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White Scars Can Haz Dreddnotz Now?  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
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Made in us
Primered White





Dothan, AL

Thesis

Is it plausible for the White Scars to field dreadnoughts now? They have access to them in Codex: Space Marines, they adhere to the Codex Astartes in their general organization, and I think they even have the fluff to back it up now as well. But this isn't how it's always been, as I'm sure most (if not all) of us know. The White Scars, in the "old fluff," have been known to shun the use of dreadnoughts because they couldn't stand the thought of a battle brother being immobilized on life support instead of flying across the field of battle on a bike or rocketing towards an objective in an APC. While this is true, I believe this fluff was written before the use of droppods for dreadnoughts or the Run! rules, which enable dreadnoughts to go faster than they ever have under previous rules.

Fluff Interpretation, Changing Tactics, and Supportive Units

I know the White Scars "don't like" encasing their battle brothers in a walking grave but to be fair the Eldar have been explained as not being fond of calling up dead souls to empower walkers either. The fact is the Eldar still call up the dead to fight because it's necessary, not because it's a cool magic trick, and they don't especially like disturbing the slumber of great warriors of past battles. The White Scars may feel similar in how they would rather their battle brothers succumb to their fatal wounds than to be a death dealing vegetable with weapon mounts instead of arms (not to mention they don't make any bikes THAT big yet), but sentiment doesn't win wars, armored warriors with guns or seismic hammers do.

Another boost to the possible fluff for using dreadnoughts in the White Scars chapter would be how fixated on hunting down enemies they are. If an enemy ever succesfully runs away from the White Scars, the chapter runs the target down for as long as it takes to finally kill and behead the runaway. Wouldn't it be plausible for a White Scar brother to be so fixated on accomplishing this goal they would even be willing to be entombed in a dreadnought if it meant they could continue the hunt? The promise of glory and honor seem so enticing to a space marine that wouldn't they willingly set aside their own preferences for how to conduct a battle. Maybe it's just taken a while for the White Scars to "come around" to this idea of tactica, like they have been known to be slow about things in the past; the "born in the saddle" rules come to mind, where everything had to be on bikes or in transports. Now the C:SM mentions how they make extensive use of scouts, which are normally deployed without a transport (In fact, the Storm land speeder can't be taken as a dedicated transport).

The third, and final, point is mainly related to supporting dreadnoughts through techmarines. The Adeptus Mechanicus love all things mechanical (if they "love" anything at all) and the White Scars would certainly have a good number of techmarines and servitors from the Adeptus Mechanicus to take care of their well-used bikes. Perhaps a Master of the Forge on the chapter council would argue for the use of dreadnoughts under trying times, but regardless, I believe the manpower to support any dreadnoughts taken by a White Scars chapter would be on hand from the Adeptus Mechanicus.

Possible Arguments & Answers

Argument: "GW has mentioned before the White Scars don't like dreadnoughts"
Answer: The White Scars change over time. GW has said before the White Scars can't be fielded on foot, but now they can take scouts, terminators, and even devastator and tactical squads, all on foot. "This is the way it's always been done so it must be right because nothing ever changes" arguments don't hold water.

Argument: "White Scars wouldn't use such a slow unit as a dreadnought"
Answer: Dreadnoughts can travel via droppod and thus outpace even the fastest turbo-boosting bike. When they Run! they can potentionally keep pace with a cruising bike or assault squadron.

Argument: "How would the techmarines find the time to service all the bikes AND the dreadnoughts?"
Answer: With the changing tactics the White Scars have shown, now allowing brothers to fight on foot instead of always mounted for instance, the less wear and tear on the transports and bikes should result in more free time for the Adeptus Mechanicus.

Conclusion

I believe more people should field dreadnoughts in their White Scars army. These fallen warriors are among the most versatile units at the space marine's disposal. Able to be outfitted with lascannons and missile launchers for long range tank killing, the "rifleman" autocannon configuration for busting open transports or widdling down elite infantry, the new ironclad dreadnought which is a beast in close combat, or the classic assault cannon and heavy flamer/DCCW for a balanced approach, they make sense from a gaming point of view. Fluff wise, the White Scars are embracing the Codex Astartes more and more and it's logical to include dreadnoughts now and they be a part of the flowing storyline of the chapter so this means they make sense both from a gaming slant as well as a fluff slant.

Can anyone out there relate with this, how White Scars should use dreadnoughts now? Or does anyone have an argument not mentioned to why they should not have dreadnoughts still? What are your thoughts?

"Faith is not worthy of the name until it erupts into action." - Catherine Marshall

I am the primer. I am the hobby knife in the Artist's hand. I am the point of His paint brush and the tip of His sculpting tool. I am the line highlighting around the edges and the 3:1 wash in the recesses.  
   
Made in gb
Journeyman Inquisitor with Visions of the Warp




York/London(for weekends) oh for the glory of the british rail industry

its a bit annoying that GW are changing the fluff of a chapter, if i fielded white scars i would stick to fast troops or those on foot having to take transport.

Relictors: 1500pts


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Made in us
Angry Blood Angel Assault marine




Alvin

I would think you could since White Scars are a current codex chapter and all. I would have to say tho its not very fluffy if you wanted to adhere to there background and all, which was it in 4th edition?(IIRC) that GW gave you a few fluffy "outlines" for codex chapters other the ultramarines with traits? I really liked that wish they had kept it....oh well

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Made in gb
Blood-Drenched Death Company Marine






You could take only venerable dreads so only the best of the were used at the worst of times. In a pod of course!
   
Made in us
Junior Officer with Laspistol





University of St. Andrews

Only arm it with Close Combat weapons (no Rifleman Dreads!) as the warrior inside chose this path in order for him to kill his prey hand to hand?

Not the most fluffy, but it is an arguable case.

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Made in us
RogueSangre






I think it's possible. It's about as fluffy and likely as a Raven Guard Vindicator, but it's possible. What's more, fluff is just what we make it. I like your theory about a White Scars marine being entombed so that he may finish his hunt. that'd be the perfect reason to use if anyone asks why you've got a Dead in your White Scars army.

   
Made in au
Incorporating Wet-Blending






Australia

Calvinus wrote:Argument: "GW has mentioned before the White Scars don't like dreadnoughts"
Answer: The White Scars change over time. GW has said before the White Scars can't be fielded on foot, but now they can take scouts, terminators, and even devastator and tactical squads, all on foot. "This is the way it's always been done so it must be right because nothing ever changes" arguments don't hold water.

Maybe you should think twice before taking fluff advice from Matthew "Bloodfist" Ward.

Argument: "White Scars wouldn't use such a slow unit as a dreadnought"
Answer: Dreadnoughts can travel via droppod and thus outpace even the fastest turbo-boosting bike. When they Run! they can potentionally keep pace with a cruising bike or assault squadron.

No. Being able to deploy quickly once is not an adequate substitute for sustainable speed. Neither is running no faster than a human.

Personally, I'd give him a tracked Rifleman Dreadnought, and use the rules for a Predator.

"When I became a man I put away childish things, including the fear of childishness and the desire to be very grown up."
-C.S. Lewis 
   
Made in us
Stalwart Space Marine





I think you can take them. Just because an army prefers certain tactics doesn't mean that's all they can do. What do White Scars do when enemies are dug into serious fortifications? I'm guessing their attack bikes don't handle too well in bunkers, lol. I can see them using dreadnoughts. They'll just have fewer than other chapters, and they'll be less inclined to wake them up.

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