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Hey all, been reading the SM codex, and it says if you have assault marines without jump packs, then can have a rhino for free. That sounds like a good deal to my newbness, but is it really? Would assault marines be more effective with their jump packs? Also, could you take upgrades for that free rhino?

Second question, I have an old school Rogue Trader era dreadnought. It's main weapon I believe is a lascannon, but due to the primitive non-standard model, it's kind of open to debate. It could also be interpreted as a plasma cannon or any number of other weapons, especially as I plan to modify the model and add some extra bits to kind of 'cool it up.'

What weapon is most effective for a dreadnought? Lascannon is an expensive choice points-wise. Are autocannons, assault cannons or plasma cannons useful at all? Or do you need the lascannon for range and anti-armor ability most?

Thanks!

I think the free transport for assault marines is a bad idea. You have to disembark, wait a turn of getting shot up, then go smash stuff. I don't even like deep striking with them unless I'm using a lot of them (which I don't do without borrowing). I think they work best as a counter unit waiting around for the opportunity then moving and charging with a nice 18" threat range.

As for the Dread, all the weapons have their uses. Some combos are better than others, like Melta with ccw standard (because he'll be close to use the MM, the ccw is a nice backup), or the twin lascan+missile launcher because the weapons are good at the same kind of target.

I know it's expensive, but IMHO, the Dreadnought is the best Lascannon platform in the Vanilla codex. Hit on 3's with rerolls, wound just about anything on 2's. Plus he still has the CCW to muff up anything he chooses.

Lascannon and Missile Launcher could be effective too. And he still has 2 base attacks, so you can always charge into anything and hurt them (though they are str 6).

The point of Assault Marines is mobility. Mobility is incredibly important - especially if you are newer to the game. Jump packs make for much more mobile and flexible assault Marines.

The Dread weapon load-out depends on who you will be facing, and what the role of the Dreadnaught is to be in your force. Nobody can answer you which weapons to take, because the answer will change based on the situation and foe.
Dreads are now amazing in close combat, especially if they are of the front armor 13 variety. Gimping one by not giving it at least the one basic CC weapon is probably a mistake more often than not. A missile launcher is probably the poorest choice overall if the Dread is to have only one main shooty weapon. The don't call 'em MISSile launchers for nuthin'!

Hi, in my army I use 3 dreads in 1500 pts, in 1750 4, I have 2x ironclad in DP and 2x TL AC dreads for range support. They work very good. Assault marines are good in BA codex, in SM codex they arent so good, I dont use them, but if you want play this unit, take minimum 2 squads of them with jump packs.

Ironclad dreads are just mean.

For a regular dread:
Lascannon/Missile is good for mobile anti-tank. Not the best, but still works.
Rifleman Dread is two TL AC. This guy will pop a transport a turn, almost guranteed. I run mine with one autocannon and the TL assault cannon. The range differance is rarely a problem after the first turn and ups his anti-infantry useage in later turns.
Plasma Cannons are violent when they hit, but a single small blast marker isn't that big of a threat. If you do run a plasma, keep the CC arm with a flamer and push him close to the frontline.
Multi-Melta, if it was twinlinked I might consider it, but otherwise I consider it a wasted dread. Marines have much better ways to melta up close.
Flamer Dread, TL Heavy flamer, and CC arm with flamer. Great fun against orcs and nids, pretty sad against anything else. Though him in a drop pod will likly draw alot of fire.

yeenoghu wrote: the twin lascan+missile launcher because the weapons are good at the same kind of target.

The lascannon+ autocannon dread is better at popping transports and light-medium tanks. Less good against MEQ infantry, but better against tanks, which is really what you're taking the dread for no?


Also, assault marines can be effective if they're in kantor's 12" attack bubble. 2 squads of guys with 4 attacks on the charge and 3 regularly will do some damage. However, there are better things in the fast attack slot that you are almost always better off taking.

Lord PoPo wrote:

yeenoghu wrote: the twin lascan+missile launcher because the weapons are good at the same kind of target.

The lascannon+ autocannon dread is better at popping transports and light-medium tanks. Less good against MEQ infantry, but better against tanks, which is really what you're taking the dread for no?


Also, assault marines can be effective if they're in kantor's 12" attack bubble. 2 squads of guys with 4 attacks on the charge and 3 regularly will do some damage. However, there are better things in the fast attack slot that you are almost always better off taking.

I think Dreads (and Predators and Razorbacks for that matter) are the kind of unit that is best used as a filler of gaps. It's restrictive to say what is really "what you are taking the dread for". If the army lacks an infantry hose, an assault cannon dread is good, if it lacks much tankbuster power, the lascan/ML, if you plan on facing lots of light vehicles the autocannon is good; Really any weapon combo is potentially useful. I rarely have used more than one dread myself and I keep it stock to be cheap, and a dangerous distraction stomping right up the center yelling "YOU HAVE TO DEAL WITH ME UNLESS YOU LIKE MULTIMELTA IN YOUR FACE" He is a cheap fire magnet that takes a bit of knocking around to bring down, and he can tear any heavy vehicle up in assault fairly well, which is really what I take a dread for, but we all have our methods. Mine is not meant to survive, he is meant to draw a lot of fire away from my squisher units and hopefully knock some stuff out in his blaze of glory before he gets shot to pieces.

I prefer my Assault Marines with Jump Packs. Then again, I decide early on that I'd like to do an all DoA list.

The best thing to do with that free rhino is put two Meltaguns in there, and fast move up 12 inches for melta goodness. This of course, only works if the rest of your army is also mechanized, and can support the advancing Rhinos.

I a Plasma Cannon on my SW dread, because I don;t have a lot of other plasma weapons in my army. I think the best thing to do, when using a dread, is arm it with weapons that make up for other shortcoming in your list.

shurly an razorback is better at getting re-rolling lascannons then a dreadnought? Mind you I am playing SW marines.

Why would you think that? twinlinked is twinlinked. Razor is cheaper, but that's because it's not as tough.

Cave_Dweller wrote:Hey all, been reading the SM codex, and it says if you have assault marines without jump packs, then can have a rhino for free. That sounds like a good deal to my newbness, but is it really? Would assault marines be more effective with their jump packs? Also, could you take upgrades for that free rhino?

Second question, I have an old school Rogue Trader era dreadnought. It's main weapon I believe is a lascannon, but due to the primitive non-standard model, it's kind of open to debate. It could also be interpreted as a plasma cannon or any number of other weapons, especially as I plan to modify the model and add some extra bits to kind of 'cool it up.'

What weapon is most effective for a dreadnought? Lascannon is an expensive choice points-wise. Are autocannons, assault cannons or plasma cannons useful at all? Or do you need the lascannon for range and anti-armor ability most?

Thanks!

Assault Marines in the regular SM codex generally should not be taken. If you want assault marines, they are much better in the blood angels codex. If you absolutely have to use assault marines, then use jump packs. Your better off with Land speeders or scout bikes in your fast slots though.

The best load out for a non-ironclad dreadnought is twin linked autocannons on both arms. Try aim for that. Gold standard for taking out light armor in the codex.

scubasteve04 wrote:
Assault Marines in the regular SM codex generally should not be taken. If you want assault marines, they are much better in the blood angels codex.

Some people stick with their Codex for their army. It's a pride thing.

scubasteve04 wrote:
The best load out for a non-ironclad dreadnought is twin linked autocannons on both arms. Try aim for that. Gold standard for taking out light armor in the codex.

And when you don't have much light armor to take out? And when you have it in other parts of your list? Again best loadout is for whatever your list is lacking.

the TL-autocannon is good against both infantry and transports.

these are the 2 most common unit types in the game.


you just can't hurt AV14, but thats what Melta and Lascannons are for. you get Melta and Lascaoons on other units. the Dreds can reliably wreck a transport each shooting phase.

Tl-autocannons have something like a 95% chance of every shot hitting. Str7 is just mean to AV12 and below. and with 4 chances you are pretty certain of stopping that transport and once you are done, you can turn on the infantry.

a TL-lascannon/Missile dred is good at killing Tanks with AV12+, but it really doesn't perform well against infantry. one frag blast and then a single lascannon shot. so you will kill 1 guy and possably a couple more if lucky.

a compromise between the 2 is a TL-autocannon/Missile launcher or TL-lascannon/Tl-auto-cannon.

personally, i wouldn't mix them. go either double auto-cannon or Lascan/missile.

Grey Templar wrote:
Tl-autocannons have something like a 95% chance of every shot hitting.

This is wrong. The true odds of getting two hits is 8/9 * 8/9 = 64/81 which is about 79%.