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As some of you know, or may not know, Catalyst Game Labs is/was working on a game called Leviathans. its a early 1900 style game with flying ships. Similar to Dystopian Wars, but it seems a bit less fantasy/steam punk.

It was Origionally slated for summer 2010 release. Anyone heard anything about its current state?

Seems they're continuing to "reorganize and refocus". They've not given a new date.

I know they're still running demos with paper-cutouts at various cons instead, and haven't previewed any real models yet.

Saw a demo running at GenCon 2010 with cardboard boxes for the minis.

This link...

http://monstersinthesky.com/2009/08/18/leviathans-at-gen-con-game-fair-2009/

...is the only place Ive found a pic of a ship mini for Leviathans. Its a prototype in clear plastic, about 1/3 down the page. Article says its a British battleship, about 5 inches long, the size they want to use in the box game.


I was jsut wondering if anyone had any better info than Ive been able to drag up. Bascially same as Sarge posted.

Want the real skinny? Go on the Battletech Forums and ask Worktroll about it. I think he designed the game.

I have been making for this game for more than a year. Until the game is released with the pre-painted minis, I have no desire to hear about it.

wildger wrote:I have been making for this game for more than a year. Until the game is released with the pre-painted minis, I have no desire to hear about it.

I could live without prepaints.

Pre paints would put me off it...

Captain Jack wrote:Pre paints would put me off it...

Just out of curiosity, why would it? You can always repaint them yourself; I have done just that with some of my Axis & Allies War at Sea minis.

Pre paints put me off for a couple of reasons, firstly because of the costs involved the minis are often made from lower grade plastic or vinyl which makes stripping and getting a long lasting paint job difficult. The AT-43 stuff is an example, though I'm not stating this is the way Catalyst will go. Secondly, it's a pain to get a brand spanking new mini, then get to work stripping before the delights of getting busy with glue and brushes (I hate painting over old paint as detail is lost). Thirdly, most pre paints are fairly rubbish, just about making the lower end of TT standard IMO, again have a look at Heroklix and you will see what I mean.

I agree that, for some, pre paints are a godsend and it gets you into the game quicker. I am however one of those people who would rather have a unique Navy than one the same as everyone else (thumbs nose in the general direction of the riff-raff ).

Fair enough, although with the few W@S minis I've re-painted, I've been able to prime over the stock paint job without any difficulty.

I like the Dystopian Wars rules, but hate the models/aesthetic (that is not steampunk, thats some sort of bastard dieselpunk if anything). I love the Leviathans models/aesthetic, but hate the rules (hex movement, based off Battletech from what I understand). Ah well...

You know what really sucks though? I started designing a ruleset of my own like 6 years ago for this exact setting, with an epic background, etc. Something truly unique... and have been been beaten to the punch... still nowhere near done, and probably won't finish. No matter what I do, I'll be seen as just another airship combat game now, yet another guy trying to cash in on the steampunk craze... le sigh.

chaos0xomega wrote:I like the Dystopian Wars rules, but hate the models/aesthetic (that is not steampunk, thats some sort of bastard dieselpunk if anything). I love the Leviathans models/aesthetic, but hate the rules (hex movement, based off Battletech from what I understand). Ah well...

You know what really sucks though? I started designing a ruleset of my own like 6 years ago for this exact setting, with an epic background, etc. Something truly unique... and have been been beaten to the punch... still nowhere near done, and probably won't finish. No matter what I do, I'll be seen as just another airship combat game now, yet another guy trying to cash in on the steampunk craze... le sigh.

Yeah, I think there is something to be said in this case for being first to market. I also see what you are saying about some of the DW models not being strictly "steam punk," although that is an extremely subjective thing. For example, to my eye the Prussian surface ships in particular look too "modern" for the age of steam to me, like something out of WW II. I still think they look great, just a little out of place next to the FSA paddle boats and Britannian pre-Dreadnought designs. And, once they come out, you could always proxy a DW fleet with the Leviathan models if you want .

I wouldn't give up on your rules project, though! If anything, I think you might have a more ready audience to play them once you get them done, as DW seems to have struck a nerve with a lot of people and brought many newcomers into the naval gaming genre. I think that this particular brand of miniatures gaming sees so few releases that any "new thing" is hailed with excitement.

Captain Jack wrote:Pre paints put me off for a couple of reasons, firstly because of the costs involved the minis are often made from lower grade plastic or vinyl which makes stripping and getting a long lasting paint job difficult. The AT-43 stuff is an example, though I'm not stating this is the way Catalyst will go. Secondly, it's a pain to get a brand spanking new mini, then get to work stripping before the delights of getting busy with glue and brushes (I hate painting over old paint as detail is lost). Thirdly, most pre paints are fairly rubbish, just about making the lower end of TT standard IMO, again have a look at Heroklix and you will see what I mean.

I agree that, for some, pre paints are a godsend and it gets you into the game quicker. I am however one of those people who would rather have a unique Navy than one the same as everyone else (thumbs nose in the general direction of the riff-raff ).

I wouldnt worry about the type of plastic. Catalyst has made a point of stating they want only high impact plastic. That means they will be very hard and hold detail well, not soft and bendy like some others have been. I do believe they said the prepaints would be fairly basic and light, easy to add details or just paint over. So stripping may not be an issue, just a light prime and then paint it.

The company has already determined the minis to be pre-painted. So, there is no point arguing. If you don't like it, like Capt. Jack, turn away and go for another game.

wildger wrote:The company has already determined the minis to be pre-painted. So, there is no point arguing. If you don't like it, like Capt. Jack, turn away and go for another game.

Woah there boy, its a discussion not a mud slinging match. If you don't like my PoV there is no need to be up yourself about it. Like I said I we don't know what the final product is going to be like, despite the claims by catalyst.

I'm quite happy to wait and see, despite my views on pre paint. Don't jump to conclusions.

I have a similar aversion to pre-painted minis as well. I got into this hobby to have a hobby and I like that with Warmachine and 40K I'm involved with the models just as much at home as I am with my friends at the gamestore. I played HeroClix, HorrorClix, Monsterpocalypse and Star Wars Minis - and, in each case the mini's go into a box and get forgotten until it's time to play with them again. And, if the game dies its hard to re-purpose the mini's for something else. I know some AT-43 players who converted their UNA and Red Block armies into Imperial Guard. I've used HorrorClix as DnD mini's. My MonPoc figs will probably get used in an RPG or some sort. But, I have no idea what I'm going to do with a Leviathan. And, if it's that rubbery low-detail plastic then re-painting them won't be an option. I was once excited for the game, but now it's a wait-and-see. If the game itself is exceptionally fun then I'll get into it.

tinman_xl wrote: And, if the game dies its hard to re-purpose the mini's for something else.

You have a point there...that is one of the good things about the A&A CMGs, the minis can easily be used with any one of a number of historical rule sets.

Ruckdog wrote:

tinman_xl wrote: And, if the game dies its hard to re-purpose the mini's for something else.

You have a point there...that is one of the good things about the A&A CMGs, the minis can easily be used with any one of a number of historical rule sets.

Well, don't know what scale the minis are in, but stylistically they are pretty close to what I was going for. If they are 1/2400, then you're set for an easy transition to my ruleset, if and when that sees a release.

tinman_xl wrote:I have a similar aversion to pre-painted minis as well. I got into this hobby to have a hobby and I like that with Warmachine and 40K I'm involved with the models just as much at home as I am with my friends at the gamestore. I played HeroClix, HorrorClix, Monsterpocalypse and Star Wars Minis - and, in each case the mini's go into a box and get forgotten until it's time to play with them again. And, if the game dies its hard to re-purpose the mini's for something else. I know some AT-43 players who converted their UNA and Red Block armies into Imperial Guard. I've used HorrorClix as DnD mini's. My MonPoc figs will probably get used in an RPG or some sort. But, I have no idea what I'm going to do with a Leviathan. And, if it's that rubbery low-detail plastic then re-painting them won't be an option. I was once excited for the game, but now it's a wait-and-see. If the game itself is exceptionally fun then I'll get into it.

I just bought a bunch of Tacarms and Kolossus boxes on clearance off ebay. Some of them as cheap as $5 a box, brand new.


Back on subject...you could use the Leviathan minis with the Full Thrust rules. Its been mentioned before in this thread the plastic will be high impact plastic...very hard and stable. Catalyst has stated that was a must.

chaos0xomega wrote:Well, don't know what scale the minis are in, but stylistically they are pretty close to what I was going for. If they are 1/2400, then you're set for an easy transition to my ruleset, if and when that sees a release.

Leviathans are set at 1/1200-1250. All major manufacturers, like Navis/Neptune, of 1/1250 ships are pre-painted. Leviathans minis are going to be "lightly" painted. So the quality and painting scheme will not be better, if not worse than these major companies. There will not be any weathering or any fantasy scheme. If you have not seen anyone of the ships from Navis/Neptune, check their website to take a look. If you don't like it, then Leviathan minis are not for you.

wildger wrote:

chaos0xomega wrote:Well, don't know what scale the minis are in, but stylistically they are pretty close to what I was going for. If they are 1/2400, then you're set for an easy transition to my ruleset, if and when that sees a release.

Leviathans are set at 1/1200-1250. All major manufacturers, like Navis/Neptune, of 1/1250 ships are pre-painted. Leviathans minis are going to be "lightly" painted. So the quality and painting scheme will not be better, if not worse than these major companies. There will not be any weathering or any fantasy scheme. If you have not seen anyone of the ships from Navis/Neptune, check their website to take a look. If you don't like it, then Leviathan minis are not for you.

Not being so uptight, and also posting a link would be nice

Hate blue text, my eyes need to pass armour saves to read this.

Heres an update with pics of the first pre-production test shots from the molds...they look good...


http://monstersinthesky.com/

I really like that test shot (waits patiently for wildger to say something inane to ruin the moment), and given that the ships in general are going to be relatively similar I am getting good vibes. I want to get my hands on the Lieutenants manual at the beginning of May so that I can have a better look at the rules. I must also remind myself to look up the feedback that Catylist has recieved. Also sorry about the blue text, I find wildger's attitude is somewhat less than desirable.

I agree, that is a pretty good looking model! It nicely captures the spirit of late Victorian/WWI era naval design. I'd be interested to see a painted example; it is a little hard to see the details in the shiny plastic.

I cant wait to see more. Im sure Ill pick up the main game box when it comes out. Anyone have any idea when that might be? I havent been able to locate a good date.


Even if I dont like the rules, the minis will make a nice twist for Full Thrust.