Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hello! I just wanted to clarify this very confusing Crazed rule on Chaos dreadnoughts?

Basically, the fire frenzy rule is what bugs me. Read this article: http://www.theruleslawyers.com/2009/09/chaos-dreadnought-fire-frenzy-in-5th-edition/
What this basically means is that a Chaos player does maintain some limited control over a fire-frenzying dreadnought. By being aware of the dreadnought's 45 degree firing arcs, the player can pivot the frenzied Dreadnought in the movement phase so that the most desireable target becomes the closest visible target at the beginning of the shooting phase. However, if the player fails to bring a target into any of the 45 degree firing arcs by pivoting during the movement phase, the Dreadnought will not be able to fire at all that turn.
That means as long as we are able to pivot towards our enemy without allies being in our 45 degree arc we can hit them... TWICE?

Also, if a dreadnought is equipped with a plasma cannon and a missile launcher, and bunched up so that it is in base contact with another chaos dreadnought, if it does fire frenzy, it target's the chaos dreadnought's side, and since the blast template cover's itself, and you cannot hurt yourself, it cannot fire any ranged weapons, and thus it becomes sane? Just a thought.

I see Chaos dreadnoughts having alot of potential, especially with all the cheese and vagueness. >

You make da call.

You can hurt yourself, when you scatter. You may not ever place any blast marker to touch any of your units before scatter.
The blast marker can be placed anywhere on the other dread, and must be placed without touching the firing unit. As long as it is possible to place the hole of the blast maker over any part of the other dread's base without touching the firing dread, the shot will not fail.

The answer by the rules lawyers is correct tough.

Yep, that is all correct

Note that some places ignore the "visible" == "LOS" rule on page 16, and claim that "visible" means "visible to the player" - in which case they have you turning round to shoot behind you potentially! This happened at a recent tournament, and is mainly based on the 4th edition LOS rules for walkers.

Remember it is 45 degrees for each weapon, and that is 22.5 degrees left of the left arm, and 22.5 degrees right of the right arm. Makes it a bit more than 45 degrees in total.

If you use a missile launcher, can you choose the ammo you use? Like i would use a frag missile so it would have no effect of the dread.

It doesn't say you can't, so normal rules apply.
So, yes, you can choose to fire the less effective weapon profile.

Thanks. So what is the general stand of the people in Dakka have on theruleslawyers post?

By the rules ,it is correct

You can only pivot towards the nearest visible unit *after* you have determined who that unit is - otherwise you may pivot away from them, if you pivot randomly. And the only time "v

Absolutely correct. Strangely, some people insist on ignoring the rules and playing by 4th ed rules (see nosferatu's example). I would be tempted to then ask if we will be allowing consolidation into new combats if we are using the 4th ed rules.

It does make a dread with a heavy weapon a tad more attractive choice.

jmurph wrote:Absolutely correct. Strangely, some people insist on ignoring the rules and playing by 4th ed rules (see nosferatu's example). I would be tempted to then ask if we will be allowing consolidation into new combats if we are using the 4th ed rules.

A slightly less confrontational way to put it would be to simply say that some people disagree with this interpretation, as it completely nerfs any walker with more than one weapon, and causes all sorts of issues with infantry LOS... but we probably don't need to have that argument all over again just yet.

Arguing for the dreadnought pivoting towards the closest target is nothing to do with 4th edition rules. It's purely down to differences of interpretation over how the LOS process works in this edition.

So, with a new FAQ around, we do know how LOS part works.
The question is, what about the other part of the trick (Fire Frenzed dread rotating in its Movement phase, which is not considered movement by rules)? If its legit (and I cant see any reason why it is not), we now officially have some control over choosing target for double shooting, aren't we?

Yup, applying the FAQ you will be able to maintain some control over your dread's shooting by pivoting in the movement phase.