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First thing first, I have absolutely no idea what I'm doing, I bought the North Africa book after watching several flames games this weekend (and demoing one of them).

I have narrowed it down to 2 of the Force Organizations (not sure if thats right wording or not). The German Parachute Rifle Company on page 43 and the Armor Motorized Infantry Company on page 58.

Can anyone give me a rundown of these two armies? I'm thinking of starting with a 1500 point army and then building from there.



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Well after spending the most of the afternoon reading the book here are the two lists i've come up with.

1500 Gepanzerte Panzergrenadierkompanie p58

Company HQ
70 - Company HQ

Combat Platoons
235 - Panzergrenadier Squads (3 squads, Panzerknacker)
235 - Panzergrenadier Squads (3 squads, Panzerknacker)

Weapons Platoon
180 - MG Platoon (2)
100 - 7.5cm leIG18 guns (2), 3 halftracks

Regimental Platoons
155 - Armored Flame-thrower Platoon (2)

Support Platoons
525 - StuH (3) all w/Schurzen side skirts

or

1500 Fallschirmajerkompanie p43

Company HQ
135 - Company HQ, Panzerknacker, Anti-tank Rifle Team, Sniper Team

Combat Platoons
210 - Fallschirmjager Squad (2), 2 Motercycles w/MG, Panzerknacker
210 - Fallschirmjager Squad (2), 2 Motercycles w/MG, Panzerknacker
210 - Fallschirmjager Squad (2), 2 Motercycles w/MG, Panzerknacker

Weapons Platoon
155 - MG Platoon, Panzerknacker
75 - Lt. Gun Platoon, Panzerknacker

Support Platoons
505 - Panzer Platoon (1 Panzer 3N, 1 Panzer 4H and 2 Panzer 3)

Be aware that your SdKfz Flamms cannot launch an assault nor counterattack if assaulted. That's a lot of points to drop on a unit that MUST get within assaulting distance to use it's weaponry. Also, the lelG18 cannot fire Smoke Bombardments, limiting their usefulness. Smoke is essential to blind ATGs and artillery from stopping your assault.

Your Fallschirmjagers lack full Combat Platoons, this can work against you for morale tests. My motto is to always take full CPs, unless its a specialist CP like Pioneers, Motorcyclists, etc. or if you're building a historically accurate list. Also, why only make each FJ platoon half equipped with Motorcycles? This list totally lacks smoke to help you in the offensive.

Be aware that, other then the StuHs & Panzers, both lists lack high Firepower weaponry, making it more difficult to remove entrenched opponents.
To some extent, the Flamms help your PG list with this, but they MUST move up with your assaulting units to be effective. A wily opponent in defense will attempt to KO them before they get close enough to use their flamethrowers.

Also personally, I'd start with a 1000pt list and build up from that. It's a good way to learn what works and what doesn't and games are quicker for the beginner.

I think i'm going to go with the Fallschirmajagerkompanie to be different form the other German players at my store.


1000 Fallschirmajerkompanie p43

Company HQ
135 - Company HQ, Panzerknacker, Anti-tank Rifle Team, Sniper Team

Combat Platoons
270 - Fallschirmjager Squad (3), Panzerknacker
270 - Fallschirmjager Squad (3), Panzerknacker

Weapons Platoon
75 - Lt. Gun Platoon, Panzerknacker

Support Platoons
245 - 7.5 cm PaK40 (3)

This any better?

Better but: drop the AT Rifle Team, between the PaK40s and recoiless you have more than enough AT firepower @ 1000pts. Also, the AT rifle lacks HE, making it useless against infantry. Drop the Sniper team, while fluffy, 50pts is a lot to spend on a standoff unit that is removed if assaulted. Drop Panzerknackers on HQ and Light gun team.

That gives you 80pts. Either spend that on an HMG platoon (to pin infantry) or an HQ mortar section (pin infantry, smoke bombardment).

Hope that helps. Avanti!

I agree. I think you'll find the mortors much more usefull. As an infantry company you'll find yourself on the defensive most of the time so smoke and the ability to pin is important.

1000 Fallschirmajerkompanie p43

Company HQ
145 - Company HQ, 8cm GW42 mortars (3)

Combat Platoons
270 - Fallschirmjager Squad (3), Panzerknacker
270 - Fallschirmjager Squad (3), Panzerknacker

Weapons Platoon
70 - Lt. Gun Platoon

Support Platoons
245 - 7.5 cm PaK40 (3)

Apparently the store plays at 1500 most games. So I was thinking about adding:

150 - MG Platoon
345 - Panzer III L or M (345)
5 - Panzernaker on the Co Hq


I also went back and redid my other list for 1500.
1500 Gepanzerte Panzergrenadierkompanie p58

Company HQ
75 - Company HQ, Panzernakcer

Combat Platoons
235 - Panzergrenadier Squads (3), Panzerknacker
235 - Panzergrenadier Squads (3), Panzerknacker

Weapons Platoon
250 - Armored Pioneers

Support Platoons
270 - Marauder III (3)
435 - Panzer IV F or G (3)


One more question - is anyone going to care if i went with the late box of Panzergrenadiers (instead of trying to find mid war ones or the right half track)? Would anyone be able to tell the difference?

Casper wrote:1000 Fallschirmajerkompanie p43

Company HQ
145 - Company HQ, 8cm GW42 mortars (3)

Combat Platoons
270 - Fallschirmjager Squad (3), Panzerknacker
270 - Fallschirmjager Squad (3), Panzerknacker

Weapons Platoon
70 - Lt. Gun Platoon

Support Platoons
245 - 7.5 cm PaK40 (3)

150 - MG Platoon
345 - Panzer III L or M (345)
5 - Panzernaker on the Co Hq

I'd consider adding a Hvy Mortar Platoon or FJ Artillery Battery for some high Firepower bombardment.

I also just realized you could take an FJ Tank Hunter Platoon of Marder IIs for the same price as the PaK40s. Consider that they're tracked, giving you added mobility, which is an asset in desert battles.

Apparently the store plays at 1500 most games.

I'll never understand this mentality - "At Store A, we ONLY play X pts games.". It's not conducive to bringing in new players, 1500pts is a lot for a newbie to remember...It's also limiting to the historical context of the game itself. The North African/Mideast theater was characterized by all sorts of levels of engagements, from skirmishes to tank battles to giant set piece battles like El Alamein. The armies didn't walk out unto the field and say "Well, we can both only field X amount of troops and materiel in this theater." It's rather silly to play like that./

I also went back and redid my other list for 1500.
1500 Gepanzerte Panzergrenadierkompanie p58

Company HQ
75 - Company HQ, Panzernakcer

Combat Platoons
235 - Panzergrenadier Squads (3), Panzerknacker
235 - Panzergrenadier Squads (3), Panzerknacker

Weapons Platoon
250 - Armored Pioneers

Support Platoons
270 - Marauder III (3)
435 - Panzer IV F or G (3)

To be frank, you have no long-range fire support to assist in an armored assault. While the Marders can assist in this task, they won't pin anything down or be able to lay smoke. As above, smoke bombardments are your best friend. Without them, you have to hope your opponent doesnt KO your SdKfzs before they get into assault distance, probably requiring an armored thrust with all available halftracks and tanks striking at once.

If you're taking Pioneers, it's essential you spend the extra 25pts for a Pioneer Supply vehicle so you can lay mines or wire. Do this to protect a vulnerable flank or to reinforce your long-range fire support (above).

One more question - is anyone going to care if i went with the late box of Panzergrenadiers (instead of trying to find mid war ones or the right half track)? Would anyone be able to tell the difference?

That really depends on the other players. If they're anal-retentive, it might be an issue. Mostly, I've never seen anyone have an issue with Late vs. EW/MW Grenadiers. Honestly, they kept the same type of uniform and equipment throughout WW2 and any of the minor changes that were made, wouldn't really stand out at 15mm. Also, only Afrika Korps fighting in the actual North African desert wore shorts and shirts. Germans fighting in Tunisia wore the standard uniform, due to the mountainous climate.

Also, some troops/vehicles can be used between different countries. For instance, I could easily use Grenadiers as Finnish Jalkavaki troops as the uniforms and equipment were so close and the grey color schemes were almost identical.

Also, consider posting your list(s) to the FOW forums on the BF site. They usually have really good advice.

I like the Fallschirmajerkompanie list better. And again I must agree heavy mortors are very effective. Good range and a decent fire power. Also in mid-war the marders are quite effective and can deal with most armor you come across. Just watch as they have a low armor value. Lastly don't forget these guys are fearless vets if I'm not mistaken so don't be afraid to be a bit aggresive with them.

Casper wrote:One more question - is anyone going to care if i went with the late box of Panzergrenadiers (instead of trying to find mid war ones or the right half track)? Would anyone be able to tell the difference?

This all depends on your group. Some are uber anal about having the exact right model. The group I usually play with is more concerned with the ability to recognize a unit on the table. For us as long as you transport halftracks look like transport halftracks we aren't too concerned if the model you are using has the right number of road wheels for the tracks...

In early ear I have been using my midwar/late war bren carriers as scout carriers and marmon herrington armored cars as CS9 armored cars. No one minds. The Marmon herringtons and CS9s are armed the same and look very similar anyway.

All depends on who you are playing with regularly...

Skriker

My club is the anal one...