Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hey guys! I run Tau but have always love finding abusive cheese in any army I play.

Currently I run a maxed out FS bomb and cheese it with nothing but suits and Drones. I enjoy having an oddball army nobody expects and wanted to try another.


But I was wondering if anyone has ever tried a 15 Piranha spam/rush. I was thinking a team of 3 Broadsides and 15 Piranhas with stripped down HQ and troops.

Any input would be appreciated! Whether it be how you would try to counter 15 shooty skimmers rushing you or what you thhink could cheese it up more tactics wise.

Thx!

Im new to Tau but can't we only get 9 skimmers in an army?

3 groups of 3?

MechaBeast wrote:Im new to Tau but can't we only get 9 skimmers in an army?

3 groups of 3?

Tau Piranhas are listed as 1-5 and count as a fast attack slot in the Tau dex.

BeefCakeSoup wrote:Hey guys! I run Tau but have always love finding abusive cheese in any army I play.

Currently I run a maxed out FS bomb and cheese it with nothing but suits and Drones. I enjoy having an oddball army nobody expects and wanted to try another.


But I was wondering if anyone has ever tried a 15 Piranha spam/rush. I was thinking a team of 3 Broadsides and 15 Piranhas with stripped down HQ and troops.

Any input would be appreciated! Whether it be how you would try to counter 15 shooty skimmers rushing you or what you thhink could cheese it up more tactics wise.

Some people have tried them, sometimes they have even worked. But it's very hit & miss army, and probably won't work that great against some modern krak missile spam armies. And unfortunately some wargear rules are unclear regarding squadrons (Target lock, Disruption pod, Flechettes).

The problem is 15 of them is expensive, and an army with any sort of significant anti light mech (SW, GK, DE, etc) are going to mince them without breaking a sweat.

DO IT, 15 is very unexpected, however max out on broadsides to egg them on.

Intresting....
Fusion blaster or burst cannon?
What wargear?
Can be destroyed by bolters....Ouch!
You have A LOT of (easyish) kill points, drones + piranhas = 30 KP....
But might even work....I'll try it myself

One of the most interesting points of a mass-piranha list is the Flachette Dischargers. At ten points per model, you give the entire unit them so that when a model attacks the unit it gets hit five times before it gets to resolve its attacks. Remember, a unit attacking a vehicle in a squadron in close combat is attacking the unit as a whole, so all five FDs go off.

Piranhas are for tank hunting and screening the rest of your army. They aren't intended to be your entire army.

Even if you armed all of them with burst cannons, you simply won't kill enough infantry to stop horde armies from swarming you (or shooting you down in the case of IG and Orks)

Arm all of them with fusion blasters and you can kill *maybe* 5 vehicles/MCs a turn (if every piranha is close enough to shoot). Not being able to split fire like other Tau units can is a big detriment.

Like others have mentioned, those maxed piranha units are worth 30KPs total. Worse, those 30KPs have to be close to the enemy (6-18" away) just to be able to shoot.

The 1 good thing about them would be detaching the drones and forcing a dozen pinning checks on units of infantry while the piranhas blow up tanks. Basically working by "stunning" several units at a time.

Edit: just read my codex and realized I was wrong about splitting fire (target lock). It makes them better but doesn't change the fact that you have to be uncomfortably close to get your shots.

Yeah this is also an extremely soft list. These guys can be taken down with massed Str 4 fire. Thats not good. You might win some games out of surprise, but most savvy players will down this pretty easily.

Bruteboss wrote:Piranhas are for tank hunting and screening the rest of your army. They aren't intended to be your entire army.

Even if you armed all of them with burst cannons, you simply won't kill enough infantry to stop horde armies from swarming you (or shooting you down in the case of IG and Orks)

Arm all of them with fusion blasters and you can kill *maybe* 5 vehicles/MCs a turn (if every piranha is close enough to shoot). Not being able to split fire like other Tau units can is a big detriment.

Like others have mentioned, those maxed piranha units are worth 30KPs total. Worse, those 30KPs have to be close to the enemy (6-18" away) just to be able to shoot.

The 1 good thing about them would be detaching the drones and forcing a dozen pinning checks on units of infantry while the piranhas blow up tanks. Basically working by "stunning" several units at a time.

Edit: just read my codex and realized I was wrong about splitting fire (target lock). It makes them better but doesn't change the fact that you have to be uncomfortably close to get your shots.

Wouldn't the piranhas be more like 6 KP. 3 Squadrons of 5 w/ 3 groups of 10 drones attached to each. Thats only 6 KP.

On a personal note I occasionally run a group of 3-4 w/ target locks and fusion blasters (thinking of adding flechettes). They provide a good wall and allow secondary vehicle cracking/disruption tactics.

I'm a tired idiot this morning and you are correct. For some reason I blindly assumed that each piranha and its pair of drones was a KP. Well thats 1 problem this list doesn't have.

I'm looking for shock factor and suprise only. It's a fun list, but I love cheese and this has cheddar potential.

I'm thinking Target Array, Flechette Dischargers, Disruption Pods, and Fusion Blasters puts it at 1275.


For a straight blitz this leaves enough space for a barebones HQ and Troops.

In a 1500 point game I think the list would actually have a shot at blitzing an enemy into oblivion if you caught them by surprise. I don't think the list would be super competitive, but it might be a totall curveball for my opponents who are used to a suit crazy army at 2000- 2500 for me to roll up with 15 Piranhas at 1500

It would be a sight to see for sure, but I'm not to sure how effective it'll be. They're mainly tank-hunters. But for Shock/Awe/Cheese, it'll be super effective lol

What armies do you normally fight? That should determine if you use Fusion Blaster or Burst Cannons...if you're using Distuprion Pods, they're only effective if you're 12+" away. So, to really hammer on the melta you need to be 6" away, which voids the DP protection.

Also, can't a vehicle only use Flechette Launchers once per game?

I don't have my 'dex right now (at work), but I think those are the correct rules for everything

Just re-checked the Dex.

Looks like you can use them everytime they get assualted. Says nothing about once per game though. Unless it is some special rule in the 5th Edition rulebook.

I usually fight Space Marines of various flavors or Mech guard.

I might be able to drop flechette and put target locks on too. Would allow me to turbo boost to a flank, then roll up all deep like and start poppin and pinning (pinning checks from gun drones)

Could be a fun list for sure. If anyone tries it with proxy let me know!

Not sure where people are getting that they will be brought down by mass str 4 fire. They are front armor 11 with a wide front.

I used 2-3 in my all mech tau list and they were great. With good positioning they have to shoot heavy or special weapons at them to bring them down.

Or throw a seeker missle on them. Turbo-boot over enemy tanks to get behind them. Marker light the tank and fire a seeker missle to the rear armor from the pirhana.

PraetorDave wrote:Yeah this is also an extremely soft list. These guys can be taken down with massed Str 4 fire. Thats not good. You might win some games out of surprise, but most savvy players will down this pretty easily.

Aren't they AV11 front and sides?

Caffran9 wrote:

PraetorDave wrote:Yeah this is also an extremely soft list. These guys can be taken down with massed Str 4 fire. Thats not good. You might win some games out of surprise, but most savvy players will down this pretty easily.

Aren't they AV11 front and sides?

If they were this list would be way less cheese and way more doctrine

Caffran9 wrote:

PraetorDave wrote:Yeah this is also an extremely soft list. These guys can be taken down with massed Str 4 fire. Thats not good. You might win some games out of surprise, but most savvy players will down this pretty easily.

Aren't they AV11 front and sides?

11-10-10 ,open top, fast skimmer

Dakkafang Dreggrim wrote:Not sure where people are getting that they will be brought down by mass str 4 fire. They are front armor 11 with a wide front.

I used 2-3 in my all mech tau list and they were great. With good positioning they have to shoot heavy or special weapons at them to bring them down.

Or throw a seeker missle on them. Turbo-boot over enemy tanks to get behind them. Marker light the tank and fire a seeker missle to the rear armor from the pirhana.

I'm thinking along the same lines.

Move them up in 3 squadrons (obviously) and focus on one flank. If they shocked a flank hard enough they would be able to crush it and rapidly advance or withdraw before most enemies could react. I'm likely fighting Mech Guard or Space Marines.

So with Guard, I pop a flank, pop contents, advance, rinse repeat.

Again, I'm looking at this in a 1500 point perspective. Originally I thought higher, but I think 1500 this should shine at least decently due to limited mech options being able to retaliate.

Should be a fun build if nothing else.

Also, for hordes, being able to Focus Fire into a blob with 15 S 8 shots and follow up with 30 twin-linked S 5 pinning shots should be enough to at least dull any assualt that would take Flechette fire.

A lot of theory craft at this point with a lot of variables but I'm excited about it haha

Do it! My brother has a Tau army and I always wanted him to play a list like this just because it could be mad crazy bonkers. It could also be extremely bad, but it could be extremely fun! Let us know how it goes for you.

Caffran9 wrote:

PraetorDave wrote:Yeah this is also an extremely soft list. These guys can be taken down with massed Str 4 fire. Thats not good. You might win some games out of surprise, but most savvy players will down this pretty easily.

Aren't they AV11 front and sides?

They are front armor 11, so sides and rear could be glanced by str 4. So if a mob of shoota boys gets on your side, thats glancing to death. While not deadly, it certainly is a hazard.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Caffran9 wrote:

PraetorDave wrote:Yeah this is also an extremely soft list. These guys can be taken down with massed Str 4 fire. Thats not good. You might win some games out of surprise, but most savvy players will down this pretty easily.

Aren't they AV11 front and sides?

They are front armor 11, so sides and rear could be glanced by str 4. So if a mob of shoota boys gets on your side, thats glancing to death. While not deadly, it certainly is a hazard.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
So quick questions. If the gun drones of one pirahna unload, do all the gun drones of the squadron have to unload? And if so, would they form into one big unit (a unit of 10)? If they don't all have to get off, do any that get off at one time form into a unit? So you could unload two piranha's drones, and they could form a unit of 4.

I forgot where I read it, but I am fairly certain that if one set of drones disembarks, the entire squadron's drones must disembark as well. At least that is how it is played in my area. This gives me a Mob of 3-4 Skimmers to block with. And then a 'mob' of 6-8 drones to speed bump or harass the enemy with. They are good fore fighting close combat stuff w/ good armor saves. You make a line of drones and then have a pocket of fire warriors behind them firing through the drones. Cover really isn't an issue since AP5 doesn't mean anything to power armor.