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Lords
Tyrant (Armor of Silvered Steel, Talisman of Preservation, Mawseeker, Greatweapon, 2 Sword Gnoblars, 1 Luck Gnoblar) 329 pts
Slaughtermaster (Bloodcleaver, Channeling Staff, Wyrdstone Necklace, ironcurse icon) 285 pts

Heroes
BSB Bruiser (Mawseeker, Talisman of Endurance, CLS, HA) 207 pts
Butcher (Grut's Sickle) 165 pts

Core
13 bulls(Ironfists, Bellower, LA) 530 pts
14 Bulls(Ironfists, Bellower, LA) 570 pts
20 Gnoblars(groinbiter) 42 pts
20 Gnoblars (groinbiter) 42 pts

Special
Scraplauncher 165 pts
Scraplauncher 165 pts

2500 pts total

Hi i play ogres my self and was just thinking then, maybe drop the butcher for more bulls to fill your two units to a horde, maybe one unit og gnoblars if points are needed? do you need a unit of gnoblars for every scrap launcher? i dont have the book handy


Automatically Appended Next Post:
youd only need 9 more bulls to fill the units.

sadly, this is every bull I own.

I hope to get some more sometime, but for now I am stuck with 27.



and I certaintly wouldn't drop a butcher for more bulls. whats the point if you don't have gutmagic to cast on them(1 caster isn't sufficient for proper GM. you need at least 2, 3 is even better)

Lordjig6 wrote:do you need a unit of gnoblars for every scrap launcher?

Well you need 1 unit of gnoblars (fighters or trappers) for each scrap launcher, and 1 unit of bulls for each unit of gnoblars.

What do you think of the Tyrant?

its a new build I thought up. best protection we can get on a tyrant. 2+ armor, 4+ ward, and T6 to boot. Great Weapon gives killing power.

I really like this list

I Like the list simple, yet seemingly effective. However if it were mine I would drop some bulls and take a unit of ironguts

My problem with IGs is this,


they share the same effectivness as equal numbers of Bulls against T3 5+ armor troops. the difference is that with the cost, you get more bulls. more ablative wounds so you can keep fighting longer.


the Ironguts only improve in effectivness against T6 troops, or troops with better armor saves.


and even then, ogre clubs are usually sufficient to reduce an armor save to where it becomes practically meaningless. High armor save troops tend to be few in number so ever failed save is a significant loss. ogre clubs reduce a Chaos warriors mighty 3+ save to a pathetic 5+, then a 6+ ward(unless Tzeench) if they don't have shields then its even worse.


I can choose not to use the Ironfist to be able to give a -2 to armor. or i can go for 6+ armor and a 6+ ward or +1A(only 1st rank)

Options are good.

point taken

I actually faced a Night Goblin army.



Got a 203 point victory.


he had 2 large Squig Herds, 1 horde of 50 bowmen, 3 units of 20 spearmen, mangler squig, a doomdiver, and a rock lobba. he also had 3 bosses with various equipment and 3 lvl2s.


he ended up killing my BSB, one unit of Bulls, both Gnoblar units and 1 scraplauncher.


He almost killed one bull unit with Curse of the Bad Moon, but 2 ogres survived and the Butchers made their LoS.


the other bull unit took about 9 fanatics to the face, but it was the mangler squig which finished the unit off. the BSB took a direct hit from the Lobba.

the Tyrant then killed the Doomdiver out by himself. the Butchers(in the other bull unit) took out the Lobba.

the 3 spearmen units were killed(one by a horrible flee reaction in which they were caught) and the others were killed with clubbin.



it was the Dawn Attack scenerio which really screwed his deployment. both Squig herds were on a flank and kept squabbling. they managed to kill a gnoblar unit on turn 5

Your paying 43 pts per Bull, and Irongut is only 5 points more. And they have one better leadership and come static with -3 Armor Save.

Where as with the Bull you have to choose do I want -2 armor and a 6+ arm no ward, a -1 armor and 5+/6++, or a -1 armor with +1 attack. I will agree its nice to be able to pick and choose but with Ironguts you always get -3 armor 5+ and Ogres are pretty slow, so ASL isn't to bad.

But I agree both have uses but Ironguts arent all bad.

that 5 points adds up. then you factor in the Magic banner cost.



my bulls are running with the General so the Ld difference is moot.




Bulls are that much more efficient with their points cost and Ogres in particular need to stay efficient. we can't afford to have anything even remotly subpar.


that and -3 armor is rarely needed. like my game today, nothing with even so much as a 4+ armor.


Dwarves are mostly 5+ armor with a couple elite units having better.

Warriors of Chaos are reduced to poor armor saves by our standard Bulls. the IGs remove the armor almost completely, but they are fewer in number and can't take casualities like bulls can. 5+ armor is only good againmst Str3 attacks, and the sources of those attacks are targets that the IGs will kill no faster then bulls(slower as the bulls have numbers)

I guess its just a personal difference but I will always take a unit of Ironguts for that extra punch they offer.

Mind me asking why you take groin biters? Also why are you not taking Tricksters Helm on your Tyrant....its an annoying build and while he does not become a tincan I think he becomes even 'arder

Why not take Groinbiters?


i had 4 points left and nothing else to spend it on. besides, there is always the chance for a Temple of Skulls




I normally run the Trickster's Helm, Mawseeker, Healing Potion, CLS, and HA, but wanted to try out a Tincan build.

ironguts wound anything T4 or less on 2's and barring certain undead units i cant think of anything a bull strikes before anyway...

i see ironguts as a nice supporting unit - no more than 6 of them - just to add a bit of punch to a charge.

its not the -3 to saves that i get bothered by, its the wounding on 2's = twice as many wounds against T4! as well as being better against knights and such (never put bulls near chaos knights - doesnt go well for the bulls!!)


plus with Ld8 they can leave the general and still be half reliable


not saying they are a must have, just that they are very useful against tougher opponents.

the problem is the trade off in numbers.

you can have more bulls then IGs and the front rank(with IFs) can have 1 more attack.


you can also buff them with Bullgorger.



and I can think of 1 more army that goes after bulls, Lizardmen with I1 baby!!!

its all preference. i always liked cracking open knights on 2's.

but dont get me wrong, bulls are awesome!!!

Grey Templar wrote:and I can think of 1 more army that goes after bulls, Lizardmen with I1 baby!!!

not worried about saurus warriors. temple guard are WS4, str5 and I2