Ram/Tank Shocking - Speed/hindering movement?

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**syypher**

So I read that you can't tank shock in the rulebook yesterday unless you move combat speed. So you would have to declare moving 6" movement minimum to be able to tank shock a unit.

1) Does this affect ramming since it is a type of tank shock? Meaning that you can place a vehicle A 1" in front of Vehicle B attempting the ram and Vehicle B won't be able to Ram?

2) Is there anyway to work around with the rules; whether it be the 1" away from enemy rules, combat speed required movement 6" to tank shock etc. to negate or counter an opponent wanting to tank shock? What about ram?

3) s there anyway to work around with the rules; whether it be the 1" away from enemy rules, combat speed required movement 6" to tank shock etc. to hinder an opponents vehicle movment?

Thanks.

**nosferatu1001**

Combat speed is 0.0000001" to 5.9999999"

NOT 6"

That's your initial mistake.

**syypher**

Ok. Thanks. But I think it's 0.0000001" to 6". Your right though I was looking at it wrong.

With that said can you sill block opponents vehicles from moving by placing ur own vehicles/units in front of him? Or can he just tankshock/ram through it all anyways. I'm assuming he can...

No way to hinder/block vehicles from moving?

**time wizard**

Not really sure what you're asking syypher.
The rules for tank shock and ramming both cover what happens when you come in contact with an enemy model.
You don't necessarily "block" a vehicle from tank shocking, it would just tank shock the first enemy non-vehicle unit it comes in contact with.

**syypher**

Ok well to be more specific I read a lot of strategies for Eldar and SM's where people will take their little fast vehicles like Vypers or Land Speeders (vehicles with AV) that have had their weapons destroyed but are still mobile. They will use these vehicles to park 1" from vehicles that are threatening like Land Raiders or Monoliths to block them or force them to go around them.

A lot of people use empty rhinos or vehicles that are mobile but of no more use (no weapons etc.) to "block" enemy AV from closing in on them or to hinder their movement.

How do they do this? Can't the vehicle they are attempting to block and ram right past them fairly easily...?

**somerandomdude**

syypher wrote: Can't the vehicle they are attempting to block and ram right past them fairly easily...?

If by "fairly easily" you mean "That S5 hit should blow up that vehicle" then no.

If you put a Landspeeder in front of a Landraider, 1" away, then that Landraider would only hit with a S5 hit (4 for AV-10, +1 for being a tank). You'd need a 6 to penetrate, and a further 6 to blow it up, making it very unlikely that the Landraider will be able to move through the blockade.

Even if the Landraider did have room to get some speed and get a stronger hit, you'd still have to worry about the damage table, and the fact that only 1 out of the 6 results helps you at all that turn.

**insaniak**

You can't 'ram right past' enemy vehicles. Your vehicle stops the moment it encounters an enemy vehicle, damage is resolved, and your vehicle only continues moving if the enemy vehicle rolls an 'Explodes' result on the damage table.

**time wizard**

syypher wrote:How do they do this? Can't the vehicle they are attempting to block and ram right past them fairly easily...?

Ah, Okay!
First off, you cannot tank shock a vehicle, you can only ram it.
Second, look at the last paragraph on page 69. When the enemy vehicle is rammed, if it is 'destroyed-explodes!', the ramming vehicle will continue its ram move up to its maximum distance or until it reaches another enemy unit.
If the enemy vehilce suffers any other result, it is not removed and the ramming vehicle halts right there.

So a vehicle can attempt to block another vehicle, how good of a tactic it might be is the subject of other debates.

EDIT: Or, yeah, what insaniak said!

**syypher**

Ah thanks guys. That makes sense now. Ok so those "useless" vehicles that have been disabled can effectively become useful knowing this...heh

**Grey Templar**

the Speeder would also get it's 4+ dodge.

**time wizard**

Grey Templar wrote:the Speeder would also get it's 4+ dodge.

Skimmer dodging is on a 3+.

**Lost Boyz**

What if you declare your distance (somewhere beyond the first target you encounter), ram the enemy vehicle, get a 5 "wrecked' result. That enemy vehicle is now terrain, can't you continue to travel over the difficult terrain (after taking the appropriate tests)?

**insaniak**

No, because the rules say that your vehicle stops, and can only continue moving if the enemy vehicle explodes.

**Galador**

But next turn you can roll over the terrain, taking the appropriate tests, unless he puts another vehicle in front of you.

**Ascalam**

But you can drive over it next turn, using the usual difficult terrain rules...

Blockading is pretty effective, as a vehicle needs to get up speed to do a good ram. Monoliths especially suffer from this, as the top speed is 6''. The monolith, while a skimmer, is 6'' across as well, which pretty much prevents it from flying over ANYTHING

Automatically Appended Next Post:
ninjad

**Lost Boyz**

I am curious, because I like to use my Deffrolla, and I have only gotten a 'double' smash once.

If the vehicle does "6" explode, and there are passengers, do they take a tank shock hit since they are now standing in your path?

**Grey Templar**

I would say yes.

they don't take hits, but must tank the Tank Shock Ld test(and may DoG if passed)

**Mannahnin**

Resolve the vehicle explosion. Place the transported unit. Ramming unit continues on its way, thus automatically hitting and Tank-Shocking the squad, as they are in the way.

**Lost Boyz**

Well, they'd probably take Deffrolla hits if I hit them with my Battlewagon. (They'd get 2D6 hits if they death or glory)

(Strangely, the Rolla does better against vehicles than most troops, since they still get their armor saves.)

**somerandomdude**

Lost Boyz wrote:Well, they'd probably take Deffrolla hits if I hit them with my Battlewagon. (They'd get 2D6 hits if they death or glory)

(Strangely, the Rolla does better against vehicles than most troops, since they still get their armor saves.)

Remember also that they'd have to take a pinning test when they leave their destroyed transport. If they fail that, they couldn't DoG.

**Grey Templar**

Why couldn't a pinned squad DoG?

i know of no limitation that prevents them from doing so.

you can DoG if the squad passes a Ld test from the tank shock.

**somerandomdude**

Pg 24:

"Whilst it has gone to ground [or been pinned] the unit may do nothing of its own volition, but will react normally if affected by enemy actions."

DoG is something the unit must do "of its own volition" as it is a choice. If they are pinned, they are unable to DoG.

**Galador**

And if they fail the pinning test, and fail the tank shock test, that would mean a fallback move for them. And as long as your vehicle can stay within 6", you can run them off the board!!!

Edited for spelling errors and because I reread the rules and checked where I had read wrong myself!!