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Manchu wrote: But the point is that PP, Malifaux, and Infinity (et alia) aren't really alternatives at all for some of us.

They ARE alternatives mate you may not like them today for a particular reason but on this little hobby called wargamming that we share the more years you have under your belt the more your tastes shift from a to b.
These games are like dormant virus and when you least espect your playing something you never liked before hehehe

For example I just started to having fun in a scale I never really liked 15mm and Im having a blast.

Manchu wrote:The list I'm getting together is for in-print games with rules and associated miniatures. So Brushfire would go on but Confrontation or AT-43 sadly would not. Neither would D&D or Star Wars minis, for that matter. Generic rulesets and miniatures lines don't make the cut, either.

Why not? I mean you with this cut are probably cutting some of the best miniatures and some of the best games... isnt alternatives what you are looking for?
Its like you only want alternatives that are a copy paste of GW biz model and thats rather castrating if you ask me.

For example theres rulesets that you can play with ANY miniature form ANY manufacturer and some manufacturers that make superb sculpts but have no game associated I dont understand why those are auto excluded from alternatives. PArt of fun of gamming is finding games and minis that can go togheter

I believe your still suffering from the GW syndrome that everything should be done inhouse but thats not the only way to look at things.
I'm going to be honest with you... You look like your still enchanted with GW as the only one, as such, why not stick with it? Seems pointless to force yourself into something your not really ready to do.

Manchu wrote:

NAVARRO wrote:I'm going to be honest with you... You look like your still enchanted with GW as the only one, as such, why not stick with it? Seems pointless to force yourself into something your not really ready to do.

I'm disappointed that you're replying without really following the thread closely. First, as I've stated multiple times, I'm not personally disenchanted with GW. I'm interested in new franchises for their own sake. The idea that PP's lines or any others could simply replace GW is ludicrous to me. But many people post as if that's the answer to GW's business practices. Second, the criteria I listed fit the discussion as it developed on page 1: i.e., the three parameters were rules, models, and fluff. You can't rate generic rules for models or generic minis for rules and fluff. I think we can't include OOP stuff, either, as getting into a discontinued game as a new player hoping to get your friends into it is, well, unlikely at best.

How can you be interested in rating new fresh options if your only stuck with the GW Biz model? Thats why I say your criteria/taste is someway hostage of GW and that you seem not trully commited in finding new things under a new fresh prespective... Thats why I say your porbably not ready to look into this seriously.
GW was probably the first to implement the "do it all and sell all " but before them and also after them theres a interesting scope of options that you can explore that dont follow this model.

Its like you want to rate/find alternatives based on what you already like and dont want to change... and in the process discard all that doesnt follow GW model.
Theres cool games, cool minis and cool fluff, sometimes all is blended in one banner, other times these companies establish partnerships and even if they only produce one thing, lets say rules other companies partner up with that system and produce minis... its all part of the wargamming scene and IMO you cannot get to a good wider result if you auto exclude a world of options just because its not how GW did it.
See my point?


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4M2A wrote:But that's the problem Manchu your trying to rate games by Gw criteria. Obviously nothing is going to equal it. However what GW does isn't the only way.

Exactly how I tried to post in my arcaic english, thanks

Im a fan of songs of blades and heroes (fantasy skirmish)... they have other several books (scifi, dungeons etc) and Im looking into Gruntz atm for my 15mm but I think Im going for another ganesda book for the scifi skirmish.

These "songs" books you dont have limits of minis manufacturer or even scale... yet some manufacturers develop minis just for those books... heres one... http://www.splinteredlightminis.com/druidschildren.html lots of 20mm for a song book....

Manchu a good example of how some models do escape the traditional formula as you mentioned is Historicals... but funny that even there the FOW copy paste GW formula also had a good sucess hey? Could you say its a accurate list if only FOW should be on this list discarding all other options?
But never mind mate I was just trying to hint that theres more to wargammes than the GW formula.
AS such:

How about

Alkemy and Helldorado? Both had some bumps down the road but they are getting there again.

-Sphere Wars http://www.spherewars.com/ you need to know spanish for this one, but lots of minis, rulebook and universe.

-Zenit miniatures http://zenitminiatures.com/blog/




Automatically Appended Next Post:
I seen you updated zenit as spanish only but mind that zenit has rules in english.

Another one:

-Warcanto http://www.dwarftales.com/articles/10

Just remembered another one from Tales of war miniatures... Ron and Bones ( skirmish with cards pirates game) http://www.taleofwar.com/shop/cms.php?id_cms=6