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Okay okay, everyone i ask about this demonic colossal thing says its really good especially when i take off everything but his battle cannon for a total of 5 attacks (6 on charge), and im told these things are devastating. I run a khorne melee army so i have obviously looked at these things several times, but every time i do i see the 3 BS and WS and i just cant see how these thigns are worth doing anything but shooting the battle cannon. I mean with 3 WS even if you got 6 attacks your iniutive is 3 so your gonna be attacking last and probably only 3 of your attacks will hit.

The ONLY reason i still want to put it into my army instead of pred tanks with lass cannons is the fact it will most likely be attacked before my demon princes hence letting them get down the field before getting blown up (lord only knows why they are targeting the defiler).


I think im really missing something big about these guys, can someone tell me what these things are good for, cause i am at a loss.

since it is a walker, all you need to worry about is the powerfist inthe squad, which you will hit before, so I3 is not so bad.

if you are punching a tank the WS3 does not matter as well, and your S10 is well used there.

since melee units hit your rear armor always hit your rear armor can any unit with a strength of 4 just glance your deflier before it even gets to attack and sadly deflier only has 6 strength not 10 :/ (or else i could put it to better use)

the deflier has a dreadnought type close combat weapon which boosts its strength to ten its basicaly a really big power fist but without the strike last special rule (please correct me if I am wrong) so it should be hitting everything with s10 unless the arm has been blown off by incomming fire then it can stomp and kick everything for s6

You must be new, are you not? I would advice using bolterandchainsword instead of dakkadakka since people tend to talk about things they do not know so mutch about.

But yes, the defiler has not only 1, but 2 dreadnought close combat weapons (hits at str 10, no armour saves) and since it is a walker enemy units attack him at his front armour, not his back in melle. Also they can only use one attack per model (take that space wolves krak grenades!)

The Defiler also has fleet (nasty on any walker since they are so big and run so fast) smoke launchers if you wanne run up midfield, or just the battlecannon witch is str 8, ap3 ordenance. Good bye marines and tanks.

It is a bit expensive, but very very very versatile.

ahh ok thank you for the info but where does it say this, i dont see it anywhere in the codex about it getting 10str, says the close combat arms just give more attacks

and also why do people tend to target this first?, is it cause it looks like the scarest thing on the field?

also thank you for telling me about the attacking from the front thing. and yes i havent played yet im still modeling my army (i have the army jsut still putting it together)

i will start using this other site for these kinda questions before asking here (thanks for the link)

Also, Walkers are always hit on the front armor facing in close combat, not the rear, so it takes S6 to glance you and S7 to get you worried.

The rules for Dreadnought Close Combat Weapons are in the Main rule book. It should say that it comes with 2x DCCW already and any "extra" arms just give it more attacks. if you lose ALL of the DCCW arms then you go down to the base Str of 6 and people can take armor saves as well

quick rundown of the unit


S10 and ignores armor saves with 5(6) attacks

S8 AP3 large blast and it is ordinace so you get 2D6 and pick the highest against any AV

Ignores Shaken and Stunned results due to demonic possesion

Always hit on the front AV in close combat. You can attack any unit without a powerfist and not worry too much about it, or even units with a S6 powerfist and still be mostly okay.

Also, grenades only hit it on a 6+ unless it is immobilized so do not worry about Krak grenades

treats difficult terrain like infantry, so it is slowed by it, but you can not be immobilized by it.

thank you i see now why people talk highly of this, with everythign you told me (especially it using its front armor) makes me see why its good now

Yeah no problem, the rules can be very scattered in this game with having to look through the codex and the main rules to find stuff.

Also ws3 isn't that bad, as you hit models with ws4 on the same role as you would if you had ws4. The only detriment is that you are easier to hit by ws4 models, although this has no effect on grenades.

Think of it this way. Its a dreadnought, That ignores stunned and shaken, has fleet, has more attacks, AND has a battle cannon. Its a very good deal. Also, its ability to do well in CC and in shooting gives the defiler a lot of flexibility in how it is played.

The thing you need to be careful of with the defiler is enemy heavy weaponry. In terms of durability with "destroyed" results, it's exactly as tough as a dreadnought, and taller, so it's harder to get cover saves--this, combined with the aforementioned six attacks at s10 ignoring armour, is the reason everybody targets the defiler. It should only rarely actually fire its battle cannon, because every turn you're not locked in combat is a turn in which you can be shot at.

Hence on the other side of the flexibilty description is that it has an identity crisis .

Note: I personally like putting it into reserve and getting at least one shot in, esp. going second.

I second the holding them in reserves if you get second turn. Played against Tau last night and had a squad of stealth suits running away from one defiler. They looked like they had made it out of charge range. When the player was done I let him know not to worry about the suits as they had retreated near my board edge and I had another defiler in reserve. Next turn was my turn 5 and I would take care of them.

I agree mekanob that it is a good strategy to use them for CC and cannon if nothing is in range to charge. Another bonus is defilers can fleet, pop smoke, charge, and destroy a vehicle giving them a 4+ save for the next shooting turn. Thats how you hide a defiler, in the broken hull of your enemies.

Do dreadnought cc weapons attack in initiative order or no?

While they seem like a power fist, nothing in their description states that they are treated as powerfists, nor do they have any mention of modifing their Initiative.

They strike at the models normal Initative.