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Hey Dakka!

So I have been testing various lists lately, and find myself looking back at my Dark Eldar. I decided to alter my existing Pirate Kabal list (http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/364715.page) and possibly give it some more oomph in the melee threat department. Here's the first iteration:

2000pt Dark Eldar 5th Ed (2010) Roster


* HQ (230pts)

* Duke Sliscus the Serpent (150pts)

* Haemonculus (80pts)
Haemonculus
- Crucible of Malediction, Liquifier Gun

* Elites (567pts)

* Kabalite Trueborn (173pts)
4x Trueborn
- 4x Blaster
Venom
- Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Trueborn (173pts)
4x Trueborn
- 4x Blaster
Venom
- Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Trueborn (221pts)
Raider
- Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow
8x Trueborn
- 6x Shardcarbine, 2x Splinter Cannon

* Troops (858pts)

* Kabalite Warriors (135pts)
- Blaster, 5x Warriors
Raider
- Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow

* Kabalite Warriors (125pts)
- Blaster, 5x Warriors
Venom
- Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Warriors (125pts)
- Blaster, 5x Warriors
Venom
- Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Warriors (125pts)
- Blaster, 5x Warriors
Venom
- Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Warriors (135pts)
- Blaster, 5x Warriors
Raider
- Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow

* Wyches (213pts)
Hekatrix
- Agoniser
Raider
- Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow
9x Wyches
- 9x Haywire grenades

* Heavy Support (345pts)

* Ravager (115pts)
- Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield

* Ravager (115pts)
- Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield

* Ravager (115pts)
- Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield

=

With the combat drug rerolls from Duke and the PT from the Haemonculus, the Wyches can be pretty beastly from the get-go, possibly starting the game with Furious Charge and FNP. Baron goes with the TB poison squad giving them 26 3+ poison shots with the effective range of 24" safely from their Raider (not for long usually though). The rest is pretty self-explanatory.

=

This next list changes it up a bit, loses a troop choice, but gains a lot from the Baron + the Beastpack:

2000pt Dark Eldar 5th Ed (2010) Roster

* HQ (255pts)

* Baron Sathonyx (105pts)

* Duke Sliscus the Serpent (150pts)

* Elites (557pts)

* Kabalite Trueborn (173pts)
4x Trueborn
- 4x Blaster
Venom
- Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Trueborn (173pts)
4x Trueborn
- 4x Blaster
Venom
- Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Trueborn (211pts)
Raider
- Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow
8x Trueborn
- 8x Shardcarbine

* Troops (645pts)

* Kabalite Warriors (135pts)
- Blaster, 5x Warriors
Raider
- Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow

* Kabalite Warriors (125pts)
- Blaster, 5x Warriors
Venom
- Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Warriors (125pts)
- Blaster, 5x Warriors
Venom
- Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Warriors (125pts)
- Blaster, 5x Warriors
Venom
- Splinter Cannon

* Kabalite Warriors (135pts)
- Blaster, 5x Warriors
Raider
- Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow

* Fast Attack (198pts)

* Beast Masters (198pts)
Beast Pack
- Beastmaster
Razorwing Flock
- 2x Razorwings
Beast Pack
- Beastmaster
Razorwing Flock
- 2x Razorwings
Beast Pack
- Beastmaster
Razorwing Flock
- 2x Razorwings
Beast Pack
- Beastmaster
Khymeras Pack
- 5x Khymeras

* Heavy Support (345pts)

* Ravager (115pts)
- Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield

* Ravager (115pts)
- Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield

* Ravager (115pts)
- Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield

=

Baron goes with the Beasts to provide them with Stealth. Duke goes with the TB of course. I gain the +1 to my roll to get first turn which is great for a list with so much Darklight Weaponry (25 if I counted correctly). As I mentioned, I lose a troop choice, but I gain a very durable, fast, and deadly unit to possibly draw fire away from my fragile transports, and threaten multiple targets on the board.

There was a third possibility I considered, and that was a unit of 6x RJB with 2x Heat Lances. They are quite expensive, but do benefit from the Duke's drug rerolls, and are another extremely fast threat to my enemy's vehicles, and not too shabby at all for anti-infantry (I could only fit in grav talons with my points, so they'd cause pinning checks each time they swoop over infantry - which is nice, but not as good as a cluster caltrops I don't think. I guess it depends)


Let me know what you all think!

Erudog wrote:Hey Dakka!

Hey Euro!

* Duke Sliscus the Serpent (150pts)

* Haemonculus (80pts)
Haemonculus
- Crucible of Malediction, Liquifier Gun

Both of these HQ setups is fine, though I may mumble about them as I look at the rest of the list.

* Kabalite Trueborn (173pts)
4x Trueborn
- 4x Blaster
Venom
- Splinter Cannon

No complaints with Trueblasters.

* Kabalite Trueborn (221pts)
Raider
- Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow
8x Trueborn
- 6x Shardcarbine, 2x Splinter Cannon

This is where the Duke is going, it's a nice little spread, though I'll note I've become a fan of having him hop ship and go join a Wych Raider on Turn 1, as after the needed deployment for the boost, he really is a h2h IC and isn't helping the Trueborn much. A random thought to consider.

* Kabalite Warriors (135pts)
- Blaster, 5x Warriors
Raider
- Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow

I like the Shock Prow in the mix, though depending how much h2h 'oomph' you're adding you'll potentially be competing for targets. Still - they're priceless for laughs vs. Necrons.
Ah, you're taking like five of these guys. Never mind about the competing thought.

* Wyches (213pts)
Hekatrix
- Agoniser
Raider
- Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow
9x Wyches
- 9x Haywire grenades

Hmmmm...1 h2h unit option...I really don't feel the oomph at all. You're practically wasting Sliscus' drug power to the point I'm wondering why he's needed in the army. Seems like you might as well stick to Venom spam at this stage for your anti-infantry.
The loadout itself is pretty solid, no complaints, though I think only a single unit of Wyches is more likely to get itself into trouble than it is to really knock stuff out. I often assault in with 2 units of Wyches on a single foe in order to push my thongs over the edge. Once they assault they will really be out there all alone, and you could accomplish what they're doing with massed Venom fire anyway. I don't 'get it'. I think the unit is well built, I think it is poorly conceptualized within the army.

* Ravager (115pts)
- Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield

Ravtastic

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
List 2
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

* Beast Masters (198pts)
Beast Pack
- Beastmaster
Razorwing Flock
- 2x Razorwings
Beast Pack
- Beastmaster
Razorwing Flock
- 2x Razorwings
Beast Pack
- Beastmaster
Razorwing Flock
- 2x Razorwings
Beast Pack
- Beastmaster
Khymeras Pack
- 5x Khymeras

That might be one of the most annoying ways to have to read a Beastmaster pack ever.
I think this unit probably works a little better than the Wyches just insomuch as they're less likely to sprint too far ahead and get into trouble they cannot extract themselves from. You could also run this unit as an effective countercharge or speedbump unit to your otherwise gunline force since it is tough enough to lurk on a battlefield and absorb fire "safely" for a while.
I do think this second list really weakens the value of the Duke to the point I'm not sure it's worth fielding him, and I'd probably play with the list accordingly.

Overall I think the 2nd list is better, and has the type of oomph I think you're looking for, which is likely countercharge, not initial charge.

I think the RJBs are a weak idea for anti-tank and a terrible idea if you want h2h power in the army.

Regards,
Thor.

Agrizzled with everything Thor mentioned. You know, just to be a turd, I may put a hammy in the beast pack for the pain token and laughs. You could start him in the beast pack, separate and join the wyche unit to get up close and use that crucible. As usual, I don't think Sliscus with worth what you're paying for him and what he's giving you. I know your love of Deep Striking, but we've seen it get obliterated pretty rapidly by SW cheesegasm. Hmmm. . .I need to learn to read better. There's no hammy in list two. . .hmmmmm. . .I would chuck the Duke like a rancid diaper and stick with the baron. Think about how large that beast squad could become with those extra points. It would be glorious. Just kit everything else out like normal. And swap the Dukes TB unit for another with 4 blasters and what not. Just some half conscious thoughts. . .hmmmm . . .yesssss. . . sleepy.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Still take a hammy for the beasts though, you know, just saying. . .

Thanks for the comments guys - as always very helpful.

Yeah....sorry about the crappy list format. I was in a rush at work and just built the list on a builder real quick and just exported the text. Didn't have time to format it nicely.

I guess my downfall is that I really want to use Duke and create a "fluffy" list if possible. I really like the idea of a mixed list with Duke giving his poison shots out, as well as dishing out his combat drugs efficiently. I guess that would work best with a half Kabal/half wych list. I'll see if I can brew one up and get your opinions.

And just DSing isn't why I use Duke to be honest, I just see that as an extra perk. I don't think there's many instances at all where i'd benefit from DSing.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
HQ

Duke Sliscus the Serpent (150pts)
* Haemonculus - Liquifier Gun, Shattershard (75pts)
* Haemonculus - Crucible of Malediction, Liquifier Gun (80pts)


Elites

7x Kabalite Trueborn; 5x Shardcarbine, 2x Splinter Cannon (204pts)
* Raider - Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow

4x Kabalite Trueborn; 4x Blaster (173pts)
* Venom - Dual Splinter Cannons

4x Kabalite Trueborn; 4x Blaster (173pts)
* Venom - Dual Splinter Cannons


Troops

5x Kabalite Warriors; Blaster (125pts)
* Venom - Dual Splinter Cannons

5x Kabalite Warriors; Blaster (125pts)
* Venom - Dual Splinter Cannons

5x Kabalite Warriors; Blaster (135pts)
* Raider - Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow

9x Wyches; Hekatrix w/ Agonizer, Haywire Grenades (213pts)
* Raider - Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow

8x Wyches; Hekatrix w/ Agonizer, Haywire Grenades (201pts)
* Raider - Dark Lance, Flickerfield, Shock Prow


Heavy Support

Ravager - Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield (115pts)

Ravager - Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield (115pts)

Ravager - Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Dark Lance, Flickerfield (115pts)


So here's what I came up with. As I said before, my goal is to definitely use Duke to his fullest potential. Another alternative I considered (though a dismal one), was to ditch the Haemonculi and Wyches and pick up some Hellions. They would benefit from the drugs, Baron would give the alpha strike a better shot, though the Hellions will be an expensive unit that's quite fragile. I can see them having their purposes though...but I'd be giving up 2 DL weapons in favor of them...I'm not sure that's very beneficial. Plus the potential for the Wyches to screw with some vehicles with the grenades.

I also just considered making all the troop choices take Raiders, and just using 2 Venoms. My logic for this is that I have a pretty nasty anti-infantry unit in the poison TB. I'm not sure it's a good idea though...4 Venoms and 4 Raiders seems nice and symmetrical so I went with that