Thinking of starting WHFB

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**LordofSteel**

Hey whats up guys. I've been a long time fan of Warhammer however I've only ever taken the time into learning 40k. I am really interested in starting Fantasy, all I need to do is convince one of my friends to start with me. Anyway more to the point. I have been really contemplating Vampire Counts for my first Fantasy army, however whenever I look at the WHFB Army Lists index I have yet to see any VC army lists. Do not a lot of people play VC? If so is their a reason, such as them not being very good or out of date. In particular I really wanted to have an army consisting of Skeletal Warriors, Grave Guards, Blood Knights, and Wraiths. I wanted to know if an army structured on just these units (including vampire lords etc) would be effective enough in games. I don't know anything about how to play WHFB so any input would help, thanks.

**MechaEmperor7000**

I'm largely in the same boat as you my friend. However from what I have heard, VC and Daemons are currently two of the more powerful armies (akin to Space Wolves for 40k). VC I can see why, since zombies are insanely easy to raise, and Manfred Von Carstein is just retardedly powerful. Blood Knights (if you can afford the models) are also quite stunning in terms of power.

**ShivanAngel**

last edition i would agree with you.

This edition they have gone down quite a bit in power.

VC are still a very strong army tho, vampires are very strong casters as well as very strong fighters.

**MechaEmperor7000**

What is the general differences between 7th and 8th? I've just recently gone back to fantasy and have only played in the 6th. Right now I know that Magic Resistance, Charging, and Power dice have changed drastically.

**Iratus Custodis**

The biggest and most annoying difference in my opinion are....TRUE LINE OF SIGHT.
That thing in itself made many large monsters more or less "worthless", depending in the local meta and such ofcourse.
Also you don't have to guess the range with warmachines anymore and infantry got a huge boost with being able to attack in an extra rank(and another one if they are in horde formation) and that units with more ranks than the enemy are stubborn.
Also you need atleast two ranks to break enemy ranks, so things like dragons, chariots etc. are less useful since they can remove enemy ranks with flank charges.
Magic also got a "boost" with more powerful spells and such.
Overall 8th edition is more streamlined and "easier" to play, with some lame/stupid/silly rules that just don't feel right(gotta hate true line of sight).

**ShivanAngel**

My only problem with true line of sight is..

Oh I can see the leg of one model out of 50, my entire unit can shoot at them.

Oh look, I killed 12.

**Iratus Custodis**

True enough, though I will miss freedom the old ruleset for targeting gave to modelling...now you will have to think twice before you give put that dragon on a large rock or all those wizards that are hovering in the air on magical stuff? They can't hide behind other units if I understand the rules right, so alot of modelling and conversion is lost I think. I'd preffer a blanked rule instead of a see what would happen by judging the models themselves ruleset in this regard. *shrugs*

**MechaEmperor7000**

Is it just me or is Fantasy and 40k slowly turning into the same thing? Alot of the 8th edition rules are similar to that of 5th edition 40k.

**Iratus Custodis**

I'd say GW thought 5th edition 40k was a huge success and enjoys going down to tabletop level and saying "bang-bang! my Marine can see your eldar!", I for one do not like that...
But yes the rulesets are moving closer to eachother is some regarards.

**blak43**

Cool that means that someday I'll be able to bring my skaven to 40k night and have them chew their waw through the space marines.

**Gridge**

I think VC could be a very interesting, fun and competitive force. I've considered them myself but I just can't afford a new army (in fact I don't even have all I need for my current ones).

Automatically Appended Next Post:

blak43 wrote:Cool that means that someday I'll be able to bring my skaven to 40k night and have them chew their waw through the space marines.

We can only hope there comes a day when my space marines land upon the primitive Old World and bring it into compliance. There is only one Emperor of Mankind!

**MechaEmperor7000**

Someone needs to do a SM Falcon PAAAUNCHing a Giant now with a power fist.

**blak43**

Gridge wrote:I think VC could be a very interesting, fun and competitive force. I've considered them myself but I just can't afford a new army (in fact I don't even have all I need for my current ones).

Automatically Appended Next Post:

blak43 wrote:Cool that means that someday I'll be able to bring my skaven to 40k night and have them chew their waw through the space marines.

We can only hope there comes a day when my space marines land upon the primitive Old World and bring it into compliance. There is only one Emperor of Mankind!

Hey I'm telling you, skaven, they get one piece of space marine tech and they'll have a whole army of rat marines before you can say WTF! Not to mention that we have magic.