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After having a short discussion, off-topic, in another thread, what really constitutes a Renegade Chapter? As an extension, do you believe The Black Templars are fully or close to being Renegade?

Black Templars are as far from renegade as you can get.
If you attack the Imperium or they actively hunt you, you are renegade.
SW and BT both use the codex as toilet paper but they aren't renegade.

To me, BT's could be considered renegade. (NOTE: Renegade/Rogue DOES NOT equal heretical/chaos/etc.)

They flout the size constraints of the Codex Astartes put in there in the aftermath of the Heresy, they have no clearly defined area to defend and basically just go wherever they want whenever they want and fight whatever they want and establish keeps wherever they please and fight whatever happens to take up residence if they come back regardless of what it is or how long has passed (IIRC in one of the Ravenor books it talks about an Inquisitorial citadel that was built upon a BT's old keep, and that there would be blood if they ever returned). Even their own codex states they verge on being rogue (p.9).

Most chapters are responsible for defending a certain area and duty bound to respond to requests for military intervention in that area and engage any major hostile elements they encounter, and only wars outside that area are "optional".

The Black Templars have no such duties. They are "Imperial" in name only practically, they hold allegiances to almost nothing and are watched over by no one, and the only thing that distinguishes them from a truly traitorous outfit is that they engage enemies whom they *believe* the Emperor would want them to engage (remember that the BT's interpretation of the Emperor's wishes, and his actual wishes, and those of the greater Imperial organizations and authorities, are not all the same thing), though it doesn't necessarily mean they are the ones the Imperium would want them to engage or need them to engage, while many they don't fight may be dire threats to the Imperium that they simply didn't feel like fighting.

Not all renegade chapters are declared Excommunicate Traitoris, the Badab War is an excellent example. Many chapters engaged in outright war against the Imperium and other Chapters, but only the Astral Claws were eventually declared Excommunicate Traitoris after flat out renouncing their oaths and allegiances to the Emperor.

It is difficult to believe that if called to account for their size by the Inquisition, should the Inquisition do so, that they would not go to war over it rather than peacefully split as per the dictates of the Codex Astartes that their Primarch agreed to in the aftermath of the Horus Heresy.

They could very definitely be considered renegade or rogue, though not necessarily heretical.



Criteria for a renegade chapter could vary. If called to account for a breach of the codex or a legitimate dictate of the High Lords and they would rather go to war than adhere to it, that's pretty renegade. If they have no clear responsiblities other than "fight the enemies of the emperor" and basically can go anywhere and do anything at any time and are actively resistant to any sort of restrictions/oversight/authority/etc that'd also generally qualify as rogue.

Renegade chapter would be the one that stops serving the Imperium and gone either rough or to Chaos.

BT are "renegades" in a manner that they do not respect codex astartes.

Also they are probably the loyalist chapter known to the Imperium beside Legion chapters and Grey Knight. They would never abandon Imperium.