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I understand this is not a new question. But I A) Already assembled them, B) Tried the search box but nothing like this came up, and C) Already assembled them.


Anyway, I want to give them a fair trial.

PLUSSES

Point - Maneuverability is very important with DC. And maneuverability + FNP can only be a good thing.

Counterpoint - There is this thing called a rhino.

Point - Easy Lemartes.

Counterpoint - This is not a big point.

Point - With a large unit, and Lemmy or a regular chaplain, and maybe a libby, these FNP psychopaths start to look pretty scary.

Counterpoint - With a large unit, these FNP psychopaths start to look pretty expensive.


MINUSES

Point - EXPENSIVE.

Counterpoint - Yes. But they are still pretty good at what they do, and there is always a price to pay for mobility.

Point - Rage. No control. To a crafty opponent, they would be playthings.

Counterpoint - However, with DOA, you get them pretty accurately near the enemy, where you don't particularly mind that they are rolling up the line.

Point - You could just put them in rhinos or even land raiders (that - sounds pretty cool. 16 DC in a Crusader.)

Counterpoint - Rhinos are flimsy, and LRs are expensive themselves. (Howabout that previous thing? Like, Astorath with a few JP DC, and the rest in Land Raiders? Sounds awesome to me.)






Comments? Additions? Critiques? ANY HOPE?

Storm Raven, or just run them behind something really big like a Land Raider... My DC are ancient models that I am slowly magnetizing to allow me to swap out the jump packs, but I've run them to good effect in the Raven, as a fast flanker behind another big scary target (LR), or as my Vanguard Vets to distinguish them from my other Fleshtearer Assault Marines :-)

Just to make a quick note, jump pack marines are D6" faster per turn than when they're in a rhino. The only way to make non-pack DC as fast as pack-DC is with a land raider, but even then, that's only on they assault, or the storm raven, which allows you to go 33% faster and have a dreadnought assault with you.

Either way, when you talk about the expense of jump packs, you have to compare the expense of pack-DC to DC that are just as mobile, not an option that is cheaper, but also much worse.

12 DC + a DC Dreadnought in a Stormraven would be pretty brutal. Especially as the TL-MM from the Stormraven would slag the transport allowing the DC and/or Dread to assault the contents.

L. Wrex

Lycaeus Wrex wrote:12 DC + a DC Dreadnought in a Stormraven would be pretty brutal. Especially as the TL-MM from the Stormraven would slag the transport allowing the DC and/or Dread to assault the contents.

L. Wrex

Brutal yes, but it would have to be at the gazillion points invested in that trifecta.

I personally dislike jump pack DC simply because of Rage--but that's enough of a deal breaker for me not to take them.

A good opponent can simply channel them into areas where they're useless.

sourclams wrote:

Lycaeus Wrex wrote:12 DC + a DC Dreadnought in a Stormraven would be pretty brutal. Especially as the TL-MM from the Stormraven would slag the transport allowing the DC and/or Dread to assault the contents.

L. Wrex

Brutal yes, but it would have to be at the gazillion points invested in that trifecta.

I personally dislike jump pack DC simply because of Rage--but that's enough of a deal breaker for me not to take them.

A good opponent can simply channel them into areas where they're useless.

Agreed, and barring Storm Raven support, they still have the weakness of being Marines on the table versus the safety of a transport. This alone should be reason not to field them:

Ohhh....

That's pretty!

Lycaeus Wrex wrote:12 DC + a DC Dreadnought in a Stormraven would be pretty brutal. Especially as the TL-MM from the Stormraven would slag the transport allowing the DC and/or Dread to assault the contents.

L. Wrex

How many points is that little nugget of goodness.

Plus, seriously, 2" spacing people. You move up to 18" per turn and ignore intervening terrain. Plus, you have the rest of your list.

Executioners should not be a serious threat.

If you're playing the Rage rule properly, you do not have that degree of freedom with your models. And I think you meant executioners...

I have ran DC quite a bit and in isolation by themselves they get lead around by their noses. However when the rest of the army is still alive and working with them DC are great performers. a small 5-8 man unit with a chappy or reclusiarch will kill much more expensive units on the charge.

Rage management is not that difficult. If I recall the USR correctly it states closest visible enemy. Rhinos, LR, Razors, Preds can all be used to restrict the LOS for a small unit of DC.

Also DC are a great psychological weapon against anyone who has seen 300 or so points of DC easily murder their 800 point deathstar.

I think they are pretty worth it.

Ailaros wrote:Just to make a quick note, jump pack marines are D6" faster per turn than when they're in a rhino.

Blood Angels have Fast Rhinos, so actually the Jump Pack DC are 0-5" slower, per turn, assuming they run every turn.

Don't forget lash, it puts them in a small circle for defiler death. In general they are a bit safer in a transport but the use of jump packs cannot be ignored.

MinMax wrote:

Ailaros wrote:Just to make a quick note, jump pack marines are D6" faster per turn than when they're in a rhino.

Blood Angels have Fast Rhinos, so actually the Jump Pack DC are 0-5" slower, per turn, assuming they run every turn.

Oh, I forgot, blood angel vehicles are fueled by cheese.

Lol@Ailaros.

I have used them to decent effect but they never seem to make their points back. The best thing they do for you is unlocking DC dreads. Fleet blood talons that ignore shaken and stunned results put the fear of Bloody blood blood into your opponent. They just need to be corralled to your enemy properly. They are awesome vs Orks.