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I do not understand the harlequeen psycic power form the dark eldar codex. They do not need to take a test to use it? But do they need to use it ecah turn, as it a psycic hood or a rune weapon could shutt it down? I am just uncertain.

It's always on. Think of it as a Psychic ability rather than a power.
And no, you cannot turn it off, or shut it down.

It doesn't really matter...the one you really need to watch out for is Harleking psychic power....

GG

I wish I had a .Gif of a Slow clap; You deserve it GG.

Veil of Tears has a continuous effect, and is never activated, nor does it ever need a psychic test.

Psychic Hoods and Runic Weapons can only be used when the opponent takes a psychic test.

Not quite; only when a model Sucessfully uses a psychic power.

While Veil is a Psychic power the Shadowseer(or his player) never uses it; it is always in effect. The net result is no, Rune weapon/Psychic hood cannot negate it; but i wonder if it is technically "effecting" units that attempt to shoot at them(this would mean that Lady Malys and Kharne could ignore it and I believe that is the requirement for at least 1 of the WH/Sisters abilities to ignore/negate psychic powers)?

From the CSM FAQ:

Q. Does Khârn’s “Blessing of the Blood God” ignore persistent psychic abilities (like Psychic Scream or Veil of Tears)?
A. Yes. The psychic ability still functions, however Khârn simply ignores any and all effects of the ability.

It would be simple consistency to say that Lady Malys (and attached unit) would do the same.

A Daemonhunter inquisitor with a null rod allows himself AND his unit to ignore it (so his retinue of weapon servitors could gun them down at full range and not need to roll for VoT), so I can't see why Malys wouldn't likewise ignore it.

And while the GW FAQ says SoB Shield of Faith won't work that's pretty silly - it certainly both affects and includes the sisters in the area if they have to roll dice or lose their shots.

Spetulhu wrote:And while the GW FAQ says SoB Shield of Faith won't work that's pretty silly - it certainly both affects and includes the sisters in the area if they have to roll dice or lose their shots.

While I agree that the logic presented behind GW's ruling in that FAQ seems flaky (at best), I think the ruling is solid for the simple reason that Veil of Tears is a persistent psychic power that is never 'off'. Therefore if a power were able to nullify Veil of Tears we have no basis of exactly when it would turn back 'on' again.

Yeah you could play that when VoT would prevent a SOB unit from firing you'd get to make the roll to nullify the power at point and a successful roll would result in the power not affecting that one unit...but there's really no basis in the rules to make that assumption.

To follow the rules you'd essentially have to say that one SOB unit passing their roll against VoT would result in the power being nullified, period. And since there are no rules for turning the power back on, it would remain nullified for the entire game.


I think a better way to interpret it is that since the power is persistent (always on) even if it is nullified it immediately turns back 'on' and affects the unit again.

Saying that the SoB squad could shoot in that shooting phase while anyone else still rolls would be pretty fair IMO. Both special rules would work.

Not that it's a big problem anyway, Harlequins are best removed with flamers or "accidental" battle cannon shots. I just wish GW had something as simple as offensive/defensive classifications on those funky powers instead of vague fluff descriptions for us to argue about.

Spetulhu wrote:Saying that the SoB squad could shoot in that shooting phase while anyone else still rolls would be pretty fair IMO. Both special rules would work.

Not that it's a big problem anyway, Harlequins are best removed with flamers or "accidental" battle cannon shots. I just wish GW had something as simple as offensive/defensive classifications on those funky powers instead of vague fluff descriptions for us to argue about.

I totally agree with that! One giant pain with making the INAT FAQ is everytime a new codex comes out trying to figure out which psychic powers can be negated by abilities that 'nullify' powers when the unit is 'affected' by it and which psychic powers are ignored by units that ignore the effects of psychic powers.

I had really hoped with release of the Chaos Daemons codex that GW had learned their lesson, as all the Khorne anti-psychic stuff was simplified down to protecting them ONLY against wounds caused by psychic powers...but then the SW codex comes out and the Wolf Tail Talisman is still in there pretty much the same as it used to be and then the DE codex comes out and there's another 'ignores the effect of psychic power' rule in there as well!

IMHO psychic defensive special rules should only fall into two categories:

1) Those that nullify powers when a psychic test is passed (like Psychic Hoods).
2) Those that give saves against or ignore wounds from psychic powers (like the Khorne stuff in Chaos Daemons).


That's the only way you can definitively know what special rules should affect what powers. This whole 'area of effect' and 'ignore the effects of' are just way too vague.

The most messed up part of this, is that any unit with Lady Malys attached doesn't need to roll to spot the Harlequins.

Dawson_IVC wrote:The most messed up part of this, is that any unit with Lady Malys attached doesn't need to roll to spot the Harlequins.

Well, I can see that both ways... I too personally think it is messed up...But that is simply because it means there are more bullets my Shadow Seer has to dodge.

The way VoT Fluffy Logic works is that the attacking unit simply can not see the squad with the VoT ability if they fail the spotting test. So if there is an IC with them who can see the Harlequins, then the IC can simply point and tell the rest of the troops to fire in that direction.

(hahaha...Fluffy Logic, I just made that up...isn't that kind of an oxymoron sometimes? I mean, this is GW 40k we are talking about here)