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I was just wondering if for the purpose of penatrating a vehicle can a models strength go above 10? like my warboss on the charge he WOULD be strength 11 (with a PK)




thanks

Only stats allowed above 10 are vehicle armor. So no the best your warboss could get is S10.

Attacks can go above 10 as well. I think that is the only thing that can go above 10.

actually, the number of attacks you put down in any given combat can be over 10, but the Attack characteristic on the stat line is still stuck at 10 as the max.

But to the OP, no, you can't do S11 attacks.

Strength maxes out at 10.

Why would strength stop at 10? I mean, realistically, there is no limit to power, is there?

There is, and it is 10.

Commissar Nemesio wrote:Why would strength stop at 10? I mean, realistically, there is no limit to power, is there?

Emphasis mine.

The game is an abstraction, and while you are free and encouraged to play it your own way, one must remember that broadly speaking, the rules of this edition of Warhammer 40,000 are designed to make it fun first, balanced second, and realistic third. Strength stops at ten because the rules say they do.

Hasn't there been discrepency over this issue with vehicle ramming? I mean, the rulebook states (can't quote because my book isn't in front of me) that a vehicle adds +1 for every 3" moved, +1 for tank, +1 for each point of armor over 10. It never mentions "to a maximum of 10." Therefore, it could be taken either way. Most weapons usually say "to a maximum of 10" though, so I feel that for all of those weapons the cap is at 10. Vehicles ramming...maybe not. Again, I recognize that was a thread discussed before, but it was so much slinging back and forth that I never bothered to look at the eventual outcome-there is an argument for both sides of the coin.

timetowaste85 wrote: Therefore, it could be taken either way...

No it really cannot, rams max out at 10 as well. It doesn't say you CAN be greater than 10 and previous rules already say you cannot.

@Calypso2ts: I recognize you can't play the "well, it doesn't say you CAN'T game," I'm just throwing recognition that every other item says there is a cap out at 10 but this one does not-including tyranid guns, dreadnaught CCWs, etc etc. As I said, I can't quote and look things up directly-one of my friends accidentally snagged my rulebook and has yet to give it back. I'm running on memory here, but there was like a 10 page argument on here about that very subject about a year back. I've talked to a bunch of people in my area who all agree it sounds like it can go over 10 and that it makes sense that it can go over 10, but I haven't actually asked a GW rep or anything yet: in my town, I am the 40K expert-the other workers in the store I work at don't know gak about 40k, and I can see both sides of the argument. If I was asked in a tournament that I was running if vehicles could do damage above 10 for ramming, I'd probably flip a coin on it.

timetowaste85 wrote:Hasn't there been discrepency over this issue with vehicle ramming? I mean, the rulebook states (can't quote because my book isn't in front of me) that a vehicle adds +1 for every 3" moved, +1 for tank, +1 for each point of armor over 10. It never mentions "to a maximum of 10." Therefore, it could be taken either way. Most weapons usually say "to a maximum of 10" though, so I feel that for all of those weapons the cap is at 10. Vehicles ramming...maybe not. Again, I recognize that was a thread discussed before, but it was so much slinging back and forth that I never bothered to look at the eventual outcome-there is an argument for both sides of the coin.

The rulebook FAQ does mention that Str of a Ram attack is capped at 10(also there are very few things that can get to 10, let alone above it)

A Battle wagon with a Reinforced ram, Ramming a vehicle exactly 12" away gets base 0+ 4 for Front AV +1 for being a Tank +1 for the Reinforced ram +4 for distance traveled = 0+4+1+1+4=10.

The only thing I can think of off hand is a Dark eldar Ravager with Shock prow and Aethersails Ramming a vehicle 21 or more inches away and rolling a "3" for the Prow: 0+1 for front AV +3 for prow +7 for distance = 0+1+3+7=11(reduced to 10 due to Stat cap).

For reference here is the FAQ quote:
Q: Can a ramming vehicle’s Strength go above 10? (p69)
A: No, only a vehicle’s Armour Value makes exception to
the ‘Maximum 10’ rule for characteristics.

note on the FAQ web-page this question and answer is in Black; that indicates it is an old question kept unchanged(excepting the addition of a rulebook page number to reference where the rules relevant to the question are found) from before the FAQ was updated last.

@Kel: Ok, if it's in the FAQ then no more questions from me: I'll gladly adhere to the FAQ ruling, thanks for clearing that up for me. But if they could go farther than S10, I could get a S15 hit with an eldar tank: ramming specifies the full movement of the turn (that is spelled out very clearly for the full turn), not just how much you move in the moving phase, and star engines let you move a further 12". If you could move the full 36", plus A12, PLUS being a tank, that would put you at a S15 hit-autopenetrating for an Eldar tank. The thought of ramming said tank into a monolith has made me feel evil before...but, alas, if it isn't allowed....I'll live with it. Again, thanks for letting me know that's in the FAQ now

Page 42 Power Fist or Power Claw doubles the users strength up to a maximum of 10.

@ Ailaros Page 37 any bonus attacks are an exception to the rules for characteristics' maximum modifiers. So you can change the characteristic to be > 10. I got to 18 attacks with a TW Lord Warrior Born against a giant IG blob before they broke. Was good times. Off hand though I don't know of anyway to exceed 10 attacks base.

@ Sol: Yeah, you can hypothetically get up to 17 attacks with a Khorne Lord with a Daemon Weapon. Fun times...most I ever got was 16 attacks against a squad of blood and goo-I mean terminators. Hehe...

timetowaste85 wrote:@ Sol: Yeah, you can hypothetically get up to 17 attacks with a Khorne Lord with a Daemon Weapon. Fun times...most I ever got was 16 attacks against a squad of blood and goo-I mean terminators. Hehe...

Yea you need to go solo on a stubborn IG blob with Warrior Born, and then the IG player not kill off the guy that makes them stubborn to get in the 20's I guess. The Space Wolf with Warrior Born is only limited by how much he can kill between assault phases.

timetowaste85 wrote:@Kel: Ok, if it's in the FAQ then no more questions from me: I'll gladly adhere to the FAQ ruling, thanks for clearing that up for me. But if they could go farther than S10, I could get a S15 hit with an eldar tank: ramming specifies the full movement of the turn (that is spelled out very clearly for the full turn), not just how much you move in the moving phase, and star engines let you move a further 12". If you could move the full 36", plus A12, PLUS being a tank, that would put you at a S15 hit-autopenetrating for an Eldar tank. The thought of ramming said tank into a monolith has made me feel evil before...but, alas, if it isn't allowed....I'll live with it. Again, thanks for letting me know that's in the FAQ now

Ramming is only done in the movement phase(that is when you declare a ram; that is when the ram movement is done).

BRB Page 68 under tank shock, second paragraph: "When moving a tank, the player may declare that the vehicle is going to attempt to make a tank shock attack instead of moving normally. This is an exception to the rule that enemy models cannot be moved through."

I Italicized the relevant bit.

BRB Page 69 under Ramming, second paragraph: "Ramming is a special type of tank shock move and is excecuted the same way, except that the tank must always move at the highest speed it is capable of."

The Eldar FAQ has this to say about Star Engines:
"Q. The Star Engines description says the vehicle may
move an extra 12" ‘in lieu of shooting’. Does this
mean that they cannot make this extra move if they
are unable to shoot for other reasons (such as being
shaken). Also, when is this move executed – in the
Movement or the Shooting phase?
A. As long as the vehicle is allowed to move that turn,
and does not shoot or embark/disembark troops, it
may use its Star Engines. This means that it can use
them when shaken, but not whilst stunned. This extra
move of up to 12" is executed during the Shooting
phase."

The last sentence of the answer is the relevant bit to this discussion.

The person that told me it could go above ten stated that "any stat could go above ten if it was temporary"

They are gettign confused with Attacks, whcih is the ONLY stat that can temporarily go above 10

calypso2ts wrote:There is, and it is 10.

That was so well played. Good laugh.

And we all forgot strength D

Juvieus Kaine wrote:And we all forgot strength D

I doubt forgot is the right word. Apocalypse exceptions are rarely brought up regarding anything but Apocalypse queries.

It is also awkward to argue that D > 10.

Greater effect, certainly. It is not an integer regardless.

So would a Shokk Attack Gun that rolled a couple sixes(?) be strength 12 or strenth 10 still? Wondering as my brother recently acquired one.

The rules for the SAG in the Orc codex explain what happens when you roll 11 or 12.

It would technically be S10, as that is the maximum. But, as Veldrain points out, on the result of 11 or 12, the attack is performed in a different manner, using the rules specified in the codex.

Note: On an 11, your attack is said to be S10.

The only way to get above S10 on a hit against a vehicle is to get something along the lines of tank hunter rules which "add 1 to the penetration roll" which just effectively makes your S above 10.

I believe the only guy able to even do something like that anymore is Knight Commander Pask in a Leman Russ Demolisher.

Nenya97 wrote:The only way to get above S10 on a hit against a vehicle is to get something along the lines of tank hunter rules which "add 1 to the penetration roll" which just effectively makes your S above 10.

I believe the only guy able to even do something like that anymore is Knight Commander Pask in a Leman Russ Demolisher.

A tank hunters Black Templar Venerable Dreadnought's DCCW is 10+1 in combat vs. vehicles.

10 is the highest stat you can get unless you are talking about attacks. you can clearly get more then 10 attacks. Just noty more then 10 base.