys certain conditions. One of those conditions is that it must remain in coherency with a model that has already assaulted. Keyword there is a model that has already assaulted. So, some of you said that you can start "in the back" of your squad and move your guys forward. But, if those models cannot stay within coherency of the a model that has already assaulted, does this mean they are not eligible to be moved yet? Does this mean you have to move one of the models in front of him in order for the other model to have room to be able to at least remain in coherency with a model that has already assaulted?

No matter what the answer is to the above question, I thank you all for clearing this up for me. We have been doing our assaults completely wrong at my local shop.

Kurce wrote:some of you said that you can start "in the back" of your squad and move your guys forward. But, if those models cannot stay within coherency of the a model that has already assaulted, does this mean they are not eligible to be moved yet?

It does.
That is stated to be the most important constraint on assault moves, actually.