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Hey all, I'm looking to expand my IG by ~150 points and am torn between a Hellhound and a Manticore. I only have one opponent who currently uses orks, running 3 mobs of boyz, bikes, battle wagon, mega armor warboss w/nobs, looted wagon, and the 3 most irritating warbuggies in the universe, likely soon to include kans. Note: I don't want a Valk/Vendetta (they seem cheesy to me, not hating on anyone who uses them, just not my thing). Also my opponent and I are not super competitive, it'd be nice to win but I'm alright losing/ not wiping the floor with him every time.
Current list includes:
CCS w/melta, 3x gl
Platoon Alpha:
2x squads w/ flamers, autocannons
HWS w/autocannon, 2x Lascannon
Vet grenadiers w/gl, flamer, lascannon
Demolisher w/occasional plasma joy, ocassionaly naked
LRBT w/ lascannon

Thanks in advance for any advice!
P.S. This is my first thread so feel free to point out any mistakes in format or anything else for that matter, thanks again!

Your guardsmen need chimeras

Flamers are wasted on vets

LRBT is a bit more versatile than a demolisher

I'd recommend simply running vets and not bothering with platoons

If you take the chimera route, and you fight ork mobs, put flamers everywhere





Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, putting a flamer and lascannon in the same squad seems kind of silly. Against orks, you need to move about to get close enough to roast them, but if you move you can't fire the HW. I would rely less on infantry to drop high strength weapons and leave it up to the vehicles, namely the Lemans

Your gaurdsman don't "need" chimeras. That's a load of #$!*. To be competitive the two standard builds are platoon blobs, or mechanized vets. Since you already have a platoon i'd suggest going with blobs to avoid investing in a pile of chimera's unless you really want to.

Don't mix your heavy squads. Go all autocannon or all lascannon, since they all have to shoot at same target.

To build a build a blob army at this points level you do not need another tank. Drop the vet squad since it's an easy kill point unless it's in a transport, and get a second platoon instead of another tank.

Standard example of blob platoons are:
Pcs x4flamer
2xinfantry squad with meltagun, power weapons, and maybe melta bombs.
commisar with power weapon to make unit stubborn.
This gives you a stubborn unit with 21 wounds and 3 power weapon attacks (6 on a charge), plus they can take out most tanks with either melta guns or in cc. Pcs is used to flame hordes before you charge your blob.
Add a few autocannon heavy weapon squads, and you have a strong unit.

Maybe make a second shooty blob platoon to support:
Pcs x4 flamers
2xinfantry with lascannons and plasma guns
commisar for stuborn.
suport with autocannon or lascannon heavy squads. Again, don't mix them in same squad.

A Manticore will never be wasted, especially against low-armor armies.

Thanks for the input guys. To clarify, I really do appreciate the advice on my list but what I am asking is if I should aquire a hellhound OR a manticore. I put my list up as a general example of what I typically use, as a reference point. It really comes down to what you think works better against orks, knowing that tau are likely in the not too distant future. Eventually my opponent and I will both expand our lists to 1500, when I may include some chimeras and the like, however for the time being the core list is what it is. Thanks again.

Personally they both have their pros and cons. So with that MarbosMiyagi I would say pick the model that looks more appealing to you between the manticore and hellhound. Not to go OT but what are your opinions on chimera's as transport tanks

ernshmagl wrote:Personally they both have their pros and cons. So with that MarbosMiyagi I would say pick the model that looks more appealing to you between the manticore and hellhound. Not to go OT but what are your opinions on chimera's as transport tanks

They're good, but they need to be used in proportion (which, this being Imperial Guard, means out-of-proportion). A single Chimera isn't "bad" by any sense, especially not for a 55 point transport, but the value in them comes from having so many that they enemy can't take them all out at once.

If some of them happen to survive battle taxing their troops to objectives they can also be useful for blocking and the Multi Laser/Heavy Flamer isn't a terrible weapon combo for the price.

I guess my thoughts on the Chimera are that they can be game-winning, but they aren't ever tanks (and using them as such will stop them from being game winning).

A simple answer to your question, Manticore, always when your going for fun. The manticore is a random fun game changer, when it fires, and if you magnatize it you can swap it out for a death strike if you really want. Both can pump out a good amount of laughable destruction. The hellhound is more reliable (not other varients) and may get a couple shots off, but it lacks the crazy fun of up to three templates smacking the board with horrible accuracy.

Examples - Manticore missing by 12 inches to wipe out a full unit of my ogryns, or smacking a parking lot to destroy 3 DE transports and and a full unit of the little hobgoblin guys. Manticores can be scary and fun, so they get my vote.

Plus, what isn't cool about building feth-huge Katyushas on the back of a spare Chimera?

I know this isn't a manticore or hellhound but have you given any thought to adding two hydras to your ranks? I believe its 150pts for the two and it looks like it would fit in nicely with the content of your army. It would give you those awesome autocannons that can easily dispatch the bikes, buggies, and kans and can help with any medium strength infantry you come across. Just a thought to considder. Good luck

Leprousy wrote:Your gaurdsman don't "need" chimeras. That's a load of #$!*. To be competitive the two standard builds are platoon blobs, or mechanized vets. Since you already have a platoon i'd suggest going with blobs to avoid investing in a pile of chimera's unless you really want to.

Don't mix your heavy squads. Go all autocannon or all lascannon, since they all have to shoot at same target.

To build a build a blob army at this points level you do not need another tank. Drop the vet squad since it's an easy kill point unless it's in a transport, and get a second platoon instead of another tank.

Standard example of blob platoons are:
Pcs x4flamer
2xinfantry squad with meltagun, power weapons, and maybe melta bombs.
commisar with power weapon to make unit stubborn.
This gives you a stubborn unit with 21 wounds and 3 power weapon attacks (6 on a charge), plus they can take out most tanks with either melta guns or in cc. Pcs is used to flame hordes before you charge your blob.
Add a few autocannon heavy weapon squads, and you have a strong unit.

Maybe make a second shooty blob platoon to support:
Pcs x4 flamers
2xinfantry with lascannons and plasma guns
commisar for stuborn.
suport with autocannon or lascannon heavy squads. Again, don't mix them in same squad.

I tend to agree with this generally. Although I would say since you currently just have 3 squads, it's a bit 50-50 as to which expansion route is more economical (in real money). To get more troops you either buy a lot of infantry, or a few chimeras. Although... the chimera-vets option would suggest you get more special weapon troopers, and would also waste your heavy weapon teams - so in the end, yeh it's probably best for you to stick with platoons.
As a side note - your list above seem to be missing a Platoon command squad?

In so far as your actual question, I have a hellhound but I've never really been very happy with how it performs. You may have better success with one than I have, but I'd choose the manticore, not least because I agree with Castitas that a manticore would be more fun.

You do already have 2 Leman Russ though (which is maybe enough at this points level) , and so I'd tend to agree with those who suggest your next expnsion be more along the Troops lines. Personally... I'd get a commisar and some more infantry squads.

Hey all,
Went with the Manticore, thanks for the input.
List I'm probably going to go with:
CCS: Autocannon = 60
Platoon Alpha
PCS: 3x flamer = 45
Combined Squad: 2x melta, Commisar w/power weapon = 165
HWS: 3x Lascannon = 105
Platoon Bravo
PCS: Vanilla = 30
Squad 1: Autocannon = 60
Squad 2: Autocannon = 60
LRBT: Hull HB = 150
Demolisher Hull Heavy Flamer= 165
Manticore = 160

Total = 1,000

Thoughts? and I talked to my boys they don't want or need chimeras

I think you've squeezed those troop choices too much in order to afford tanks. Fill the special weapon slots up and then see what you have to spend on tanks rather than the other way round.

Looks much better. As you build it more i'd think about dropping the hws, and using saved points to flesh out your special weapons. Probably mostly plasma in ccs and ac squads, and 4xflamers in the pcs's.

I would probably drop the demolisher to fit in a few more IS. In this case its the same as with orks IMO. Boyz before toyz. Reasoning behind this is that 20 man blobs really aren't all that effective. First (and only) time I played with a 20 man blob list, all three got wiped over 2 turns because they couldn't outlast opponents in an assault, and they couldn't take a lot of shooting before losing overall effectiveness