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Hello, I have stumbled across two issues that I am confused about.

The first I think is more straightforward. Can I embark/disembark from a Valkyrie/Vendetta when I am 2 inches from the front or side of the base even though the only access point is in the rear of the model? The example in the IG FAQ seems to suggest you can.

The second question is less straightforward in my opinion. The issue is with the hull footprint of the Valkyrie/Vendetta. The rulebook states that no two models can ever occupy the same space on the table (or even move through the same space) and that one should use the hull or base to determine this. The IG FAQ states that hull should be used for everything except embarking/disembarking and objective taking/contesting. Does this mean that other models need to move around the footprint of the hull when moving? This also make disembarking interesting. Do I have to disembark so that none of the disembarking models are occupying or move through the same space as the Valkyrie/Vendetta? Is this a rule that just gets effectively ignored in this situation? Is there a rule that I'm missing?

Thanks

cross wrote:Hello, I have stumbled across two issues that I am confused about.

The first I think is more straightforward. Can I embark/disembark from a Valkyrie/Vendetta when I am 2 inches from the front or side of the base even though the only access point is in the rear of the model? The example in the IG FAQ seems to suggest you can.

Q. How do you treat the Valkyrie base for gaming? Due to its height it seems that it is impossible for a Valkyrie to contest an objective, or for troops to disembark/embark normally.

A. Follow the rules in Measuring Distances in the Skimmers section in the Warhammer 40,000 rulebook with the following exception: For the purposes of contesting objectives and
embarking/disembarking from a Valkyrie or Vendetta, measure to and from the model’s base. For example, models wishing to embark within a Valkyrie can do so if at the end of their
movement, all models within the unit are within 2" of the Valkyrie’s base.


you should be able to deploy anywhere around its base

The second question is less straightforward in my opinion. The issue is with the hull footprint of the Valkyrie/Vendetta. The rulebook states that no two models can ever occupy the same space on the table (or even move through the same space) and that one should use the hull or base to determine this. The IG FAQ states that hull should be used for everything except embarking/disembarking and objective taking/contesting. Does this mean that other models need to move around the footprint of the hull when moving? This also make disembarking interesting. Do I have to disembark so that none of the disembarking models are occupying or move through the same space as the Valkyrie/Vendetta? Is this a rule that just gets effectively ignored in this situation? Is there a rule that I'm missing?

Thanks

Is the model actually physically floating up where the model is on top of its base? if not then they are not occupying the same space.

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/content/article.jsp?catId=cat440130a&categoryId=600005§ion=&pIndex=1&aId=3400019&start=2

1. The FAQ specifically allows models to embark & disembark anywhere within 2" of the Valk's base, not just within 2" of the hatch.

2. 40k is not a two-dimensional game. It's 3-dimensional, although that only becomes obvious in few places (true LOS & the rules for ruins, for two examples). It is legal for models to move under the Valk's wings, etc, although you're left with an unanswered question about what to do with them if the Valk is Immobilized while they're under there and they no longer fit once you put it down on the table. I think the most common practice is just to shuffle them aside the minimum possible distance.

I am fairly certain that the ruleing for occupying the same space is refering to a 2D space. If you are able to place two models such that they occupy the same space in a 3D space, you have successfully defied the laws of phyics and therefore this issue prob doesnt need an explicit ruleing.

Please dont get me wrong, I play in the way that both of you indicated, however I am the type of person who wants to have a clear understanding of the rules that I am playing (though maybe this is my fundamental problem). My understanding is that RAW does not allow this, we just have agreed as a community to ignore this discrepency. thoughts?

It's not 2D, although that's a common misconception.

The prohibition on moving through other models on page 11 (Models in the Way) is mostly talking about not moving THROUGH other models; ie: you can't move your Space Marine directly through your live Rhino or a Terminator model; you have to go around.

That said, it is physically possible to move into/through certain models in 3D; Drop Pods are the obvious example, although moving into other vehicles with open hatches, or onto a Dreadnought's base, is another physical possibility which is forbidden by Models in the Way on p.11