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I was wondering, as the Black Templar 'dex is a wee bit old now, was wondering if you could use the space puppy codex or even the blood angel list instead.

With some obvious changes. E.g no librarians

Any thoughts?

Of Course you can use them, because they are all space marines, just imagine your Black Templars use a different doctrine, besides they aren't that different at all.

Yea, if you like being spat on...

Kidding, do what you like. Just expect funny looks and to be taunted for not loving your army enough to stick with them through thick and thin.

Just make sure you paint them grey.

The taunting is not exactly fair. The Black Templar book is in really bad shape. When a Xeno army is old, they at least stand a chance and can be fun because they are unique; no other army has the exact same units. But since all the marine codices are just variants on the same army, they suffer a lot when they go obsolete because other marine codices get literally the same unit cheaper or literally a better unit at the same price. Or sometimes even a better unit cheaper. The Grey Knights are the next imperial book, and then there's usually a Xeno codex. That means that the Black Templars are at LEAST a year from a new book, and I'm hoping that my Dark Angels will magically seize that slot (sorry). Given all that, I think that it makes sense to transfer to a newer book if your army can do so, especially if you keep it fluffy to the old codex (ex. no librarians).

Sure you can, but Blood Angels is probably a better book to proxy Templars with.

With that being said, Templars isn't a terrible book. It suffers from missing the "RAR everything CHEAPER" codex writing of the last couple years though.

They certainly have some nice advantages:

- Take a Marshall and your entire army is LD10
- Fastest foot marines in the game
- Preferred enemy army wide
- 5 iniatives can have a special and a heavy weapon, plasma and lascannons are cheaper
- Cheap extra armor
- Better Smoke Launchers
- Cheap Venerable Dreads
- 2 Assault Cannons in 5 Termi squad + Tank hunters
- Preferred enemy furious charge Lightning Claw terminators is just nasty
- 3 Special weapons in a 3 man bike squad
- Ability to take Meltabombs on assault marines

It also has it's downsides, but I think the book is still plenty viable.

While I do believe that the Wolf Guard rules would fit well in Crusading Templar types joining units of knights, the book is still viable.

Hmm, maybe I underestimated C:BT. I was looking at it for a while, but decided that I didn't want to go there given my frustrations with Codex: Dark Angels. Still, Space Wolves have an all-around better codex, as do the Blood Angels.
Edit: Fixed an Emoticon error that came from abbreviating Codex: Dark Angels.

I hate to be 'that guy' for once, but if you want to play Black Templar, use Codex: Black Templar. If you want to use Codex: Space Wolves, play Space Wolves.

the Codex' show alot of character in the play style of the army, you would be hurting yourself more and look funny to both BT and SW players and a few others on top.

Granted it is your army and your choice, but Gee-Wiz, you assumed due to age the BT codex is weak. The BT have withstood as a solid army for a long time, true, we do not have all the toys or best prices, but we make due and look good doing it.

All i say is give the Men in Black a chance before counting chickens.

To be honest if you're looking to proxy to another Codex for your Black Templars, you're almost better off just writing up a Fandex to be used until the new C: BT is released.

I mean either way you have to get your opponents permission to use the new rules. Since BT don't have a Wolf Guard or TWC, so you'd have to modify the rules anyhow.

Why not just go the extra mile and write them a good fan based version.? (That isn't grossly OP, I mean lets be sportsman like still.)

Anywho, just my two cents.

Cheers!

Fexor wrote:To be honest if you're looking to proxy to another Codex for your Black Templars, you're almost better off just writing up a Fandex to be used until the new C: BT is released.

I mean either way you have to get your opponents permission to use the new rules. Since BT don't have a Wolf Guard or TWC, so you'd have to modify the rules anyhow.

Why not just go the extra mile and write them a good fan based version.? (That isn't grossly OP, I mean lets be sportsman like still.)

Anywho, just my two cents.

Cheers!

That's not really true per the rules in the codex. Generally speaking, he can call his Space Wolves army whatever he wants, as long as he uses all the rules from the space wolf codex and supplies correct models, then its legal. Using a Sword Brethren model to be a Wolf Guard is technically not correct, but is a very reasonable counts as. Same with a Marshall instead of a Wolf Lord.

Now if he stars having Black Templars thunderwolf cavalry and Black Templars Rune Priests... well, he is just being a tool. But if he stays true to fluff, you have to be kind of a jerk to not let him "counts as" another marine chapter, especially since BT languish in 4th edition hell.

All that being said, I think the BT Codex has a certain charm about it and would suggest sticking it out with it. But since I neglect my own Dark Angels codex and play with the 5th edition Space Marine codex, I am sorta being a hypocrite when I do.

Retracted, re-read post. My post was incorrect. >_< Chalk this up to a post count now. Fudge bunnies.

All he did was ask if he could use the SW or BA codex for his Black Templar army, he didn't say anything about mixing rules or taking point costs or anything of the sort. I don't understand where you got that impression from.

The c:bt has been FAQed i isnt that bad nowadays

Even if they have been faqed DA and BT are still very difficult to play.... and they have only one viable competitive build...
(Cyclone ML spam deathwing is gonna become very popular!!!)
Since the rules tell you that you have to pick your army list from a codex, there is nothing forbidding you to use SW rules to represent the BTs!
If you make everything WYSIWYG nobody can say you anything!
My advice is to avoid non fluffy units ... Your BT should be BTs!!
a LOT of people will tell you that you are a WAC since SW are horribly broken, but I'd prefer to use a broken codex that using a totally out of sync one....
I think Wolf Guard has perfect rules for showing the sword brethren and that lone wolves are nice "lonely crusaders" willing to die to expiate their sins...
Sagas are perfect to show some particular fanatism of your commanders...
Bloodclaws and swiftclaws are a little problematic... they're the SW equivalent of scouts but BT are organized differently...I'd avoid them
Avoid the Thunderwolves, the scouts (since BT do not have scout units) and the libbies...

punkow wrote:Even if they have been faqed DA and BT are still very difficult to play.... and they have only one viable competitive build...
(Cyclone ML spam deathwing is gonna become very popular!!!)
Since the rules tell you that you have to pick your army list from a codex, there is nothing forbidding you to use SW rules to represent the BTs!
If you make everything WYSIWYG nobody can say you anything!
My advice is to avoid non fluffy units ... Your BT should be BTs!!
a LOT of people will tell you that you are a WAC since SW are horribly broken, but I'd prefer to use a broken codex that using a totally out of sync one....
I think Wolf Guard has perfect rules for showing the sword brethren and that lone wolves are nice "lonely crusaders" willing to die to expiate their sins...
Sagas are perfect to show some particular fanatism of your commanders...
Bloodclaws and swiftclaws are a little problematic... they're the SW equivalent of scouts but BT are organized differently...I'd avoid them
Avoid the Thunderwolves, the scouts (since BT do not have scout units) and the libbies...

I you scroll up you see that i already posted a positive reaction to using another marine codex as black templars....

yeah... I know... probably the OP wants to hear more than one single opinion... I agree with you.. just wanted to reinforce this opinion...
About the Faqed dex, I do not agree... even if it is now more competitive, remains the fact that the dex is totally "out of sync" and that can be very annoying...
BT dex and DA dex were bad and they remain bad in my opinion... I do not look only at the "competitiveness" but also to other stuff such: is it in line with the other codices? Can you make at least 2 or 3 different builds using it?...
But I think I'm going a little off topic...
I agree with you Tmonster: there is no problem in using a different dex for your army as long as you have nice and representative minis!!!