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So I'm back with more questions! This time more specific. I mainly want to know the differences between Blood Claws and Grey Hunters. I have a basic idea of the differences but not in their situational use, and the pros and cons of using them in different roles.

Another thing I was wondering real quick is which units I should shove in the battleforce Drop Pod. Or if I should put 5 termie Wolf Guard in one and have them and scouts reek havoc from behind while the rest of my force attack from the front? Or the same with a dreadnought inside?

Any help on these questions or similar topics would be awesome since I'm starting to build my army list so I can buy the first 1000 points or so in about 2 weeks.

Edit: Another thing I'm not sure about is which HQ to use for the small army. I'm leaning towards a Rune Priest but would love opinions on that or other options.

Pick a theme, and write up a few lists to be critiqued for your army before you go nuts buying models. You'll save money that way. Trust me.

Grey Hunters are your bread and butter troops choice here. They're decent in assault, decent in shooting, and decent in cost. When given the right support from other elements in your army, there is little the can't take on.

Blood Claws are how Space Wolves play the numbers game. As a "Troops" unit, they pale in comparison to Grey Hunters. You have to play them more aggressively (meaning they aren't quite as good just being parked on an objective), and the require some specific support to be best used. They're best played getting the charge in CC, or, if being charged, as a tar pit unit to slow down enemy Deathstars and the like. They're shooting isn't great, and there's little you can do to fix that. Put them with a Wolf Priest, put them in a Land Raider Crusader , and you'll have a huge amount of attacks that'll put a dent in any enemy infantry force. I typically add Ragnar to the group to make them even more lethal.

As to your other questions.

I'd only put Wolf Guard Terminators in the Drop Pod if you can give them some good shooting options, (load up on combi-weapons, and take a Cyclone Missile Launcher) and some storm shields. When they come down, they can't assault for a turn. That means they have to make enough of a dent in their immediate area to be able to survive into the next turn. I find a MM dreadnought is a nice, cheap option to stuff in a drop pod. They have a good enough chance of making an impact on they turn they deepstrike to make a difference.

It's hard to wrong with a Rune Priest as your HQ, so long as you can keep them protected. They offer some of the best psychic defense in the game, and have strong powers, as well. They're fragile, though. A Wolf Priest is pretty much a necessity if you plan on taking Blood Claws, like I said.

So I guess hold of on blood claws until I get my army a bit bigger than 1500? Also I'm not sure if I should do named characters right away, is the extra points cost lost for more units equal to the usefulness?

Also what should go in the drop pod?

Edit: I do intend to make the list first before buying. These questions are for before I make the list.

Unless you want a Deathstar unit running around, try to refrain from kitting out any particular character or one unit. As the points rise higher, ask yourself: What's the survivability of this squad? Generally each squad (not trooper) should be able to completely make their points back by killing something of equal value before they die. Ideally they should kill more than their point's worth for them to be "effective".

Since blood claws will charge straight into the enemy, I suggest either you bring alot of them, or none at all. Take them with a Wolf Guard, as that way you'll get your shooting before you charge something.

As for the Drop Pod, I second the Wolf Guard or Dreadnought suggestion Endova put forth. Terminators are the best since they can drop and still fire their heavy weapons. A Dreadnought fires less weapons, but is alot cheaper than 5 Wolf Guard Terminators and will rip tanks to shreds.

MechaEmperor7000 wrote:Since blood claws will charge straight into the enemy, I suggest either you bring alot of them, or none at all. Take them with a Wolf Guard, as that way you'll get your shooting before you charge something.

Or better yet, a Wolf Preist, which ensures the unit will get to fire, and makes the multitudes of attacks they get more accurate, and thus, more deadly.

As for the Drop Pod, I second the Wolf Guard or Dreadnought suggestion Endova put forth. Terminators are the best since they can drop and still fire their heavy weapons. A Dreadnought fires less weapons, but is alot cheaper than 5 Wolf Guard Terminators and will rip tanks to shreds.

Thanks for the support, Mecha. I like the Wolf Guard dropping in, but I like the Dreadnought better in this scenario. If you've only got one pod dropping in, and nothing else supporting it, it's going to take a crippling amount of fire as soon as the enemy is able to. Better that the target of that barrage is a cheap unit that, to use the antiquated term, can make it's points back before it's destroyed. Terminators are much more expensive, and even more so if you want to kit them out for maximum survivability.

You're getting some very sound advice from the gentles above me, so props to them above all else. Thought I'd chip in with what I can.

Blood Claws are more a specialty unit than a troops choice, regardless of what they actually count as. In this edition, you really need to pump alot of points into the unit to make it worth taking, at least in my experience. Pushing the unit up to a full-assault size (14 models), giving them a Land Raider Crusader for transport, and a Wolf Priest, you're already over 500pts for the unit without taking any wargear options, and without Ragnar, who does add some real punch to the squad (Ragnar pumps it up to 700). You're always going to want the Wolf Priest, as it allows you to shoot before you charge, and the transport as well, to get your men across the field (The Crusader is a particularly good choice in this case because it has the largest transport capacity, allowing you to take a nearly full squad of Blood Claws. If you're not fielding Ragnar, you can take a full squad of 15.) At 1000pts, this is way too much to be spending on a single unit, as you're basically putting all your eggs in one basket, and the opponent is sure to be fielding enough anti-vehicle firepower to take a land raider out before it reaches them if it's the only armor on the field.

The Grey Hunters are your go-to troops. You'll always be taking these guys, because they aren't effected by some of the weaknesses that plague the Blood Claws (The Headstrong rule can pull your Blood Claws off an objective right at the end of a game. I've seen it happen. Even just pulling them into a charge you don't want them to isn't a good thing, one of the perils of Blood Claws), have better stats, and very cheap and easy access to your special weapons (Melta/Plasma/Flamers), for 3pts more a model. They're pretty much a standard Tactical Space Marine squad, modified to fit the Space Wolves. They fulfill a variety of roles, based on what you need them to do at the time, decent in attack, shooting, and can even take a charge if they absolutely have to.

I also would suggest placing a dreadnought in the drop pod, kitted out with a multi-melta, and pop the most nasty tank you have access to side-armor/rear armor for, although with the multi-melta, front armor isn't so much of an obstacle. I find Leman Russ are a good choice, especially if they took plasma sponsons....*shudders*. Alternatively, although this isn't so much an option at low points cost games, a squad of long fangs with multi-meltas in a drop pod can be devestating with the MEQ heavy game we play today. Splitting fire, 5 multi-meltas is likely to waste the two tanks it fires at, earning back it's points and then some. However, it is a strategy with risk, as it does rely on them destroying the tanks for the strategy to pay off, although even a crew stunned/shaken result may save some of your forces for that turn...I've seen it done well and poorly, I end up somewhere in the middle most times.

For named characters, at least with a Space Wolves force, you're unlikely to field them in games any lower than 1500, probably any lower than 1750. They're powerful units, pretty much every single one of them, but they do cost substantial amounts, and again, you're putting too many points into a model that can be brought down by a few poor rolls. The Rune Priest is a very powerful HQ at 1000pts, and should certainly be looked into. Keeping him protected generally isn't too hard, run him in a Rhino with a Grey Hunter squad, and use your one shot per turn out of the top firing point to pop out and unleash hell. He will get targeted fairly quickly though, especially if you've taken powers like Living Lightning, Murderous Hurricane or Jaws of the World Wolf, so don't rely too much on his squad to get tactical objectives done.

Apart from that, I recommend checking out a few of the standard 1000pt lists floating around for the Space Wolves so you know what 'the internets' recommends you take at lower points (Although it's not always the best choice to follow the internets guidance), and certainly build a few lists and have a friend or two look them over, or even those in Army Lists at Dakka (Although some can be rather brutal at times), before you go buying models, you'll save quite a bit if you cut down on surplus models that you'll never field. I've found it's best to build to a certain point as you're learning an army, and have a workable army list, and then build another 500pts, or 250pts, or however much you wish to, after you've looked at the units you added to the list with the last 'expansion', and how they added to your list, and how they performed. Again, attempts to keep your purchased models that you'll never field down, helps you work out what your army is weak against and how you might try and counter that, as well as keeping you from getting swamped in undone painting etc.

Hopefully, you've taken something away from this, and I haven't shown too much of how bad I really am at this game .

VenerableBrotherPelinore wrote:

Alternatively, although this isn't so much an option at low points cost games, a squad of long fangs with multi-meltas in a drop pod can be devestating with the MEQ heavy game we play today. Splitting fire, 5 multi-meltas is likely to waste the two tanks it fires at, earning back it's points and then some. However, it is a strategy with risk, as it does rely on them destroying the tanks for the strategy to pay off, although even a crew stunned/shaken result may save some of your forces for that turn...I've seen it done well and poorly, I end up somewhere in the middle most times.

I just wanted to touch on this point very briefly. Remember that this strategy cannot be used without Logan Grimmnar in the squad. You need him to give the Long Fangs "Relentless" on the turn they deepstrike in, or else they will be unable to shoot their heavy weapons. I'm sure you know that, but I don't see it mentioned in your post. Given the insightful things you go on to say about Named Characters in low point games, I thought it might be important to point this out to a fledgling SW player (the OP) who might consider the above strategy.

I guess I would just have one of my rhino'd Grey hunter packs have 9 units and stick the rune priest with them. Then when I get the termie wolf guard for the bigger army move the rune priest to them. Also it seems like I should save the blood claws for a bigger army.

Try going for a min squad of 5 Hunters in a Razorback. Very effective for what you pay for.

Commander Endova wrote:

I just wanted to touch on this point very briefly. Remember that this strategy cannot be used without Logan Grimmnar in the squad. You need him to give the Long Fangs "Relentless" on the turn they deepstrike in, or else they will be unable to shoot their heavy weapons. I'm sure you know that, but I don't see it mentioned in your post. Given the insightful things you go on to say about Named Characters in low point games, I thought it might be important to point this out to a fledgling SW player (the OP) who might consider the above strategy.

Ahh yes, it does appear I forgot to mention that, my apologies. I'd like to blame it on attempting to think strategy at the wee hours of the morning .

You are of course, correct.

MechaEmperor7000 wrote:Try going for a min squad of 5 Hunters in a Razorback. Very effective for what you pay for.

And put the rune priest with them? Although the Razorback has no top shooting point, so the priest can't pop out and blow people up in transit. Though then I can use the parts from the leftover 5 hunters and combine them with devastators to get my long fangs.

well I meant them as MSUs, not as a retinue for your Runepriest ^^;

Ah, should I be breaking them up into smaller units? If so why? The obvious would be as a way for the rune priest to have transport and some protection. Though I plan on putting the rune priest with termie wolf guard when the army grows.

The issues I have with having more transports because of smaller units is the cost of getting more razorbacks and carrying said razorbacks. (I guess the points cost figures into it as well) That's why I want to make sure it's worth it.

I'm not entirely sure how I will store my army in total. I've been looking at battlefoam for maybe one of their full packages or just getting the GW stuff and using the GW sized foams from battlefoam.

The reason alot of players, including myself in certain lists, take multiple small units of Grey Hunters in Razorbacks has very little to do with the Rune-priest.

Taking a small unit of Grey Hunters with a Melta, and giving them a fairly standard Lascannon/Plasma Razorback will cost just over 150pts. This gives you a anti-vehicle gun platform that also doubles as a transport, as well as a troops choice with a melta. Terrific for the points you pay.

You can also switch the Razorback for a Twin-Linked Lascannon loadout/Heavy-Flamer loadout, and some even swear by the Twin-Linked Assault-Cannon, depending on what other forces you're fielding.

A Wolf Guard in power armor also can make an excellent sergeant for a squad of grey hunters, coming out at 3 points above the price of another grey hunter, and giving you access to the Wolf Guard wargear for that unit.

Edit: Edited out my nonsense tired rambling about Wolf Guard. Really need to stop posting tactical advice while tired.