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I was going to title this "SwapMod Grudge Match 3", but given that Jin and I now live in the same state, I'm hoping we'll be playing a lot more often . I also spent an hour trying to figure out how to add labels onto the background pics with Battle Chronicler, a la Red_Zeke, but it's a lot harder than it looked, so I'll need to PM him or Salvage for some more tips.

My list:

Daemon Prince, MoT, Level 1, Third Eye, Fury
Throgg
8 Trolls
6 Trolls
8 Ogres, MoK, CA, GWs, Mus, Std
5 Hounds
5 Hounds
Shaggoth w/ AHW

Jin's approximate list:

Mage, Level 2, +1 Spell, Life
Mage, Level 1, High Magic
Mage, Level 1, High Magic
~24 LSG, Flaming Banner
~30 Spear Elves
~20 Phoenix Guard, Banner of Sorcery
~20 White Lions
~18 Swordmasters, IronCurse Icon
Eagle
Eagle

We rolled until we got Scenario 1, since neither of us wanted to mess with deploying on the short edges, or watchtower, which we rolled up the first two times . I didn't take a picture of deployment, but this is a shot after my movement on Turn 1, and Jin's beginning his.



I was glad to see his swordmasters on the far left (barely in the pic), since I felt I could avoid them a bit. I was, however, overly conservative with the DP, as you can see by how far back he is (for some reason I thought the LSG might shoot him, rather than regen-less trolls). I also gave him the most conservative gift available with Fury over Roar or Stream of Coruption. Other than the close proximity of that flaming banner, I was feeling good about being so close to combat after my half of Turn 1! That was soon to change, however...




What happened to that Shaggoth? And Throgg's friends? And the forest? (Okay, that last one we just moved out of the way) I'm glad you asked... first, on the bottom of Turn 1 Jin got a 25 on Dwellers and I chose not to try to dispel, with 4 trolls failing their strength tests. Then, one troll unit came up stupid, the other trolls and ogres failed their charges, and the Shaggoth alone charged in. He pasted the mage-general, lost to combat res, and rolled up a 10 twice on his break test! The Phoenix Guard ran him down and came up to within spitting range of the smaller troll unit. The Daemon Prince is off the picture to the left, below where the hounds are trying to block both the swordmasters and white lions from charging the trolls.




With no Life-mage, Jin's magic was weaker, and I was able to get into combat mostly unscathed with my other units. However, the smaller unit of trolls failed all 6 regens, and bounced right off! The ogres mowed through the LSG and ran them down, Throgg's weakened trolls slowly ate away the steadfast of the spear elves while Throgg was stuck in a challenge, and the DP got the flank of the swordmasters (who had eliminated the hounds) and they failed their steadfast test and broke from combat, getting away.



The swordmasters fail to recover, and the DP chases them down, although he also fails to redirect his charge into the white lions and goes off the table. Throgg finishes his challenge with the champion, followed by the mage, and finally gets to attack the unit. I take a chance, needing to kill 6 LSG with throgg and 2 trolls, and don't use his breath weapon (saving it for the white lions). I manage exactly 6 wounds after Shield of Sapphery and run them down, avoiding a rear charge from the white lions (phew!). The ogres reformed to come back to the fight, as do the Phoenix Guard, while Jin carefully measures his eagles chasing down the smaller trolls



The final showdowns of the game look to be White Lions vs. Throgg, and Phoenix Guard vs. Ogres. However, the frenzied ogres are too much to handle, and win big against the Phoenix Guard- and Jin rolls a 12 for his break test, anyway! I roll a 12 to pursue . The White Lions fail their charge, and are left facing a final turn counter-charge from Throgg in the front and the Daemon Prince in the flank. We decide to call the game there, with the eagles also still in the game but not pictured (one of whom chased away the hounds to the right of the pics earlier).




Post Game Thoughts: The Daemon Prince has done really well every time I've used him! I'm tempted to keep him in my list for 'Ard Boyz, but will probably go with a Level 4 Disc Caster instead (Boo! Hiss!) particularly for the ability to bring a dispel scroll to weather homerun magic, at least turn 1. The Ogres also continue to impress, since people rightly are worried about the trolls and they tend to make it upfield unscathed. They are also armed to the teeth, and so can take most things down in combat.

Jin's list was very interesting, and once his main caster died I got to see more of his plan for spamming single or double dice spells, with drain magic and shield of sapphery. Both of us could have used a BSB, but him much moreso- he didn't make a steadfast test for most of the end of the game, some failing rather spectacularly, such as on double dakkas on his second to last roll of the game. Throgg saved my bacon with his imitation-BSB work several times, and I successfully made my stupidity tests sans BSB the whole game, with the exception of a single turn. A 2K game with no BSBs... something's clearly wrong here

Woo! Look at all those 40mm bases! Looks great.

Jin's list- no lord and no BSB? Spicy! A neat thing he was trying, but I really think the BSB is mandatory. Speaking from experience as someone who uses high leadership models, I really start to sweat every time I have to take a check without a re-roll.

Thanks for the report- pics look good.

RZ
P.S. I actually use powerpoint to attach labels, then save the presentation as pictures.

Do SM's powerpoint and is it even more rude to do so?
Sorry for the 40k reference.

Also should Swapshop Mods exchange some units half way through the game?

These and other musings...

will now cease.

Thanks for the report RiTides

Lol

RZ- Ah, powerpoint! I will give that a try next time . Are those just standard text boxes, then?

Red_Zeke wrote:Woo! Look at all those 40mm bases! Looks great.

Jin's list- no lord and no BSB? Spicy! A neat thing he was trying, but I really think the BSB is mandatory. Speaking from experience as someone who uses high leadership models, I really start to sweat every time I have to take a check without a re-roll.

For completeness's sake, my list was:

Lvl2, Silver Wand (Life)
Lvl1 (High)
Lvl1 (High)

25 LSG, fc, Banner of Eternal flame
25 Spearelves, fc

18 White Lions, fc
18 Swordmasters, fc, Ironcurse Icon
18 Phoenix Guard, fc, Banner of Sorcery

2 Great Eagles




Aye, decided on a quick, different 2k list from my standard.

I do agree with you on the BSB bit though, after the fact. If I were to do up the list a bit differently, I'd drop down to Min Core and take a BSB for security.



Good game, btw, RiTides. Forgot to say that last night while being steamed about all those failed LD Tests .

Yeah they were impressive . It was a good game, although in hindsight I think I may give those ogres a different mark, despite how awesome they are in combat with MoK. Being forced to overrun (I think even if I wipe something out on the charge) means an eagle could take them for a ride, simply by blocking them and angling so that they'd go off in the wrong direction after killing it.

Good report man. Seemed to be a pretty short game; is that because the monsters tend to either spectacularly crush the enemy or die just as spectacularly, or is it more a function of elves being squishy? Or am I not realizing the turns well?

Probably a good idea being conservative with the DP; roaring is recommended, but one must be careful if one desires continued DP action.

By the by, when I move down to the greater Fairfax region this fall, I am chaining you to the painting table and making you get those lads colored.

Rocking report lads! Nice game as well, with quite the concept list from Jin, though definitely needing a BSB, and perhaps a different mix of lores (spammed wildform does more for me than whatever high's basic is, 5+ ward maybe?).

Wehrkind wrote:By the by, when I move down to the greater Fairfax region this fall, I am chaining you to the painting table and making you get those lads colored.

The thought crossed my mind to berate you guys too about not having painted anything since DCON ... But in all honesty I don't think I've painted much since then either, and hardly gotten anything even built

- Salvage

Plebs! I have totally painted... well started to... base coated... uhm...

I am sort of done with Wulfria, I guess. After I base her. (Baste? No, base.)

Boss Salvage wrote:Rocking report lads! Nice game as well, with quite the concept list from Jin, though definitely needing a BSB, and perhaps a different mix of lores (spammed wildform does more for me than whatever high's basic is, 5+ ward maybe?).

Yeah, it certainly impressed on me that that BSB is necessary. The main reasoning for taking High Magic was because a Lvl1 will have 2 decent spells (5+ Ward & Drain Magic) to cast that can be easily cast with only 1-2 dice (5+ and 7+ to cast as opposed to Wildform's 10+). My mistake (one of many) Turn 1 was throwing single dice for both Lvl1's despite having 12PD dice to play with that turn. I think the theory behind the list is fairly sound...I just need to tweak things around a bit. It's weird not to be running cavalry, though.

Wehrkind wrote:By the by, when I move down to the greater Fairfax region this fall, I am chaining you to the painting table and making you get those lads colored.

The thought crossed my mind to berate you guys too about not having painted anything since DCON ... But in all honesty I don't think I've painted much since then either, and hardly gotten anything even built

- Salvage

In my defense, since Dakkacon, I'd been out of the country and then moved to a different state. Also, Steve and I are presumably trying to run a pseudo-Escalation League to get our stuff painted up (finally). On the downside, I'm pretty much switching over everything to new plastics, so I'm pretty much starting back from scratch -___-.

Ah, had forgotten about drain magic, and you have a point about low casting costs of army lores vs BRB ones. Both 5+ ward and drain are decent too, and if you want offense you've got something like a 44% chance of getting dwellers with the other guy, and there's nothing more offensive than that

Good to hear about the escalation paint-a-thon, good luck guys. Will tentatively look forward to painted throwdowns at DCON2

- Salvage

I didn't know you were moving to Fairfax, Wehr! We will actually all be in range of the same game store, at least for a weekend game (DreamWizards looks to be pretty much halfway between Columbia MD and Fairfax VA, assuming non-weeknight-traffic).

Painting... oh yes . I have set up a painting station, but my project this week is still assembly- I need to put together those hellcannons finally, for 'Ard Boyz!

Practice game against Jin tomorrow for it, although I will save my next report for the next "normal" matchup.

Wait... so let me get this straight. Not only are you NOT painting, but you are spending time you could be painting playing Jin, and then WON'T be posting a battle report? WTF man? I thought we were friends? :-P

Yea, the Mrs. and I are looking to move down in early fall. Did well enough on my GREs that I am comfortable applying only to GMU, and just beating my head against their doors until they let me in, or enough of my brains spatter through the jamb that it doesn't matter.
We will probably be a bit south of Fairfax if I recall, but not too far as she will be working up in Tyson's Corners/McLean. Just far enough to live with poor old people for lower rent and higher acceptance of cats. I am definitely planning on throwing down with you and hopefully Jin at such times! (We will be in Philly for the summer, so weekends we are not up at our "country home" getting it ready for sale I should be pretty available for weekend gaming too, assuming classes don't kill me.)

As a side note, when you meet Mrs Wehrkind, when she smiles and says "Oh, you are the fantasy buddy?" just know that it wasn't my finest choice of diction. I owe her a bit though; I called her "Frip Frop" in bed for weeks after that pronunciation incident alone.

My wife calls a few of my local gaming friends "the robot guys" so no worries there.

The only reason the matchup won't be getting bat rep'ed is because we'll both be doing a bit of proxying, and my hellcannons aren't assembled. I will be snapping some pics are 'Ard Boyz and trying to write those up, though

Looking forward to you being closer and getting some games!

@Wehr - this is where the unemployment is kicking in. Unlike some people *cough*RiTides*cough* , I'm actually steadily making progress on assembling AND painting. (Though more the former than the latter).

Nice; I am really looking forward to being unemployed. I can't quite deal with how moronic my company is as well as how bad my current professors are. (Hopefully, however, my future GMU professors will be excellent. I have good reason to believe that will be the case.)

What have you been painting up Jin? Just replacing old/unpainted stuff, or putting in new units?

I've decided to be even more ineffective and going for an actual themed List and moving over to nearly all plastics, if possible.

I think asides from a block of Spearelves, nearly everything else will be getting phased out. On the plus side, I should have a really slick (god willing) true Caledor-themed list. Nothing has been quite painted up yet, but a set of 5 Dragon Princes are assembled and primed, waiting for me to get time to actually paint them up (hopefully will start this weekend).

Basically, I'm adding, 15 new Dragon Princes (retiring the old models), 25 of the new IoB Sea Guard (my initial opinion of them has changed much since I started getting a better grasp of 8th Ed. and actually started fielding them), 2 Lion Chariots (to be converted as being pulled by drakes), 12 White Lions converted up from DE Corsairs and a Dragon Lord . FAR less effective than what I had at Dakkacon (in theory, at least), but it should look nice and be a nice change of pace from normal HE lists out there

LSG are so much more annoying to me than straight-up spear-elves, so I think including a unit of them is a great choice! As to assembly and painting... about to have a crash-course in fast assembly before Saturday and 'Ard Boyz!

Love the idea for the Lion Chariots, too!

I dont get the hate my store HE players have a LSG....

They sit back and shoot at you, then you finally charge them, then they stand and shoot, and your STILL looking at 4 ranks fighting, with ASF and high initiative.....

Most annoying unit ever.

Sounds pretty cool, those drake chariots in particular.

And remember, nothing says "MANLY!" like being completely unable to accomplish your goals.

Heh, yeah...I'm still looking for appropriate models to use for the bodies of the drakes.

And I *swear* this time I'll complete this project. HONEST.

So heavy dragon princes, Jin? I've seen a couple Extreme DP Deathstar builds recently that are pretty cool - there's a drrrrrrunk one on warseer, 3x 20 archers + eagles + prince / bsb / noble / noble / ~30 dragon princes one on the batrep page. I think a more sane investment in them could certainly pay off - particularly shoved into banner of flame units. (One of the side benefits of more and more regen bastards in the game - TK necrotech, looking at you).

- Salvage

Extreme DP Deathstar.

I don't even know what to do with that, but I do know that it needs to be promoted past its role in that post.

As to the drake models, I kind of remember seeing some legless dragon type things floating around a year or so back. I will see if I can find them again, if that's what you are looking for.

@Boss - heh, that list sounds like fun, though dangerous . Also, damn you for making me go to 'seer. Now I feel dirty. Oddly enough, I'm not going with a big block of Dragon Princes, rather, going with an MSU build instead, relying on combo charges of multiple units of DPs and Lion Chariots along with a Moon Dragon (couldn't fit the Star Dragon). I'll post up the list at some point in the near future.

@Wehr - Trolling through the GW site, I think I may be able to convert some drakes out of Khorne Fleshhounds + other bits... I'll have to see them in person again to double check, though.

Probably not a bad idea. If what I am thinking of turns out to be something actually manufactured and sold, as opposed to something from a Ral Partha catalogue circa 1993 I will let you know.

We talking a dragon @ 2k??? WHOA! Also love me some lion chariots, lot of value in that unit, though I guess it does cost a pretty penny. On the MSU dragon princes, RZ fought some 7-wide flesh hounds, wonder if that would work for DP? Though yes you're far more with it, combo charges and not trying to go straight into a unit alone is a far better way to go.

Wehr, that DP was more or less for you, buddy
(Annnnd that would be super awkward if this thread wasn't a DCON-fest anyway )

- Salvage

2.4k....Can't take more than a Sun Dragon in 2k. Though, now that I think about it, that could be fun too....

I don't see DPs being appreciably better at more than 6-wide, to be honest, and they'd really prefer to limit the numbers of hits back as possible. Flesh-hounds, IIRC, are a bit more resilient so can stand to take some extra hits back. Then again, I've been known to be wrong. Often.


EDIT: PS, RiTides, sorry for thread-jacking

No thread-jack, it's on topic! I would love to see a build of yours that is somewhere in between the ones my army is chewing up like hamburger meat, and the last one that schooled my "ultimate" 'Ard Boyz army

Jin wrote:I think I may be able to convert some drakes out of Khorne Fleshhounds + other bits... I'll have to see them in person again to double check, though.

A guy at the Columbia GW did this for chariots for his beastmen army (using them as counts-as razorgor chariots, while his regular chariots were pulled by hounds). I took a few pics a while back for someone, and he actually keeps them under the table at the store if you want to see them in person.